I apologize for the inline quoting...
Personally, I would rather not have some person who, by virtue of being a popular character, now has authority over mine IC because a vote said so. I would also prefer not to have a person be able to say, "I'm the only one who can beat Ifrit!" because a vote said so. Under what authority do these players have this power?
More importantly, this is not inclusive -- it's by definition exclusionary. Anyone who doesn't hew to these votes loses the ability to RP with that portion of the community. Anyone who doesn't want to accede to that authority to dictate storyline loses access to RP. Conversely, offering story threads to people in a central location is inclusionary, as it allows people to decide whether they want to participate or not as they see fit.
But it has nothing to do with godmoding (although I'd argue that attempting to enforce a fanon storyline is in a way a form of godmoding, but that's another discussion altogether). It has everything to do with the lack of authority of players to tell other players what the "fanon" story is, and the lack of authority of them to control any form of overarching plot.
This is only necessary if you want this sort of overarching plot. I don't, because it's inconsiderate to me, to new players, to players not in the RPC, to players not present for the vote, to players who aren't the "popular kids" and unlikely to be voted into one of these positions, and to the devs, whose story is now marginalized in favor of a player-created construct.
These are the exact same issues you have with player-run towns, for example... and those often end for the same reasons.
Oh, of course!
I'm not meaning to shut down discussion -- I sure don't have any authority to do that. I've just seen these sorts of things implode (repeatedly!) in the past, and so I'm sharing my concerns and opinions forged over, well, quite a few times of seeing these exclude, marginalize, and defeat players -- and in the meantime, ignite a drama fireball between those who want this sort of authority and those who refuse to recognize it.
Ultimately, I look at it from the other side. Imagine you're a new player and you come into the game. You start RPing and you find out that Kylin (no offense to him, he's just a well-known name ) rules Ul'dah as it's Minister of Coin, and you can't ICly fight Primals because the Blades of Nald'thal already killed them all. You can't take any form of IC leadership because all the positions were already voted in. You can't do content IC because it's all already been done. How do you RP a great warrior? How this inclusive to you or your concept? You can't vote on it because all the votes were already done. Let's say a new vote comes up. You pitch your concept, and it's good, but because you're a new player, no one wants to vote for you. Instead, they'd rather vote for Ashren Snow (and, no offense intended, he's just a well-known name ), because he's a known quantity in the community and they just like him better. How is this fair?
So, I see it as amazing -- for those who are in power of it! Those who aren't are marginalized and excluded, and it's being done on a grand scale. If an FC or LS wants to do this in their own internal plot, that's fine: no one else has to recognize it, and if I don't like it, I can always leave that group. If the community as a whole does it, though, my only option is to leave the server or the game entirely. I can't support an idea like that.
(09-01-2013, 02:51 PM)Knahli Wrote: But this only affects people that WANT to be the protagonist. Just assuming and playing by such standards is already potentially stepping on the RP of every single person they meet who may have played to a different chronicle whereas if we can all gather together to unify under a single set of leaders(and leaders can change and die and be promoted/demoted/move etc) we are promoting more consistency and inclusion to as many people as possible and having influence on their stories both directly and indirectly.
Personally, I would rather not have some person who, by virtue of being a popular character, now has authority over mine IC because a vote said so. I would also prefer not to have a person be able to say, "I'm the only one who can beat Ifrit!" because a vote said so. Under what authority do these players have this power?
More importantly, this is not inclusive -- it's by definition exclusionary. Anyone who doesn't hew to these votes loses the ability to RP with that portion of the community. Anyone who doesn't want to accede to that authority to dictate storyline loses access to RP. Conversely, offering story threads to people in a central location is inclusionary, as it allows people to decide whether they want to participate or not as they see fit.
(09-01-2013, 02:51 PM)Knahli Wrote: I'm sure most of us can rise above this though. No-one wants god modders or ultimate players who can dictate everything we do or do not do. Our characters have free will and I only suggested such "elite" players to play leadership roles or perhaps suit in to meld with any future lore that cannot be attributed to many people and where a "scapegoat" for lack of a better word is needed.
But it has nothing to do with godmoding (although I'd argue that attempting to enforce a fanon storyline is in a way a form of godmoding, but that's another discussion altogether). It has everything to do with the lack of authority of players to tell other players what the "fanon" story is, and the lack of authority of them to control any form of overarching plot.
(09-01-2013, 02:51 PM)Knahli Wrote: The fact of the matter is that some people need to play the leadership role, someone that members of grand companies or volunteering adventurers/mercenaries can look to otherwise everything will be in disarray and everyone will assume responsibility and cause IC or OOC arguments. Not the good kind I might add. Disarray is nice but it can't be there all of the time because no-one is a leader on the battlefield or elsewhere.
This is only necessary if you want this sort of overarching plot. I don't, because it's inconsiderate to me, to new players, to players not in the RPC, to players not present for the vote, to players who aren't the "popular kids" and unlikely to be voted into one of these positions, and to the devs, whose story is now marginalized in favor of a player-created construct.
These are the exact same issues you have with player-run towns, for example... and those often end for the same reasons.
(09-01-2013, 02:51 PM)Knahli Wrote: While this is probably the safest option I'd still like to know what everyone else thinks. Unless many people can come here and give valid reasons why this would interfere with their RP styles or stories personally then I think we should remain open to the possibility of having a more managed and sophisticated setup. Sure it might take a little work, but imagine how amazing it would be to have an absolute structure where everyone played a role to varying degrees.
No-one would dictate who does what, every positioned is volunteered to and voted on by us.
Oh, of course!
I'm not meaning to shut down discussion -- I sure don't have any authority to do that. I've just seen these sorts of things implode (repeatedly!) in the past, and so I'm sharing my concerns and opinions forged over, well, quite a few times of seeing these exclude, marginalize, and defeat players -- and in the meantime, ignite a drama fireball between those who want this sort of authority and those who refuse to recognize it.Ultimately, I look at it from the other side. Imagine you're a new player and you come into the game. You start RPing and you find out that Kylin (no offense to him, he's just a well-known name
) rules Ul'dah as it's Minister of Coin, and you can't ICly fight Primals because the Blades of Nald'thal already killed them all. You can't take any form of IC leadership because all the positions were already voted in. You can't do content IC because it's all already been done. How do you RP a great warrior? How this inclusive to you or your concept? You can't vote on it because all the votes were already done. Let's say a new vote comes up. You pitch your concept, and it's good, but because you're a new player, no one wants to vote for you. Instead, they'd rather vote for Ashren Snow (and, no offense intended, he's just a well-known name ), because he's a known quantity in the community and they just like him better. How is this fair?So, I see it as amazing -- for those who are in power of it! Those who aren't are marginalized and excluded, and it's being done on a grand scale. If an FC or LS wants to do this in their own internal plot, that's fine: no one else has to recognize it, and if I don't like it, I can always leave that group. If the community as a whole does it, though, my only option is to leave the server or the game entirely. I can't support an idea like that.
The Freelance Wizard
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((about me | about L'yhta Mahre | L'yhta's desk | about Mysterium, the Ivory Tower: a heavy RP society of mages))
Quality RP at low, low prices!
((about me | about L'yhta Mahre | L'yhta's desk | about Mysterium, the Ivory Tower: a heavy RP society of mages))
