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Zyrusticae · **09-23-2014, 02:14 PM**

Okay, this is quickly going nowhere.

I don't know why you would suddenly say the main story quest cutscenes are "gameplay" and not "lore" (seriously, isn't THAT backwards?), but the game is very clear and unambiguous about this.

It's POSSIBLE that there is some nobody who got the Echo but never had the chops to pick up arms to begin with. It's also POSSIBLE that Hydaelyn would never choose such an individual to obtain the Echo in the first place. All we have to go on is what's actually in the game, and what's actually in the game strongly suggests that anyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light by default, including player characters who were not created in 1.0.

I don't even know why you are so adamant about Legacy players being special here. They're not. Warrior of Light is not limited to them and them exclusively. This isn't arguable.

Kage · **09-23-2014, 02:16 PM**

To be honest the whole WoL topic quickly went over my head while I was eating lunch and I don't even know what was being argued.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **09-23-2014, 02:32 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:14 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: Okay, this is quickly going nowhere.

I don't know why you would suddenly say the main story quest cutscenes are "gameplay" and not "lore" (seriously, isn't THAT backwards?), but the game is very clear and unambiguous about this.

It's POSSIBLE that there is some nobody who got the Echo but never had the chops to pick up arms to begin with. It's also POSSIBLE that Hydaelyn would never choose such an individual to obtain the Echo in the first place. All we have to go on is what's actually in the game, and what's actually in the game strongly suggests that anyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light by default, including player characters who were not created in 1.0.

I don't even know why you are so adamant about Legacy players being special here. They're not. Warrior of Light is not limited to them and them exclusively. This isn't arguable.

It is going nowhere. This will be my last post on the matter. We can take it up in PMs or something, if there's anything left to continue on.

And I believe we're having a serious case of arguing different topics or something. I'm trying to say that 1.0 players not notÂ special at all. They are all not WoL. Mine certainly wasn't, and that was shown in gameplay.

While the game might suggest that most Echo-enabled people become WoL (by either the 1.0 or 2.0 definition), it also suggests that Hydaelin might have just spun a wheel of fortune and said "these are the people I'll pick." Nowhere does the official lore that SE's given us state that all people with the Echo will become WoL. We know that all WoL in the 2.0 sense have the Echo. We know that most, if not all 1.0 WoL have the Echo (but it wasn't a requirement. There could have been some non-adventurers at the battle), but there's nothing to stop some random guy who was fighting in Mor Dhona at the time from also being sent through time and forgotten.

Berrod Armstrong · **09-23-2014, 02:39 PM**

To boil it down and simplify:

Not everyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light.
What the Warrior of Light is in all the other FFXIV games has no bearing on what they are in THIS one.
The lore clearly states that they are a specific group of people who participated in a specific event.Â
Nowhere in the cutscenes does it say that everyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light. For example, Minfilia is not a Warrior of Light. The *spoiler* priest in the *spoiler* quest line had it, and he wasn't a Warrior of Light.Â

I'll conclude on that matter as well, the argument started to explode sideways, which happens, but the first point is the one I want to ring home.

ArmachiA · **09-23-2014, 02:46 PM**

People who do not have the Echo can be a Warrior of Light (From the Carteneau variety), anyone who was on the battlefield and in range of Louisoix's spell was skipped ahead. Remember it was Louisoix who skipped everyone ahead, not Hydaelyn .

THere is no actual concrete lore on this however, so it has to stay in the Subjective pile.

Berrod Armstrong · **09-23-2014, 02:48 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:46 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: People who do not have the Echo can be a Warrior of Light (From the Carteneau variety), anyone who was on the battlefield and in range of Louisoix's spell was skipped ahead. Remember it was Louisoix who skipped everyone ahead, not Hydaelyn .

THere is no actual concrete lore on this however, so it has to stay in the Subjective pile.

[Heavy Breathing]

I must find out

Kage · **09-23-2014, 02:55 PM**

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

Right?

Berrod Armstrong · **09-23-2014, 02:58 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:55 PM)Kage Wrote: But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

Right?

YAS.

Ifrit's thingie is called 'Tempering'. Titan doesn't do anything in that regard, Garuda 'Touches', Leviathan 'Drowns'. I don't know what Ramuh's influencing is called, and I'm not sure if Shiva's has a name yet.Â

I think for 'Drowning' the folks are usually dunked in some sort of water. From what I've observed, Garuda just uses gust and it may just be super effective. Ifrit just breathes the blue flame.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **09-23-2014, 02:58 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:55 PM)Kage Wrote: But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

Right?

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

Berrod Armstrong · **09-23-2014, 03:06 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:58 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(09-23-2014, 02:55 PM)Kage Wrote: But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

Right?

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

Yes! After having faced and defeated a primal, the soul crystal draws out the lingering Aether from you and manifests it into the egi's form. It's then up to the budding summoner to SUBJUGATE IT. Very easily played off.

Kage · **09-23-2014, 03:14 PM**

(09-23-2014, 02:58 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(09-23-2014, 02:55 PM)Kage Wrote: But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

Right?

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

I can't tell you cause I poopsocked the SMN questline when I finished SCH ><; But it wasn't like right before facing the egis that I had to go do the trials again

Seriphyn · **09-23-2014, 03:27 PM**

On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

Kage · **09-23-2014, 03:30 PM**

On my topic I am not asking why people choose to RP as jobs or not. If you want to talk about that, I ask that you make a different thread about it as I am only interested in the lore surrounding the jobs that would lend to interesting RP stories.

I am asking what the lore is behind jobs that make them open, limited or "restricted."

OttoVann · **09-23-2014, 03:31 PM**

(09-23-2014, 03:27 PM)Seriphyn Wrote: On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

I agree. If I ever took Otto down the path of real combat, I would /not/ be a monk. I would be a pugilist and I would never identify as monk. But that is my personal preference to be down to earth and avoid DragonBall powers on my character. Or a lancer, same thing.

Berrod Armstrong · **09-23-2014, 03:37 PM**

(09-23-2014, 03:27 PM)Seriphyn Wrote: On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

It's honestly all good and fine not to play any of the jobs if that's what you want. But a roleplayer who wants to portray a character WITH a job may wish for guidelines on how they may go about doing so.

Personally, I chose Monk over Pugilist because the Monk works on a different level -- with regard to the seven chakras, specifically. If I wanted to play a Pugilist, the best I would get out of that is a fist fighter with the ability to enter the heightened state of Greased Lightning.

My character's concept always sounds so cheesy on paper (an amnesiac street thug pugilist who was a talented monk before geting keblox'd on the noggin), but anyone who has roleplayed with Berrod knows that it's not executed in a manner nearly as silly as it sounds. He's a man trying to get by (and get laid) in everyday Ul'Dah life.Â

The 'job' part of the roleplay comes in at certain intervals and it is refreshing and fulfilling to allow myself to experience it. I could just play a pugilist street thug all day everyday, but that isn't engaging enough for me. To each his own, I think!Â

Just make sure that if you DO play a job, you do so in moderation. I think people would get sick of me if I went about unleashing the third chakra for every little thing.

"Berrod can you help me move this bench?"

"OPEN TH'SOLAR PLEXUS!"

"BERROD PLS"

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"Lore-friendly" or not Jobs

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