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Sylentmana · **11-06-2015, 11:09 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:07 AM)Berrod Armstrong Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
I'm really disappointed in this response.

I'm disappointed in your disappointment of my response.

Hammersmith · **11-06-2015, 11:10 AM**

(11-06-2015, 10:45 AM)Vitamin C Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 10:37 AM)Askier Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 02:21 AM)PkThunda Wrote: It is because of this that I have to speak up and let people know that some language in regards to sex-work is not okay...

(11-06-2015, 10:20 AM)Hammersmith Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 09:48 AM)Askier Wrote: Holy Snip Batman

I'm guessing you and Flynt didn't actually read the OP, since they explicitly say they don't want to stop using or restrict usage of the words, or force a OMG THE PC POLICE WILL CENSOR US, especially in an RP context.

They just to bring an awareness of how the words sit in a cultural context both in RP and RL usage and the impact usage of such word carries, consciously and unconsciously in the same contexts we've constructed around them. Â They're shitty words used in shitty contexts to make people feel shitty. Â The reasons behind their entrenchment into our language are complicated, historical, and terrible and frankly we'd be better off without them in the same way we've ditched racial and homo/transphobic slurs that also used to be commonplace in a 'Well call a spade a spade because that's what it is' way of thinking.

You and I disagree and I'm fine with that. That line there though, where the OP says its not okay is indicating, to me at least, a cause for concern.Â Why isn't it okay?Â Whom gets to determines which words are okay and not?Â If a word hurts someone's feelings, why should we get rid of it?Â If you get called "Four-eyes- and it hurts your feelings, does that mean we need to ban the words -four- and eyes- to make sure the insult can never happen again?

Look, you can sit there and insult me, and Flynt, (NOW there's someone I never thought I be paired with, lulz), but that won't change my view point.Â I don't care how people live their life.Â I want everyone to be able to live their live as they desire. Do what they enjoyÂ Love who they love.Â But I do not agree with you that we should ditch all these words.Â

If you censor a word, you actually GIVE it power because its taboo and that, ironically, is counter-productive. Its like the Unforgivable Curses in Harry Potter.Â The mere fact they are "unforgivable" makes them even more menacing and ominous on top of the evil they can do.Â You take away the taboo of something, you remove a TON of its power.Â By exposing people to something, you actually lessen the power of the word because people aren't SHOCKED you used it, but rather can hear the word, process it, and can make a rational reply.

You might be taking Hammer's reply out of context, because he's not insulting you nor Flynt. I can understand how the vernacular might indicate that and perhaps he was exaggerating the posts made in a satirical manner to get his point across.

Needless to say, there ARE some words that should be ditched in favor of political correctness or atleast used in the contexts they were intended, like F*ggot, which to my understanding is just sticks bundled together. While the logic that using a word more often makes it less taboo sounds alright on paper, if I walked around labeling everything because I think it's okay, then I'm going to get stabbed. Culturally, and in modern society, we can't control what offends people but we should control how we offend people. Self restraint, basically.Â

Most people don't like the concept, but it's the same as saying, "Hey, I'm going to keep saying rape even if it triggers you because you should learn to restrain your feelings on my liberal use of it."

Sickity has the right of it. Â Not Using a word for Valid Reasons is no where near the same as say: Banning Tom Sawyer or 1984 from being read.

It's you not being an asshole by using shitty word choice in a shitty context. Â The words are still there, the words can still be used. Â Just with the understanding that there's a time and a place and Casual Use is not that time or place because these words carry too much weight to just be casually used for lulz PC is Bad M'Kay reasons.

Vitamin C · **11-06-2015, 11:14 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:06 AM)Askier Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 10:45 AM)Vitamin C Wrote: -Condensed to save space-

You make a point to act like an asshole, you risk being stabbed. But my point is that, an individual should have the right to BE an asshole. And, if the words of their mouth get the ever living tar kicked outta them,tough. That's a result of their actions.

I suppose I do heavily agree with this, as I'm in no position to disagree given my other posts in this community. I've lost many friends because they simply don't agree with what me and other individuals say/do, and that's fine. Everyone reserves their right to be insulted, and everyone reserves their right to not be sensitive and just walk away from the dog shit on the floor.Â

Everyone deserves their right to shitpost and hurt feelings as much as they deserve the right to be offended by it. Freedom of expression is a beautiful thing, and it's a shame when others let writing get under their skin, even if it's not intended to and for them. I know many that are browsing this thread right now whom have changed because they just can't take a joke or because people actually were assholes. I guess this is what inspires people to be labeled as "ebil troles" or "toxic", when as you can just as easily disregard their opinion as easily as they can disregard yours.

Live and let live.

Edit: In the end, I think it's a matter of restraining your judgment of being mean. As it was stated, there's a time and place for everything. Being a dick for the lulz doesn't excuse being a dick to be mean because they have the right of free speech. There are consequences to words, and there are obvious implications that a word should be censored as to not hurt an individual or group of them to atleast show you're a decent human being. Being asked to stop a behavior is different from being demanded/oppressed to result in doing so, as well. The thread is just to create awareness on the regard.

-no longer matters- · **11-06-2015, 11:16 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.

In a lot of ancient times Prostitutes were something to be admired, every man and woman wanted them. they were literally the models of bygone era's but if you could afford them you could have them.

Gladiator's were even sex workers, a lot of them were sold by their masters to wealthy merchants and noble families for nights of pleasure after the Gladiator had won over a crowd.

To be real honest, there's no reason to snub sex workers unless you are clinging to antiquated moralities pressed upon people to try to stop infidelity.

So yes because of today's standards they may be looked down on by moral high horsers or people that are very insecure. But I personally have no issues with sex workers. They are people just like me and you, and really aren't hurting anyone.. if anything they're helping out some lonely souls.

Kaiz · **11-06-2015, 11:19 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.

Legality is not a very strong metric for morality. Sex trade used to be a very common and generally-respected vocation.

SicketySix · **11-06-2015, 11:20 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:16 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
In a lot of ancient times Prostitutes were something to be admired, every man and woman wanted them. they were literally the models of bygone era's but if you could afford them you could have them.

Gladiator's were even sex workers, a lot of them were sold by their masters to wealthy merchants and noble families for nights of pleasure after the Gladiator had won over a crowd.

To be real honest, there's no reason to snub sex workers unless you are clinging to antiquated moralities pressed upon people to try to stop infidelity.

So yes because of today's standards they may be looked down on by moral high horsers or people that are very insecure. But I personally have no issues with sex workers. They are people just like me and you, and really aren't hurting anyone.. if anything they're helping out some lonely souls.

(11-06-2015, 11:19 AM)Kaiz Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
Legality is not a very strong metric for morality. Sex trade used to be a very common and generally-respected vocation.

So was slavery, shall we venture into those waters?

FreyaDeerheart · **11-06-2015, 11:21 AM**

I have no problems with this post existing, on the whole I'm inquisitive and I like to learn - so to hear your opinions is interesting to me, and there are things to learn there.

But, you kind of lost my support when you said "It is, however, not your say in which words should and should not be accepted."

Because, while your post is informative, it's still just your opinion. I'm not sure why you've given yourself the power to decide what's acceptable, and tell everyone else they can't do the same thing.Â

It may be a cultural thing, but in the UK the term prostitute is widely used - and this includes the use by sex workers themselves. So to try and tell me I can't use a word that is both socially acceptable and correct is wrong.

ProvaDiServo · **11-06-2015, 11:24 AM**

*Shrugs*

I see nothing wrong with the word prostitute.

Ho's is Ho's, So I won't blame tammy.

-no longer matters- · **11-06-2015, 11:30 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:20 AM)SicketySix Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:16 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
In a lot of ancient times Prostitutes were something to be admired, every man and woman wanted them. they were literally the models of bygone era's but if you could afford them you could have them.

Gladiator's were even sex workers, a lot of them were sold by their masters to wealthy merchants and noble families for nights of pleasure after the Gladiator had won over a crowd.

To be real honest, there's no reason to snub sex workers unless you are clinging to antiquated moralities pressed upon people to try to stop infidelity.

So yes because of today's standards they may be looked down on by moral high horsers or people that are very insecure. But I personally have no issues with sex workers. They are people just like me and you, and really aren't hurting anyone.. if anything they're helping out some lonely souls.

(11-06-2015, 11:19 AM)Kaiz Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
Legality is not a very strong metric for morality. Sex trade used to be a very common and generally-respected vocation.

So was slavery, shall we venture into those waters?

That's apples and oranges. Sex workers a lot of them do it voluntaryÂ
(Yes I am aware of the sex trafficking rings were people are abducted into them, but that is not the focus of this topic before you try to twist it to that.)

Porn Stars for example, there's a lot of them that love what they do -love- it. In some circles they even hold celebrity status. Are you telling me you look down on them and you've never watched porn (I'm calling you a liar right now if you try to deny ever having watched any.)
What harm are they causing? I bet you damn well appreciated they made those films at the time you used them.

Manari · **11-06-2015, 11:31 AM**

I can respect the OP for being proud of their profession despite the way it has been viewed in society. I can understand the desire to educate people on something that they very likely don't have any experience with.

However, I have noticed the OP in other threads trying to force their opinion on people as if it were fact. And here they are doing it again. Personally, I don't mind not using a word I rarely say anyway if I know ahead of time that it can offend people. But the way the OP presents their case is a little abrasive and is going to (and clearly has) caused a rather large pushback. I would reconsider your approach to the subject in the future.

Sylentmana · **11-06-2015, 11:33 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:16 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
In a lot of ancient times Prostitutes were something to be admired, every man and woman wanted them. they were literally the models of bygone era's but if you could afford them you could have them.

Gladiator's were even sex workers, a lot of them were sold by their masters to wealthy merchants and noble families for nights of pleasure after the Gladiator had won over a crowd.

To be real honest, there's no reason to snub sex workers unless you are clinging to antiquated moralities pressed upon people to try to stop infidelity.

So yes because of today's standards they may be looked down on by moral high horsers or people that are very insecure. But I personally have no issues with sex workers. They are people just like me and you, and really aren't hurting anyone.. if anything they're helping out some lonely souls.

You speak of antiquated morals yet use ancient examples of morality? I don't make my arguments because I believe in Christian morals. I make them based on law and how humanity in general views the activity today. How prostitution was viewed in ancient cultures is irrelevant to the present.

As prostitution is an illegal act, it is deserving of no more respect than thieving. I'm not arguing that it's okay to harm prostitutes. Even as criminals, they deserve at least basic human rights. However, respect is earned, not given. Just because one demands respect, does not mean they have some inherent right to it.

Vitamin C · **11-06-2015, 11:35 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:30 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:20 AM)SicketySix Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:16 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: snib
snib

(11-06-2015, 11:19 AM)Kaiz Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: snib
Legality is not a very strong metric for morality. Sex trade used to be a very common and generally-respected vocation.

So was slavery, shall we venture into those waters?
That's apples and oranges. Sex workers a lot of them do it voluntaryÂ
(Yes I am aware of the sex trafficking rings were people are abducted into them, but that is not the focus of this topic before you try to twist it to that.)

Porn Stars for example, there's a lot of them that love what they do -love- it. In some circles they even hold celebrity status. Are you telling me you look down on them and you've never watched porn (I'm calling you a liar right now if you try to deny ever having watched any.)
What harm are they causing? I bet you damn well appreciated they made those films at the time you used them.

I think an issue with bringing up Porn Stars is that they are doing their work legally and are doing it with a sense of self-respect, whereas Prostitution is illegal by modern standards and nowhere in the same league, since those pornographers aren't subjecting themselves to abuse, junkies, criminals, whatever it is to get by in their profession.Â

It's kind of like comparing drug dealers to Medicinal Marijuana vendors. There's a clear line behind what's morally acceptable and what isn't. As a culture, we're often blinded to the hardships that those in those situations face, so in no way should they be seen as lesser people for it. However, it's kind of absurd to compare them by the same standards of relatively safer and widely accepted alternatives in regards to morales.

-no longer matters- · **11-06-2015, 11:36 AM**

(11-06-2015, 11:33 AM)Sylentmana Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:16 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-06-2015, 11:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I don't understand why every fringe group that exists believes that its entitled to special treatment or consideration. With a few exceptions, prostitution is largely an illegal practice. As with other illegal activities, it is not deserving of respect.

Even in places where it is legal, its still going to be looked down on as the general view is that the prostitute is selling their personal dignity as a human for coin. It's not something to be admired.
In a lot of ancient times Prostitutes were something to be admired, every man and woman wanted them. they were literally the models of bygone era's but if you could afford them you could have them.

Gladiator's were even sex workers, a lot of them were sold by their masters to wealthy merchants and noble families for nights of pleasure after the Gladiator had won over a crowd.

To be real honest, there's no reason to snub sex workers unless you are clinging to antiquated moralities pressed upon people to try to stop infidelity.

So yes because of today's standards they may be looked down on by moral high horsers or people that are very insecure. But I personally have no issues with sex workers. They are people just like me and you, and really aren't hurting anyone.. if anything they're helping out some lonely souls.

You speak of antiquated morals yet use ancient examples of morality? I don't make my arguments because I believe in Christian morals. I make them based on law and how humanity in general views the activity today. How prostitution was viewed in ancient cultures is irrelevant to the present.

As prostitution is an illegal act, it is deserving of no more respect than thieving. I'm not arguing that it's okay to harm prostitutes. Even as criminals, they deserve at least basic human rights. However, respect is earned, not given. Just because one demands respect, does not mean they have some inherent right to it.

That may not be the case for much longer there is a huge movement to have it legalized. If that happens what then?

Also there are parts of the world all over where it Â -IS NOT- Illegal.

*edit* Even in the U.S. - There are parts of Nevada where is is quite legal.

Cato · **11-06-2015, 11:54 AM**

Even if it is made legal there's going to be a lot of people who aren't comfortable with it for various reasons. It could be due to their own experiences or it could be because they don't want to cross paths with some of the negative baggage and risks that come with the line of work. It could even be due to their religious beliefs.
Should basic respect be shown to those who happen to be in the trade itself? I'd like to think the answer is 'yes'. I don't believe, however, that people should be forced to accept it and never, ever pass judgement.

I don't particularly like the culture that surrounds alcohol. I grew up with an abusive father and saw what the substance did to him. Situations where people consume alcohol with the intent to get drunk make me uncomfortable. I wouldn't demand that they don't drink it - but that doesn't mean I'm not going to distance myself from that sort of crowd. Many people are in the same boat when it comes to 'sex-workers' - they aren't comfortable with it and don't want to get involved with it.

Sylentmana · **11-06-2015, 12:08 PM**

(11-06-2015, 11:36 AM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote: That may not be the case for much longer there is a huge movement to have it legalized. If that happens what then?

Also there are parts of the world all over where it Â -IS NOT- Illegal.

*edit* Even in the U.S. - There are parts of Nevada where is is quite legal.

In regards to the legality of it, I acknowledged that there were some places where it is legal in a previous post. As for the push to legalize prostitution, it's not exactly winning. The majority still says no against its legalization. These are just some results I found with a quick google search.

http://prostitution.procon.org/view.reso...eID=000121

https://today.yougov.com/news/2012/03/23...stitution/

As for the "what then" part of your question, I'll cross that bridge if I ever come to it.

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Sex-work and Harmful Language

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