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Spethah · **04-22-2015, 02:34 AM**

u gaiz r scurry

In all seriousness for me, an outsider, you guys do scare me away from the forums. To be honest the only reason why I got on here at first was just to find an linkshell or an FC and get involved with RPing in-game. Now I just lurk around and make comments that get ignored, not that I mind it of course. I don't feel welcome. The aggression and passive aggression is what keeps me away the most out of everything. I want to ask questions, but I'm afraid it's going to turn into a giant shit storm of people angrily "debating" over something that isn't what I asked. I also feel ignored, probably along with other new folk as well, when we contribute or ask something in a thread that's almost turned into a circle jerk.Â

You guys are probably nice people, but I just don't see it. All I see is the 2scurry5me.

OttoVann · **04-22-2015, 02:36 AM**

(04-21-2015, 11:09 PM)Merri Wrote: K'nahli more or less hit the nail on the head, but, I figure some things bear repeating. It's easy enough to say, but, it really makes a difference if you take a second to re-read what you've wrote a few times before posting. If it's a subject that's important to you, something you're passionate about, take the time to choose your words carefully.

Fucking this right here. And heres the thing, a lot of people can say this and someone might casually read it over and thats that. Really read that part, because at least for me, I tend to at least marginally look over shit before I post it in my RP while im in game. This is commonly given advice, and rarely do people listen to it. You dont need to constantly read your stuff over and over again, but just at least look at it.

How many people here will post ridiculously snarky shit but maybe regret it, however they posted it now and its a matter of public record so they just stick with it?

It doesnt take much to reread a post, and if you dont change a word thats fine. Just look it over a little at least

Fox · **04-22-2015, 02:41 AM**

(04-22-2015, 02:34 AM)Septha Wrote: u gaiz r scurry

In all seriousness for me, an outsider, you guys do scare me away from the forums. To be honest the only reason why I got on here at first was just to find an linkshell or an FC and get involved with RPing in-game. Now I just lurk around and make comments that get ignored, not that I mind it of course. I don't feel welcome. The aggression and passive aggression is what keeps me away the most out of everything. I want to ask questions, but I'm afraid it's going to turn into a giant shit storm of people angrily "debating" over something that isn't what I asked. I also feel ignored, probably along with other new folk as well, when we contribute or ask something in a thread that's almost turned into a circle jerk.Â

You guys are probably nice people, but I just don't see it. All I see is the 2scurry5me.

Even as someone returning from a hiatus things are intimidating for me, so I understand. But I do see this often from people off site, even when I ran my old guild in XIV I had people say "They're so intimidating, how do you deal with it?" So I can see how new people are probably feeling even more lost and scared off by ah... Big personalities.

***Maril*** · **04-22-2015, 02:59 AM**

(04-21-2015, 11:09 PM)Faye Wrote:
(04-21-2015, 11:03 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: Then there's the 'fun' threads which again feel very frigid. Certain posters who are quite obviously not starved for role-play will rush in to drive the discussion towards how awesome it was that they role-played with someone they interact with frequently and this often risks leading the discussion away from new or lesser known role-players who happen to post in the same threads.

Perhaps it isn't intentional but it's food for thought if nothing else.

This. I've noticed that a lot of the nice happy-feely, let's-all-compliment-each-other threads on here are (and please excuse the crass language--there's really no better term) one big circlejerk where the OP's close friends and frequent role-play partners chime in to fawn over each other and anyone else who tries to join is brushed aside, only to be acknowledge if their own friends jump into the fray just to offer them a response. It's really off-putting for any role-players who are new, less active, or simply not a part of the clique in question.

Sorry but I feel this is a bit eh. Not the case? At least for me. I've posted in the compliment thread a bunch of times, and I actually mean the compliments I give out despite the fact that I have not had any interaction with the people there beyond in that very thread - with the exception of a few people. I get that it seems circlejerky, but I do believe it was created in good intention and perhaps even to serve as something fun in the midst of a lot of negativity (It reminds me a bit of this one anti-bullying experiment a school did where you have to sit in a circle and give eachother a massage, the idea being that if you do that you'll eventually not feel that someone is odd and pickonable. It's also a frequent topic on just about any forum board I've been on :3). I heavily heavily doubt that anyone is posting in that thread to be mean to others and exclude someone, and honestly if people go about not posting in it because they assume it's just for a select few people.. Well that certainly isn't going to help? It just helps create a problem that (as I see it) isn't really there. At least I can say for myself that if someone new to the thread posts I will compliment them, maybe even for jumping into it because jumping into anything new takes sometimes takes braveheart-like courage.Â

I really appreciate the banpersonaboveme/compliment/givethepersonaboveaskill/etc threads, they're fun and not serious and shows another side to the posters. Well, and then they add to your post count, which is a motivation for some because pretty little numbers going up is something most people like.

Cato · **04-22-2015, 03:28 AM**

I suppose it's as simple as people not wanting to feel left out on an ongoing basis. I can sympathise with that since I'll openly admit to feeling that way myself at times. I'll see an interesting thread, post an in-depth response and then...nothing.

Nobody is obligated to respond, of course, but it is frustrating when there's a situation of 'X posts their latest artwork of their character and gets dozens of responses whilst Y posts their latest artwork and nobody even comments in passing.'

It's not always a case of jealousy either - people just like feeling like they're part of the community they're residing in.

Rosamund · **04-22-2015, 04:36 AM**

(04-21-2015, 06:59 PM)Nailah Wrote: And those who aren't avoiding the site because of it's reputation, are not using it because when you first come here it really seems like a site for NA people only - which is obviously because my fc is an EU one and that. Heck when I came here myself I was confused about that too in the start. But that's #justeupeoplestuff.Â

Yeah, it does a bit. I love the European Directory you've done but I didn't even know it existed for a long time. Could just be me failing to notice things as usual but that's why I jump up to link it whenever I see a new EU player post in the Welcome Desk. I don't want people to give up on Balmung because they're not aware of the EU community here. Sad

Cato · **04-22-2015, 04:44 AM**

(04-22-2015, 04:36 AM)Inarah Wrote:
(04-21-2015, 06:59 PM)Nailah Wrote: And those who aren't avoiding the site because of it's reputation, are not using it because when you first come here it really seems like a site for NA people only - which is obviously because my fc is an EU one and that. Heck when I came here myself I was confused about that too in the start. But that's #justeupeoplestuff.Â

Yeah, it does a bit. I love the European Directory you've done but I didn't even know it existed for a long time. Could just be me failing to notice things as usual but that's why I jump up to link it whenever I see a new EU player post in the Welcome Desk. I don't want people to give up on Balmung because they're not aware of the EU community here.

I get the feeling there's actually a lot of European players on Balmung but many are hidden away. It makes it difficult to organise stuff - especially when it comes to raiding groups and in-depth events.

Not to mention the fact that quite a few European players end up adhering more to an American schedule than a European one and end up missing EU prime-time fairly frequently as a result. I'm guilty of that. :p

Parvacake · **04-22-2015, 04:45 AM**

Final thought I'll add for the evening before I slip off to dream land: I think we should start listening to the new people more about the 'feeling ignored' vibe they keep getting. I know many people do and I try my best myself, but it seems to also meld in part with the toxicity/passive aggression/negative vibe already currently being addressed.

At first I wondered if people it was just people who weren't engaging out there enough. Then when the number of people I saw talk about it broke into the double digits it was much more of a "Hmmm" thing.

Nebbs · **04-22-2015, 04:49 AM**

Seven pages since OP, no way I can process all that. So in general ..

Just be inclusive, help new folks, and embrace differance as positive.

Reply positively to someone you don't really know each day.

If you can't say anything good.. try to say nothing.

Give your opinion don't belittle others opinions.

It is really a symptom of growth and time, I have seen this happen many times. Accept we will form different tribes ... Let's just not go to war.

***Maril*** · **04-22-2015, 04:53 AM**

(04-22-2015, 04:44 AM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote:
(04-22-2015, 04:36 AM)Inarah Wrote:
(04-21-2015, 06:59 PM)Nailah Wrote: And those who aren't avoiding the site because of it's reputation, are not using it because when you first come here it really seems like a site for NA people only - which is obviously because my fc is an EU one and that. Heck when I came here myself I was confused about that too in the start. But that's #justeupeoplestuff.Â

Yeah, it does a bit. I love the European Directory you've done but I didn't even know it existed for a long time. Could just be me failing to notice things as usual but that's why I jump up to link it whenever I see a new EU player post in the Welcome Desk. I don't want people to give up on Balmung because they're not aware of the EU community here.

I get the feeling there's actually a lot of European players on Balmung but many are hidden away. It makes it difficult to organise stuff - especially when it comes to raiding groups and in-depth events.

Not to mention the fact that quite a few European players end up adhering more to an American schedule than a European one and end up missing EU prime-time fairly frequently as a result. I'm guilty of that. :p

This is one of the reasons why I kind of liked it back when there was a front page to the site here because it made it just a little easier to twig that it was for everyone. Now it's just basically a forum page and you have to click around a bit to get a description of the RPC, which is not always great.

Something that's on my secret wish list for the site is to have a time-zone bit out under the avatar that people can fill in just like they can fill in their character name. I know you can click on their profiles to see local time but, it would just be a bit easier if it was visible on the posts (Especially in Making Connections) - Not just because I want to identify other EU'ers but also because when it comes to the US of A, some timezones like EST are more workable for my schedule than say, PST.

But you're absolutely right, there's a whole heap of EU RP'ers hiding out there. Certainly far more than just the ones hanging around in the EU linkshell.

Cato · **04-22-2015, 04:58 AM**

(04-22-2015, 04:53 AM)Nailah Wrote:
(04-22-2015, 04:44 AM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote:
(04-22-2015, 04:36 AM)Inarah Wrote:
(04-21-2015, 06:59 PM)Nailah Wrote: And those who aren't avoiding the site because of it's reputation, are not using it because when you first come here it really seems like a site for NA people only - which is obviously because my fc is an EU one and that. Heck when I came here myself I was confused about that too in the start. But that's #justeupeoplestuff.Â

Yeah, it does a bit. I love the European Directory you've done but I didn't even know it existed for a long time. Could just be me failing to notice things as usual but that's why I jump up to link it whenever I see a new EU player post in the Welcome Desk. I don't want people to give up on Balmung because they're not aware of the EU community here.

I get the feeling there's actually a lot of European players on Balmung but many are hidden away. It makes it difficult to organise stuff - especially when it comes to raiding groups and in-depth events.

Not to mention the fact that quite a few European players end up adhering more to an American schedule than a European one and end up missing EU prime-time fairly frequently as a result. I'm guilty of that. :p

This is one of the reasons why I kind of liked it back when there was a front page to the site here because it made it just a little easier to twig that it was for everyone. Now it's just basically a forum page and you have to click around a bit to get a description of the RPC, which is not always great.

Something that's on my secret wish list for the site is to have a time-zone bit out under the avatar that people can fill in just like they can fill in their character name. I know you can click on their profiles to see local time but, it would just be a bit easier if it was visible on the posts (Especially in Making Connections) - Not just because I want to identify other EU'ers but also because when it comes to the US of A, some timezones like EST are more workable for my schedule than say, PST.

But you're absolutely right, there's a whole heap of EU RP'ers hiding out there. Certainly far more than just the ones hanging around in the EU linkshell.

That's a really great idea - definitely something worth posting in the site suggestions thread!

Rosamund · **04-22-2015, 05:06 AM**

(04-22-2015, 04:44 AM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: I get the feeling there's actually a lot of European players on Balmung but many are hidden away. It makes it difficult to organise stuff - especially when it comes to raiding groups and in-depth events.

I've had several people now approach me in game because I have "EU RPer" in my search info and they wanted to know if there's an EU RP community here. I always say yes, definitely! And because we're not tied to just NA or just EU, there's usually RP going on somewhere at all hours of the day and night. That's one of the great things about Balmung. On the downside, it takes a bit of digging if you're a new EU player and want to know if there's RP going on that isn't starting at 1 am your time.

(04-22-2015, 04:53 AM)Nailah Wrote: Something that's on my secret wish list for the site is to have a time-zone bit out under the avatar that people can fill in just like they can fill in their character name. I know you can click on their profiles to see local time but, it would just be a bit easier if it was visible on the posts (Especially in Making Connections) - Not just because I want to identify other EU'ers but also because when it comes to the US of A, some timezones like EST are more workable for my schedule than say, PST.

I love this idea! I will admit to stalking profiles to check out their time zone (I'm just trying to be helpful...) so I can point them in the right direction but this would make it a lot easier. I'd also like it if it was more straightforward to filter events, linkshells and FCs down to relevant time zones but I don't know if that's feasible.

Edvyn · **04-22-2015, 05:47 AM**

THE TOXICITY

OF OUR CITY

OF OUR CIIIIIIITY

[youtube]64FrYGRrKVY[/youtube]

ive seen the toxic buzzword thrown around a lot, in pretty much every rp community ive ever been in. often directed towards me. what the hell does it actually mean, though?

malicious? immoral? rude? contrarian? sarcastic? does toxic just mean what we want it to mean?

from my own experience, roleplayists are generally horrid at detecting whether someone is attacking their words or them personally. granted, the two are often intertwined, but this is not always the case.

summarizing a post (i.e. cutting past the unnecessary words to get straight to the point) is a useful way to figure out what's actually being said. if it really just says "what you said there was wrong", it's probably not an attack against you, and the person who said it probably doesn't hate you. they just don't think that what you said was correct, and have taken it upon themselves to tell you.Â

i, for one, hate nobody here. even people ive said nasty or snarky things to. everyone on the RPC is fun and worthwhile in their own way. Cool

if you detect hostility in someone, consider the following:

maybe they're having a bad day

maybe they've misinterpreted what you've said and gotten offended

maybe they're joking around

maybe they're just fucking with you!

the possibility someone genuinely doesn't like you and is out to get you is really, really slim. even among the pettiest internet dwellers, co-ordinating to run people out of a community is too much work for too little reward. even if people really hated people here, it simply wouldn't be practical to waste time with relentless personal attacks.Â

in other words, if someone seems hostile, they're probably that way because they honestly disagree with what you're saying. just as they want to piss you off, you've probably already pissed them off. roleplayists are pretty easy to piss off, and do/say pretty stupid things when they're grumpy. this is where i think the toxicity comes from. angry roleplayists saying angry things. it's not even an attitude, they're just angry for whatever reason. can't really help people being angry about things.

in conclusion, i should only post when sober. thankyou for reading my rambling bullshit Cool

Fox · **04-22-2015, 06:24 AM**

(04-22-2015, 05:47 AM)Edvyn Wrote: can't really help people being angry about things.

Sorry I cut so much out of your reply, but I honestly did read all of it. Though I think this last bit sums up quite a bit of it.Â

No, can't help people being angry- but there are things that can be done to curb being angry. And some of that is not to wield it as a weapon. There's a difference between being angry and taking it out on someone because 'they've had a bad day', no one should be really promoting "I've had a bad day". As honestly we all have a lot going on in our lives. This is supposed to be not stressful. Many people come to the RPC and play FFXIV to get away from a lot of it. What I'm trying to get at is; it's okay to be stressed! But don't use it as a reason to treat other's badly.

There's a difference between actually debating something and berating someone as well. Which I have seen. Not to say Person A or Person B is in the right or wrong. However, saying that "maybe they're just fucking around" or "they've had a bad day" kind of waters the situation down.Â

I can't help but echo some of what the mods have said, and others too- people should probably be a little more mindful and just re-read what they're posting. I have to do that as well before I post something I'm passionate about.Â

So in the end of it all I think it all does come down to tolerance and being more mindful on both parts. I've seen this sort of thing happen pretty heavily in guilds; and let's face it RPC isn't the biggest rp community so in a way it's like a very large guild. It's a big group of awesome nerds wanting to do awesome nerd things. There will be disagreements and debates.Â

It's a thin gray line to tred. I've seen in guilds where "So and so is being so hostile!" and then the other party saying "Yeah well so and so is too damn sensitive!". I think in this case there will be people who will believe the above. But like all things; it has to be done in moderation. Drink too much? Man you're going to have a bad day the next morning.Â

Same can be said about being too snarky or taking things too sensitively.Â

In the end I think a lot of it is this; people need to realize there is a situation and figure out how to fix it. Mod team is working very hard, I commend them. But it does take members as well. So being a little less sensitive and a little less hostile will go a long way I think.Â

Like others have said as well, it does come off very unwelcoming to new folks. And I'm a semi-old-hat here and it makes me a bit uncomfortable. So basically, okay I'm rambling now; but- its best to be mindful on both sides of the matter.

I hope that made sense! And I'm sorry if I may have upset anyone by saying it, it's not my intention.

Oscare · **04-22-2015, 06:44 AM**

If 'popularity' (which to me if you go out and find RP, you'll get it. Simple equation) contests are breeding aggressio, Â then thus is another example deviating from 'all aggression comes from disagreements'.Â

Another point I'd like to bring up is tolerance, which is an important ingredient if we all want to get along (which the cold truth is that there can never be true peace, people will always find something they dislike... but this is why tolerance becomes more importan) . If you find something you don't like at all? It really just grinds your gears?

Accept it as an ideal and an ideal only against your values as opposed to a weapon.

A lot of times we feel like we're endangered by the majority. And so what if you are? You're going to sit there and argue for all the wrong reasons?Â

Of course, if someone says something that is just blatantly wrong, then there's reason to argue, without the need to be angry.

Tolerance breeds acceptance, which breeds peace. If you're offended, think about why, then reevaluate. If you're angry over an opinion, there's no reason to. If the other party refuses to listen, stop wasting your time.

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Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately?

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