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Nebbs · **12-30-2014, 12:33 PM**

(12-30-2014, 12:25 PM)Sounsyy Wrote: So I've been running ST a bit lately (gods knows why) and I usually go in as WAR cuz fun. Now in most cases, if one of the other two tanks is almost equally geared or better than myself, I'll let them MT everything and just go deeps war, provided they don't do something stupid. But sometimes I go in and the other two tanks only have Relic Zeniths and mayyyyybe i90-i100 gear on, and in those instances I usually MT to avoid hassle. But it never fails that one of those Zenith tanks is going to attempt (and fail) to voke the boss, trash, whatever off of me every time it comes off cooldown for the entire run of ST.

It's cute the first time, it's not every 40s. If you have to use voke to catch up to me every time it's off cooldown... you probably aren't going to win the tank fight, just sayin. You're really just unnecessarily spinning the mob to cleave dps during the 1 second it takes me to get hate back with heavy swing. Please go do your OT duties and pick up the trash that's killing your party.

I got this so much and as a well geared PLD I knew if there were any WAR there likely they would just do this all through ST, some PLD also did this. In the end I just put Sword Oath on and chilled and let the other two play aggro ping pong.

Add to that the DRG who has to run in and pull the boss/mobs, and it is a wonderful place to be.

Warren Castille · **12-30-2014, 12:35 PM**

(12-30-2014, 12:25 PM)Sounsyy Wrote: So I've been running ST a bit lately (gods knows why) and I usually go in as WAR cuz fun. Now in most cases, if one of the other two tanks is almost equally geared or better than myself, I'll let them MT everything and just go deeps war, provided they don't do something stupid. But sometimes I go in and the other two tanks only have Relic Zeniths and mayyyyybe i90-i100 gear on, and in those instances I usually MT to avoid hassle. But it never fails that one of those Zenith tanks is going to attempt (and fail) to voke the boss, trash, whatever off of me every time it comes off cooldown for the entire run of ST.

It's cute the first time, it's not every 40s. If you have to use voke to catch up to me every time it's off cooldown... you probably aren't going to win the tank fight, just sayin. You're really just unnecessarily spinning the mob to cleave dps during the 1 second it takes me to get hate back with heavy swing. Please go do your OT duties and pick up the trash that's killing your party.

Same song, different verse.

If you're better geared than I am, stop losing hate to Sword Oath. Similarly, if you're in ShielDefiance and still losing hate to Sword Oath... Just let it happen, man. Provoking makes mobs spin and standing on me "just in case" means healers have to heal extra cleaves.

Aside: If you're a melee stop eating Coloratura from Amon. I mean, it's funny to see Dragoons die to it (every time, and will never be not funny) but it's sad to know all those Chaos Thrusts that aren't landing. Sad

Aaron · **12-30-2014, 12:52 PM**

When you run a instance over 10000 times for a drop that never actually drops frequently.Â

Finally get the drop, roll need, and get a 1.

- when I convert something high ilvl and get a useless 4 level materia

- When im tanking something like Ifrit Ex and the OT stays trying to pull hate off me. If im obviously getting aggro why the he'll are you trying to top me?

- bitchy rpers, not necessarily happens to me but still. I'm sure everyone has those people who hold grudges/dislike you for no apparent reason other than something stupid.Â

-when I run out of rested bonus. My bar was blue from 1 - 50 as I leveled Rogue. 1 - 25 as I leveled both ACN & WAR.

NOW!? it doesn't look the same T_T

And lastly, I hate it when in dungeons, you always get that one smartass player who tries to put down everyone. I remember I was in Ifrit and someone early pulled so I couldn't grab aggro for like half a second as I was preparing. I hear this smartass healer tell me.

"Sword Oath, stupid ass."

". . . . . . . . " *is in Shield Oath to hold hate*.

Next person beat me to it and told the healer to just stfu.

We had a beautiful moment.

Parvacake · **12-30-2014, 12:58 PM**

Dat moment when you had a bad run in with someone that ends with them being blocked, then months later they go out of their way to message you just to ask if you want to play DA with them.

...

*facepalms and sighs*

I don't even play Dragon Age.

Eva · **12-30-2014, 01:18 PM**

I have been playing on DRG a bit more often lately (WHM main but I enjoy changing things up sometimes) and have discovered that I have this weird quirk in Qarn where it annoys me on the first boss when someone tags the body part that gets the purple glow thing. This made sense during the first week after the patch but my knee-jerk mental reaction is, "I'm not blind...." I realize it doesn't harm anything but the past few times someone tagged it I just started changing the marker from 1 to X to O to square to triangle just to be a goober while meleeing it down and avoiding AoE and all that. XD If someone tags it on the first time I'll usually tag it first on the 2nd and 3rd. I'm a dingbat like that though. XD

Biggest pet-peeve overall lately in DF groups is when a DPS or healer nags the tank about the speed of pulls. Regardless of which job I'm on, I usually put enough faith in the tank to recognize the potency of the DPS in the group, the capability of the healer, and adjust pulls accordingly. If a tank is pulling slow when a group can clearly handle more, I assume there's a good reason for it (may be new to the job, have gotten equipment while on other jobs, learning the ropes, etc.).

The only other thing I can think of that really pissed me off was getting ejected from a Tam-Tara HM run back right after 2.3. I was 4/5 on the Divine Harvest set which I was going to glamour and the halfgloves or boots (don't even remember which) dropped and I lotted Need before the Bard said, "Hey can I have those?" Apparently 2-3 of the others were together and not happy that I Needed on it. I explained I had lotted Need before she asked, apologized, and explained I was using it for a glamour set, but apparently they thought that was worth kicking me. First time that's ever happened and hasn't happened since. I still completed the glamour set so I wasn't too shook up about it, but I was pressed for time that day and was late to work or something cuz I had never filed a report before that. XD People can be such turds sometimes...

Kage · **12-30-2014, 01:23 PM**

Tanks.

Who are not me.

Who are not my friends.

Why do I run into such tanks that...

YOU PULL MORE THAN 4 ENEMIES AND NOT USE AOE GENERATING THREAT/ENMITY?! WHY DO YOU... WHY.... How do you not expect me to not flare?!

Stahp.

Also, fuck the adds and stay on Maddison when he's shooting people. I can't fucking cast faster than I already am. I don't like dying to 8 stacks of hurt.

Dimona · **12-30-2014, 01:47 PM**

(12-30-2014, 01:23 PM)Kage Wrote: Also, fuck the adds and stay on Maddison when he's shooting people. I can't fucking cast faster than I already am. I don't like dying to 8 stacks of hurt.

^ ^ ^ ^ SO MUCH OF THIS ^ ^ ^ ^

I ran Qarn HM last night and the tank asked me why I kept switching mobs. Â I'm a Ninja. Â It's my only job and I like to think I'm pretty good at it. Â When I'm paired with black mages (particularly those who happily spam their AoE abilities) I like to distribute my damage evenly on the mobs. Â This means AoE's sometimes myself, and other times it means if one mob has more HP I'm usually targeting that one to bring it down rather than killing off the low-HP mobs.Â I assume the black mage appreciates this since his AoE is hitting more marks and things are collectively dying faster - the caveat may be that they're living longer and collectively damaging the tank more requiring more healing, but I tend to think this is offset by the fights being shorter overall.Â Maybe I am in the wrong though.Â I never really gave it a lot of thought.Â I just wanted things to die as efficiently as possible.Â When I'm paired up with a DRG or MNK I tend to focus more on taking down the monsters one at a time.Â I try to adapt to whatever makes the other DPS shine more.

For some reason this really upset a tank in my EX roulette last night, and he was asking why I kept switching mobs.Â He said I was taking hate (what???) and I don't like trying to explain things WHILE I'm in the middle of DPSing, so I just quickly said that it was so that the BLM AoE could be more effective. Â He said this didn't make sense. Â I got two commendations after the run, so I guess it made sense to the black mage and healer. Â Dodgy

On the scorpion in Sastasha HM if nobody communicates to me otherwise, I'm going to try and stun Tail Screw. Â Don't get mad at me for it. Â Half the time the tank is stunned anyway from that tethery move and I look to it as my responsibility. Â I think it's goofy when a tank tries to push the tether onto me too, but I've only seen that once or twice. Â I think it's goofy when someone gets pissed at me for building its resistance to stun too.

I don't like it when people don't say "hello" at the start or "thanks" at the end of runs too.Â Teamwork!Â Politeness!Â Manners!Â We're gonna get through this together!!!

Gegenji · **12-30-2014, 01:52 PM**

(12-30-2014, 01:47 PM)Dimona Wrote: I don't like it when people don't say "hello" at the start or "thanks" at the end of runs too.Â Teamwork!Â Politeness!Â Manners!Â We're gonna get through this together!!!

I might've gone a little far the other way on this one yesterday evening, I was on my "main," Gogonji and rouletted into Haukke NM whilest leveling WAR. Was asked if we could do a full clear and I said okay and proceeded to plow through everything. It was a great group and we had fun.

At the end, as we're beating up the Ahriman to open the boss room I was... inspired.

"As we come to the final boss, we'd like to thank you for joining the Go Go Gogon No Muss, No Fuss High Speed Rush. Remember to thank your healers, and we'll be finishing this dungeon shortly and with extreme prejudice."

We... then proceeded to plaster the final boss so badly that we actually got both Candles and the final pack all at once. I, uh, guess we were pushing a little TOO fast. Blush

Kage · **12-30-2014, 01:57 PM**

Sounds like a great Haukke.

This is not meant to diss what your AOL strat is but as a BLM I will say that I use the highest HP mob to "target" so that I don't have issues with a mob.dying while casting...

I definitely prefer a melee to stun than a tank trying to get dps stunned. Less dps up time...

Nebbs · **12-30-2014, 02:05 PM**

(12-30-2014, 01:18 PM)Eva Wrote: ...
Biggest pet-peeve overall lately in DF groups is when a DPS or healer nags the tank about the speed of pulls. Â Regardless of which job I'm on, I usually put enough faith in the tank to recognize the potency of the DPS in the group, the capability of the healer, and adjust pulls accordingly. Â If a tank is pulling slow when a group can clearly handle more, I assume there's a good reason for it (may be new to the job, have gotten equipment while on other jobs, learning the ropes, etc.).
...

Normally (as tank) I find it is the BLM who asks me for this, I then check with the Healer. Otherwise I generally take a view on the mix and gear of the party. A wipe due to over pulling costs more time than just taking it easy..

Dimona · **12-30-2014, 02:21 PM**

(12-30-2014, 01:57 PM)Kage Wrote: This is not meant to diss what your AOL strat is but as a BLM I will say that I use the highest HP mob to "target" so that I don't have issues with a mob.dying while casting...

I'm not sure what AOL stands for here as you are using it. From context I'm assuming mob selection priority. I think that's only really a problem when all the monsters are at low HP. I should probably talk to a black mage in more length about how best to compliment that style. I have been working on assumptions made, but haven't taken into account that spells might be negated mid-cast if the high HP mob winds up dying. I seem to get paired up with black mages a lot, and roulettes usually go by quickly and painlessly so I think I'm doing something right.

I just think last night's roulette was goofy with the tank getting upset by that. I'm not certain I took hate. I do occasionally from lesser-geared/skilled tanks where I'm focusing down a trash mob, but they die quickly and Perfect Dodge and stun and Second Wind are good for survival. This seldom happens when I'm dancing between the monsters though so I'm still unclear what he was upset about and why and never really had a chance to explain myself after the run was over. It wasn't a bad experience. Just a head-scratching one. Dazed

Blue · **12-30-2014, 02:48 PM**

As a main BLM and occasional tank (when I really need those roulette tomes and don't have time to wait for DPS queue), I hate with passion the DPSs who don't watch their enmity pool. No, not the happy dots on the middle left of the screen. Yes, that cute little pool over your job icon in the party menu. The one that eventually fills up and displays a radiant 'A' when the boss turns away from tank and decides to come hug you.

Sometimes I feel like I am the only DPS in the game keeping that thing in check. Is it SO hard to slow down on the damage if you see you're close to capping the pool and get hate? Why must you make me struggle, even though I, the tank, am trying my damn best to keep hate? I don't have a pimp novus sword. And I very certainly will not hold aggro if you start spamming Fire when I'm still in the process of pulling the boss in the right spot of the arena.

I've discussed this with friends and it seems the general answer I get is "DPSs don't need to worry about enmity. That's the tank's job and checking enmity lowers my damage out, which is my job to do." Is it? So do you not avoid AoEs because it's the healer's job to keep you alive? I mean, running away from an AoE lowers your damage output as well, right? So let's just sit in the glowing AoE field and be hit. Who cares if the healer gets headaches healing us for something that was totally avoidable. It's the same for the tank and having to restore his enmity because you, little DPS prick, need to show off that you do more damage than him/her and will get the boss to HATE you.

Let's be a little serious here. You're a big ass guy with a huge spear. I'm a fool with a sword toothpick. I already know you do more damage than me and so does the rest of the party. There is no need for you to go all out to get aggro. So please, just please. Keep that enmity pull on check. Don't go on your most damaging combo while I'm still trying to place the boss in the right spot. If your enmity pool is approaching tank's, switch to Umbral Ice for a few seconds, or refresh DoTs instead of doing the main damage combos and for the love of the Twelve DON'T START RUNNING IN CIRCLES WHILE STILL SHOOTING ALL YOUR BEST ATTACKS AT THE BOSS. Stand still, let me Cover you. Let me Holmgang. You won't die if you eat a couple hits, the healer got you. And if the healer doesn't get you, that's really what you called for when you ignored that cute little enmity pool, so eat your Raise. My enmity will be back to A and we'll be buddy-buddy again. At the start of fight, take a look if the tank needs to position first, or just HOLD for a bit. We won't wipe if you wait a second or two before starting to deal damage, I promise.

Mind you, I am not defending noob tanks

(A little pause here to explain my definition of Noob. If you're new and you don't know things, you're a newbie. If you're not new, know things, and still refuse to learn, that's when you're a noob.)

that don't do their job, treat Flash like it's a precious last resort or don't pop their Defiance/Shield Oath. I am talking about genuine players who see themselves forced to go to bed with a headache because, no matter how hard you try. It can be lag, it can be gear difference, it can be timing. DPS at some point will take aggro from you and you'll be the one to be blamed. And if you try and argue that, you're the "asshole tank". Enmity managing is an effort the whole party must do together, as much as it is dodging AoEs and positioning in the right places. As a DPS I used to think all tanks were stuck up assholes, but with this crap they've got to deal with, I'm not surprised they start to act like they hate the whole community.

It's just a glance to the upper left, and it can make the duty more enjoyable to everyone.

2) Minor, but just as common: DPSs who just think they can burn any boss and that you, tank or healer, must take care of the adds. This seems to happen especially in things like Pharos Sirius' first and second boss. Agh...

Dimona · **12-30-2014, 02:59 PM**

Quick response! Â I know it's not targeted at me, but as a DPS I know I pull enmity on a single target occasionally and try to make it a point to self-mitigate any damage that may occur and keep that mob in place. Â I'm not doing this to flex my muscles or piss the tank off or anything like that, I'm just trying to get on with the dungeon as quickly as possible. Â If I can't handle it, I'm not going to go crazy. Â I just know sometimes it happens and I have some tools available to handle that. Â I have a lot of respect for tanks and healers because neither is a job I can do, and neither is a job I would enjoy.

Quote:2) Minor, but just as common: DPSs who just think they can burn any boss and that you, tank or healer, must take care of the adds. This seems to happen especially in things like Pharos Sirius' first and second boss. Agh...

First boss on Pharos Sirius is a pet-peeve of mine too. Â As I understand it, adds spawn based on the boss's HP%. Â Maybe in some groups he can be burned down and the adds just kited or whatever, but I have seen so many wipes when other DPS keep on wailing on him instead of taking out the dogs. Â I have really grown to hate that fight for that reason. Â Roc isn't quite so bad. Â Like Nebbs said above, if people weren't always in such a hurry and paced themselves a little they might take a few extra seconds to do things that might salvage the run minutes wasted by wipes in the longrun.

Kage · **12-30-2014, 02:59 PM**

I'm working on some microscopes in my office so my phone auto corrected AOE to AOL -_-;

I er... I still have no idea how the 2nd boss in Pharos is supposed to go. Especially now when in 115 >.>

The only times I've had issues with tank and my own hate is when the tank doesnt... do... a good... job. Even at i115, if I'm hard casting Thunder 3 on Maddison before using AOE to hit the adds and I end up pulling hate... there's a problem. I only do raging strikes when there's a large amount of mobs and that means I've got quelling just in case but that doesn't mean you should not be flashing or using overpower.

Especially when against any item level higher than 110.

I still remember when I ran i70 into Sastasha (so Ive had time to see thm and blm rip hate). Like a dumbass I said don't worry about hate I'll do less damage than usual. I got chewed out for thinking less of the new non level synced tank. I did my usual. Wait for the lob, wait for all mobs to be pointed at tank. Then I start. Tank did just fine and wasn't in any HQ or dungeon gear.

I do this generally wit all my roulettes and it does well for the most part especially. If I am hard casting thunder 3 aafter you have already taken aggro on all the mobs aka they are all red, there is something wrong if I've ripped aggro from you

Melodia · **12-30-2014, 03:00 PM**

*Taps microphone*

*feedback*

Is this thing on? I am going to vent. I love it the most when people discuss and talk with you and say they are going to rp with you and you say "It's cool, just let me know when you want to." And even include the schedule of whenÂ you play just to help make it easy and it's all good, thumbs up and will see you then, etc......

And then never hear from the people again.
Unless three or four weeks go by and then the cycle starts anew.

That. Is. Super.

And before anyone sends me a nastygram, I am guilty as well.

*Goes back to her box and hides*

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The Vent Tent - Poor PuGs and Other Terrible Tales

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