RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes

Kestrael · **02-13-2015, 04:51 PM**

Well, now that those low-life black market artists have been dealt with and the integrity of the game is safe once more perhaps SE can turn their attention to the obviously lesser evil of Gil selling. /sarcasm

If someone creates a thread on the official forum I will gladly sign my name to it. Our artists play an integral part in helping to bring our characters and stories to life and shouldn't be treated like those who help destroy the game economy and experience daily.

QueenFrejyalen · **02-13-2015, 05:02 PM**

Yeah I would definitely say that on a scale of what's hurting the game and what isn't, the numerous bots and gil sellers are at the 9 and 10.

Whether SE will actually uphold their stance on art for gil, we'll have to wait and find out. Â My guess is that if they put even a fourth of the time they spend on gil sellers/bots into the art issue, then we'll never be affected by it anyway.

;P

Titor · **02-13-2015, 05:06 PM**

I would sign my name on the OF for it too, I do enjoy art, but I not enough to risk my account over.

But I can see how hard it would be for SE to draw the line. Would it only be non-tangible art? Digital only and no traditional, and no giving printed copies? Would any art be allowed, such as sculptures and jewelry? At that point it can become any goods that fall into the scope of art, which is a lot.

While here we seem to only be selling digital non-tangible art, in terms of tos they would have to really clearly define it.

I think it would be good if art sold for gil could not have a real world currency option. No either gil or usd, but only gil, that way there is no conversion

K'nahli · **02-13-2015, 05:11 PM**

(02-13-2015, 12:03 PM)Geisterfuchs Wrote: To be the advocatus diaboli: RMTers could claim they did not sell those gil for money, they received art for it. Pretty hard to disprove.

Re-quoting this since it seems like the most logical reason as opposed to SE being arbitrarily against such a function.

Ha'uruh Nunh · **02-13-2015, 05:22 PM**

I'm probably the minority in that I prefer to pay cash rather than Gil anyway - my in-game wallet has yet to recover from Novus, and time has become more precious to me than money.

I guess this is proof that I don't buy Gil, haha.

However, the one time I did do a Gil art commission, as of now, two months after I paid, still haven't seen the art, whereas had it been a cash commission, I could've filed a Paypal complaint and gotten my money back.

That said, it's a shame that this could deter our fabulous artists from plying their trade. That to me would be the true tragedy - less art flowing into the community.

Titor · **02-13-2015, 05:31 PM**

Well, that is another thing, why would art be 'alright' to buy with, whereas other services would not be? I am a freelancer and do a variety of electrical engineering and computer science tasks right now prior to going back to college, yet I could probably not offer, say, tutoring services for payment in gil, could I? Why is art alright to buy, but not coding work or tutoring services?Â

If they are, at what point do we disallow trading gil for services? Art is not that much different than tutoring services or code work, in that both of those services are not physical products. Could we buy music with gil? It gets a bit tricky, and while I do enjoy art I am not sure why it should get special treatment.Â

I would still sign a petition to allow the buying of art (and possibly other non-tangible services?), but, those are just my small thoughts.

Warren Castille · **02-13-2015, 05:42 PM**

Just for the record: I've paid plenty of artists here who just... stopped posting. As it stands right now I've given someone real cash money and they never turned up with art, and there's people in front of me on the list.

I don't want to turn it into a witch hunt or make accusations, but paying someone and having them vanish isn't new. It won't change if things are arranged in PM.

Atoli · **02-13-2015, 05:42 PM**

(02-13-2015, 05:31 PM)Titor Wrote: Well, that is another thing, why would art be 'alright' to buy with, whereas other services would not be? I am a freelancer and do a variety of electrical engineering and computer science tasks right now prior to going back to college, yet I could probably not offer, say, tutoring services for payment in gil, could I? Why is art alright to buy, but not coding work or tutoring services?Â

If they are, at what point do we disallow trading gil for services? Art is not that much different than tutoring services or code work, in that both of those services are not physical products. Could we buy music with gil? It gets a bit tricky, and while I do enjoy art I am not sure why it should get special treatment.Â

... What? Coding or tutoring has nothing to do with Final Fantasy, roleplay, or the characters created in junction with the two.

Kage · **02-13-2015, 05:43 PM**

(02-13-2015, 05:42 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: Just for the record: I've paid plenty of artists here who just... stopped posting. As it stands right now I've given someone real cash money and they never turned up with art, and there's people in front of me on the list.

I don't want to turn it into a witch hunt or make accusations, but paying someone and having them vanish isn't new. It won't change if things are arranged in PM.

I've had this off-site as well. It's not new. It happens.

Titor · **02-13-2015, 05:47 PM**

(02-13-2015, 05:42 PM)Atoli Wrote:
(02-13-2015, 05:31 PM)Titor Wrote: Well, that is another thing, why would art be 'alright' to buy with, whereas other services would not be? I am a freelancer and do a variety of electrical engineering and computer science tasks right now prior to going back to college, yet I could probably not offer, say, tutoring services for payment in gil, could I? Why is art alright to buy, but not coding work or tutoring services?Â

If they are, at what point do we disallow trading gil for services? Art is not that much different than tutoring services or code work, in that both of those services are not physical products. Could we buy music with gil? It gets a bit tricky, and while I do enjoy art I am not sure why it should get special treatment.Â

... What? Coding or tutoring has nothing to do with Final Fantasy, roleplay, or the characters created in junction with the two.

What does art have to do with FF? I could commission most artists to draw any character I want, even off game, and many of the artist on here would take gil to draw characters from Wildstar or WoW or even OC's, I do not recall an artist that said they only drew final fantasy characters.

Also some coding can be FF related, I am coding some RP applets/interactive things for my FC, which is definitely FF related. I could offer to code websites for FCs as well. When the FF API comes out I could offer to code plugins

Kinono · **02-13-2015, 06:05 PM**

The ony difference between this and selling runs is it crosses a real-world line which must be what gets SE in a tizzy because they're fine with run-selling.

Then again, nothing would stop someone from paying real-world money for runs which seems even worse to me but that's neither here nor there.

Hyakki · **02-13-2015, 06:09 PM**

Why not just ban selling services here period? If RPC going to prohibit gil artists from advertising they may as well prohibit cash artists as well. Offering any other kind of outside-the-game service for gil/cash would be frowned upon so why make an exception?

Or, better yet, retract the new policy and let those willing to take the risk to accept gil commissions continue to do so. They're aware of the potential consequences, leave up to them to decide if its worth it.

Aldotsk · **02-13-2015, 06:14 PM**

(02-13-2015, 06:09 PM)Mamushi Wrote: Why not just ban selling services here period? If RPC going to prohibit gil artists from advertising they may as well prohibit cash artists as well. Offering any other kind of outside-the-game service for gil/cash would be frowned upon so why make an exception?

Or, better yet, retract the new policy and let those willing to take the risk to accept gil commissions continue to do so. They're aware of the potential consequences, leave up to them to decide if its worth it.

Just visit user's tumblr/deviantart to negotiate commissions or even skype. No one will ever notice.

But then again, I am not currently offering commissions atm so I can't say anything about this.

Telluride · **02-13-2015, 06:15 PM**

(02-13-2015, 06:09 PM)Mamushi Wrote: Why not just ban selling services here period? If RPC going to prohibit gil artists from advertising they may as well prohibit cash artists as well. Offering any other kind of outside-the-game service for gil/cash would be frowned upon so why make an exception?

There's also the sting to this that, as was brought up earlier, this policy mostly attacks paying, honest subscribers, while the bots - which are flagrantly violating TOS policies - still manage to re-emerge and port from place to place.

Melkire · **02-13-2015, 06:15 PM**

(02-13-2015, 06:09 PM)Mamushi Wrote: Why not just ban selling services here period? If RPC going to prohibit gil artists from advertising they may as well prohibit cash artists as well. Offering any other kind of outside-the-game service for gil/cash would be frowned upon so why make an exception?

Or, better yet, retract the new policy and let those willing to take the risk to accept gil commissions continue to do so. They're aware of the potential consequences, leave up to them to decide if its worth it.

As I understand it, the laws that allow us to keep a FFXIV-related site open, up, and running don't allow us to breach the ToS that Square-Enix has implemented for their IP and service. If we were to breach said ToS, the RPC could get shut down by Square-Enix due to the violation.

FreelanceWizard Wrote: ...pursuant to the Materials Use License that governs this site (which does not permit any promotion of forbidden activities in game), all threads advertising art of any sort, commissioned or otherwise, for gil are forbidden as of February 12, 2015.

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Policy change: Sales of art for gil forbidden

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes