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**Unnamed Mercenary** · **03-14-2015, 01:21 AM**

(03-14-2015, 12:47 AM)Chillsmack Wrote: lol the jobs are such a hot-button topic: SE really should have just done away with the starter classes and the "unique revival" stories of the end-game and stuck with classic full-on FF jobs that people could take from the get-go. It'd save us RPers and lorebuffs a headacheÂ

fun fact: There were no jobs when FFXIV 1.0 launched. They were added in patch 1.18 iirc. (When Yoshi-P took over)

Chillsmack · **03-14-2015, 02:32 AM**

(03-14-2015, 01:21 AM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(03-14-2015, 12:47 AM)Chillsmack Wrote: lol the jobs are such a hot-button topic: SE really should have just done away with the starter classes and the "unique revival" stories of the end-game and stuck with classic full-on FF jobs that people could take from the get-go. It'd save us RPers and lorebuffs a headacheÂ

fun fact: There were no jobs when FFXIV 1.0 launched. They were added in patch 1.18 iirc. (When Yoshi-P took over)

Yeah I know, but that's what I'm referring to: why 1.0 tried to make an MMO out of classes that have not existed in the FF franchise (save for Archer) just seems strange in hindsight. What ties the FF metaseries together are the iterations of common aspects of the world and themes - the apeparance of jobs is a well established tradition in that respect, and particularly suited for use in an MMO

Warren Castille · **03-14-2015, 03:33 AM**

Tanaka works in mysterious ways.

Chillsmack · **03-14-2015, 04:46 AM**

And gets fired in not-so-mysterious ones lol

Seriphyn · **03-14-2015, 11:26 AM**

(03-12-2015, 07:17 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: It's easier to just wear white robes and be a conjurer, but for some people folks see the title and latch onto it, as if that in and of itself means anything in roleplay.

I agree, and the inverse of this is what I've never understood. Why -must- you have the title if having it means all sorts of lore diceyness?

I look at it like this; you wouldn't try to break the lore and game rules at a tabletop session, so why here? The lore sets a consistency for all interactions, otherwise we might as well play Second Life.

Heart Quintessence · **03-14-2015, 11:34 AM**

Agreed. Lore is important.

Sounsyy · **03-14-2015, 12:38 PM**

(03-14-2015, 11:26 AM)Seriphyn Wrote:
(03-12-2015, 07:17 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: It's easier to just wear white robes and be a conjurer, but for some people folks see the title and latch onto it, as if that in and of itself means anything in roleplay.

I agree, and the inverse of this is what I've never understood. Why -must- you have the title if having it means all sorts of lore diceyness?

Going to chime in here briefly on the subject of conjurers and their clothing. Cuz if you dress your conjurer in white, you're doing yourself a disservice. According to 1.0 lore, the colors of a Conjurer's robes actually mean something and after a quick run around, continue to do so in 2.0!

In 1.0, a Conjurer who wore purple denoted that they were a Hearer. See below:
[Image: The%2BCall%2Bof%2BNature%2B-%2B8.png]

[Image: The%2BCall%2Bof%2BNature%2B-%2B8.png]

Experienced or high-ranking members of the Stillglade Fane who had not yet heard the call of the Elementals were dressed in Grey:
[Image: maxresdefault.jpg]

And all others wore whites or faded greys and tans as seen on the right here:
[Image: The%2BCall%2Bof%2BNature%2B-%2B2.png]

Now, this tradition continues to hold true in 2.0 with only a minor costume change for the Hearers.

Unhearing conjurers still wear whites, greys, or other pale faded colors:
[Image: Sylphie_01.jpg]

And Hearers now wear this:
[Image: bjFwbWM.png]

Navy blue has taken over as the dominant color, but purple remains as the accent. And most of these Hearers wield a purple "Sprouting Rosewood Radical" as their weapon. Also notice how E-Sumi-Yan is fully clothed in purple. Even O-App-Pesi follows this trend:
[Image: FFXIV_O-App-Pesi.png]

(Note the non-Hearer conjurer with him.)

In fact, the only White Mage NPCs who do wear white are the Senna family, seen here:
[Image: Kan-E-Senna_Pedjals.jpg]

And of course A-Towa-Cant who wears the infamous WHM AF, which I'm assuming the new canon for them is that they are his robes. In 1.0, A-Towa-Cant did not exist and the WHM AF was actually the corporeal form of an Elemental, Oha-Sok who becomes your robes so that you might carry Her power with you.

TL;DR: Unless you're stating yourself as a White Mage, wearing white as a Conjurer actually means you're a novice conjurer and unable to hear the Elementals. Fun fact of the day! ^^

Flickering Ember · **03-14-2015, 07:55 PM**

(03-14-2015, 11:26 AM)Seriphyn Wrote:
(03-12-2015, 07:17 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: It's easier to just wear white robes and be a conjurer, but for some people folks see the title and latch onto it, as if that in and of itself means anything in roleplay.

I agree, and the inverse of this is what I've never understood. Why -must- you have the title if having it means all sorts of lore diceyness?

I look at it like this; you wouldn't try to break the lore and game rules at a tabletop session, so why here? The lore sets a consistency for all interactions, otherwise we might as well play Second Life.

I think wanting to call your character 'white mage' has nothing to do with wanting to be special or strong or important or different.
I think it has everything to do with the fact that it is a series staple and people have always been roleplaying what their classes are ever since I started RPing in MMOs.

At end game level, you are not a conjurer, you are a white mage. You don't run around without a soulstone because that would gimp you. I think tabletop is an excellent example here so I will run with it, but to make the opposite point. In tabletop, unless you're house ruling, what is on your character sheet is what your character is. Roleplayers often will roll say, a rogue, not just because they want to play as one because they want to RP it too.

Certain folks, not me, don't prefer to divorce game mechanics from their RP. I know this is not the majority of RPers but it is absolutely the playstyle that would RP as a white mage. There is no right or wrong way. RPing a white mage isn't lore-breaking, it's just a different interpretation on the lore.

For example, my interpretation of the lore differs in that I view the game as very literal minded. Frontlines, primal extremes, housing, dye and glamour system....FFXIV has an explanation for all the game mechanics. The lore reason for Frontlines has to be the most ridiculous stretch for pvp I have come across but there it is in the lore, technically. In this same style of storytelling, it makes sense that there would be hundreds of Warriors of Light running around. No one's really mentioned the fact that it was said in a lore questionnaire that even though there is only one White Mage taught by the Elementals, there are other ways to become a White Mage. I believe then that it is canon that there are actually a bunch of White Mages running around. From the game's point of view, I think it's meant that YOU are always the person who did the story and the rest are your allies and friends who had their own unique, but powerful adventurers. (Some may say that isn't very RP friendly and that is fine. You can choose to ignore that. But if others want to RP it....it's just a different style of RP. I choose to ignore anything regarding Frontlines because I think the lore behind it is insane)

I realize that it's an unpopular opinion but I wanted to speak up for the other side on this. There are always different perspectives and RP styles that you may not know about or understand. You can speculate a person's reasoning for wanting to RP something but you can't know it for sure.

Gone. · **03-14-2015, 08:20 PM**

(03-14-2015, 11:26 AM)Seriphyn Wrote:
(03-12-2015, 07:17 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: It's easier to just wear white robes and be a conjurer, but for some people folks see the title and latch onto it, as if that in and of itself means anything in roleplay.

I agree, and the inverse of this is what I've never understood. Why -must- you have the title if having it means all sorts of lore diceyness?

I look at it like this; you wouldn't try to break the lore and game rules at a tabletop session, so why here? The lore sets a consistency for all interactions, otherwise we might as well play Second Life.

Just because you interpret it as 'dicey' doesn't mean others do. This isn't D&D with set list of rules, either, there's a lot up to player speculation here, never mind a number of game mechanics that some people ignore while the rest don't.

it has nothing to do with a petty title or power, either, but what a path like White Mage means. It is an important aspect of my character's personality and history, tying directly in with her racial lore, as well (wise, witchy moon cats, etc.).

You or anyone else doesn't have to like it, but I and others have done nothing wrong by going with IC jobs for good reason, simple as that.

Kellach Woods · **03-14-2015, 08:29 PM**

The only thing I learned from this thread was that 1.x UI was ugly as sin.

IIRC, the wording used at the lore panel wasn't that the attempt to attain Succor without the Elementals was bad, but rather that the group seeking to do so sought to do it for nefarious means.

For all we know, it involves asking nicely with tea and crumpets - they just want to do hella harm with it.

In so far as RPing a WHM goes - I think coming at it with a well-researched angle and preparing yourself will oil up the possible frictions that can occur with the community at large. Many RP the jobs after all. Yes, all we have known as the way to learn it is "nefarious purposes" and "through A-Towa-Cant's Soulstone and an uninteresting MSQ", but I've found that if you make your story entertaining, people will jump through hoops to be part of it, rather than exclude you because of what is, essentially, an accessory.

ArmachiA · **03-15-2015, 08:40 PM**

(03-14-2015, 08:20 PM)hauntmedoitagain Wrote:
(03-14-2015, 11:26 AM)Seriphyn Wrote:
(03-12-2015, 07:17 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: It's easier to just wear white robes and be a conjurer, but for some people folks see the title and latch onto it, as if that in and of itself means anything in roleplay.

I agree, and the inverse of this is what I've never understood. Why -must- you have the title if having it means all sorts of lore diceyness?

I look at it like this; you wouldn't try to break the lore and game rules at a tabletop session, so why here? The lore sets a consistency for all interactions, otherwise we might as well play Second Life.

Just because you interpret it as 'dicey' doesn't mean others do. This isn't D&D with set list of rules, either, there's a lot up to player speculation here, never mind a number of game mechanics that some people ignore while the rest don't.

it has nothing to do with a petty title or power, either, but what a path like White Mage means. It is an important aspect of my character's personality and history, tying directly in with her racial lore, as well (wise, witchy moon cats, etc.).

You or anyone else doesn't have to like it, but I and others have done nothing wrong by going with IC jobs for good reason, simple as that.

Except it's not interpretation, the Devs literally said only one person is a WHM. you're running around saying it's YOUR character. Yeah you can do that, but don't expect for everyone to agree to rp with you because of it.

Flickering Ember · **03-15-2015, 09:02 PM**

Quote:Has there been a revival of white magic or is your PC the only person learning white magic outside of their school?Â A.) If everyone was the WoL, no one gets to have a sense of being the hero. â€œYOU.â€ There are other ways to get white magic. Through deviant means and might show up in the future.

Quoted from the Fanfest lore panel.

Warren Castille · **03-15-2015, 09:03 PM**

(03-14-2015, 08:20 PM)hauntmedoitagain Wrote: This isn't D&D with set list of rules, either, there's a lot up to player speculation here, never mind a number of game mechanics that some people ignore while the rest don't.

Every job has a list of rules required to play it. It's called "lore" here, and not "rules" though.

The only thing open to speculation is whether you feel your character's story is more important (or important enough) than anyone else's involvement with your story, though. There's nothing wrong with deciding that, but... Not a lot of people will agree in a shared space that your story is worth their involvement. You are more than welcome to give yourself a special implausible backstory, and everyone else is more than welcome to ignore it as soon as you walk out of their scenes.

ArmachiA · **03-15-2015, 09:24 PM**

(03-15-2015, 09:02 PM)Flickering Ember Wrote:
Quote:Has there been a revival of white magic or is your PC the only person learning white magic outside of their school?Â A.) If everyone was the WoL, no one gets to have a sense of being the hero. â€œYOU.â€ There are other ways to get white magic. Through deviant means and might show up in the future.

Quoted from the Fanfest lore panel.

They haven't told us what those are yet, nor if anyone has ever been successful (Which I'm assuming not because they said there's only one WHM). Until they do that's moot because people can just invent a bunch of stuff and be completely wrong.

Just like we know Blue Mage is a FF class but we have no idea if it will ever appear in FFXIV. So some people don't think you should play it at all because you'll get the lore wrong, but people were trying anyway.. only later to learn that the devs said BLU probably won't even be IN THE GAME

V'aleera · **03-15-2015, 09:42 PM**

(03-15-2015, 09:38 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: And when the Word of God tells you that you do in fact have to go on a wheat free diet, most people tend to listen.

So we're just going to ignore the fact that alternative means (to say nothing to the already plausible natural means) of learning White magic have been 100% confirmed as existing by the Devs?

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