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(12-14-2015, 05:50 PM)Oli! Wrote:That does not mean that they are not free to speculate and draw their own conclusion, but I still see warnings that imply largely being ignored if they do so. When the same thing keeps happening whenever someone asks the same question, it does have bearing on the matter at hand. Just because you personally, I, and some others mentioned the nefarious method does not mean that people did not completely ignore it being a thing.Â(12-14-2015, 05:34 PM)Yssen Wrote: But the current frame work of the lore, even as it applies to this exact question, is all based on speculation. Despite that, we have people cherry picking their answers to support their point of view. Barely anyone has touched on the "nefarious" method (which we admittedly do not have details about) as being possible. How is denying the methods existence, when it came straight from Koji-Fox's mouth at a panel over a year old, not willful ignornace? We cannot have a full conversation on what is possible and what falls with in the boundaries of lore when we are cherry picking arguments based on the same amount of speculation as everyone else. The polite warnings of what is and is not lore acceptable, all come from the same, cherry picked, speculative argument. That is bad on it's face, to say nothing of the judgements against those that have a differing opinion. That is more than half of what I see here, and that is really really sad. We deny what could be possible (and is possible, based on the same amount of speculation), sack story potential, and deny creativity based on the idea that the hats are green or yellow. It will probably turn out that that hats are actually red, in the end.
This would probably not bother me near as much, if people did not use the same speculation and lore diligence in some of the examples I mentioned above to come to a conclusion. They got shame, shade, venom, and such all heaped on them with out a lick of apology or "whoops i was wrong."
To my knowledge, no one was "cherry-picking," and no one failed to acknowledge the presence of said method in their argument; I even did so in one of my posts.
However, our lack of information on it, compounded with its lack of presence within the game at this time, mean that very little can be done with it in this regard.
Personal viewpoints on how people have handled being wrong in the past, additionally, have no bearing on the actual argument of living and operating within present lore. The OP asked their question specifically within what we definitively know, by their own choosing. As a result, we can only give an answer within what we definitively know. Doing otherwise would be a disservice to them and their question.
Further, it is a disservice to warn someone against a course of action when the reasons basis for coming to that conclusion are just as speculative as the ones for it. You seem to not quite understand exactly what I am talking about here, so I will clarify. I am for the building up of what is possible, and potentially good story/RP. Not the outright denial of the possible in favor of what is simply popularly held speculation and best guess. Just because more people believe a thing, does not make it true, or the dissenting opinion untrue. I argue that since we must accept that we do not know everything. That sense all we can do is give popular speculation and best guesses, our definition on what must is or is not possible must be "does it make good story/RP for one to do so." Denying it on the basis of "that is the lore" cannot be done, simply because none of us know (or agree) on what any of that is 100%. To do otherwise is to simply become a venomous echo chamber, which is something we have all seen happen over and over. Yar.