Market wards changes incomming!

[Merri]

Market Ward Changes

 

Looks like SE is at least pushing out some changes within the following week or two. Absolutely great news for those of us who absolutely despise the system the way it is right now.

[Tadir]

Wonderful. I like these changes. Thanks for posting them up.

[DAISHI]

So now you need a retainer I'm every ward, and people still need to sort through countless wards. I guess the fact that there is some organization is a little better.

[Chveya]

So now you need a retainer I'm every ward' date=' and people still need to sort through countless wards. I guess the fact that there is some organization is a little better.[/quote']

 

Not necessarily; if you wanna sell a bajillion different things, and get the discounted tax on everything, then yes. But if you want to be clever about it, you can sell different things in chunks. Such as fish one day, masks the next, and so on.

 

Also, if you read the print below the chart (I missed it the first couple of times) it IS hinted at that there will be some sort of search ability, maybe. Possibly. Soon.

[Merri]

Thanks for moving the thread. Just now realized I was in the wrong forums when I posted it. Was a bit too excited with the news, apparently.

 

And yeah, the changes are at least a start. It's better than what we have, which is absolutely zero organization. Just a complete and total mess of Retainers crowding the first few wards.

 

This should at least spread out the retainers so it's not so crowded and difficult to look through, and give it more organization. Of course you'll still have the occasional retainer full of junk in the armor ward, but, it won't be nearly as unforgiving as looking through 50 retainer's for a single piece of equipment, while the majority of just full of complete junk. Now it'l be the other way around. A lot of ward specific vendors, with a few junk vendors here and there.

 

Edit: Also, I just noticed they mentioned they're looking into ways to increase the amount of retainers one can have. Maybe that's hinting at allowing players to have two retainers without having to pay extra? That would solve the issue, and would make sense with the new changes. You would have one retainer for selling your expensive goods in the proper wards, and one you could just toss up in another with your miscellaneous junk.

[DAISHI]

So now you need a retainer I'm every ward' date=' and people still need to sort through countless wards. I guess the fact that there is some organization is a little better.[/quote']

 

Not necessarily; if you wanna sell a bajillion different things, and get the discounted tax on everything, then yes. But if you want to be clever about it, you can sell different things in chunks. Such as fish one day, masks the next, and so on.

 

Also, if you read the print below the chart (I missed it the first couple of times) it IS hinted at that there will be some sort of search ability, maybe. Possibly. Soon.

This is ok in theory, but in reality it takes a long time to navigate the menus andd switch out items with your ward, before even setting prices.

[Chveya]

This is ok in theory, but in reality it takes a long time to navigate the menus andd switch out items with your ward, before even setting prices.

 

 

Yuh, it does. It's not gonna be easy, but it's still better than nothing, for now.

 

I'm just grateful I don't plan to sell too many different types of things.

[DAISHI]

Yeah don't get me wrong, I'm glad they're doing this. It'll help somewhat. Not as much as an auction house. But somewhat.

[Satisiun]

Also keep in mind that SE probably seeks to gain from this more than any of you scrags (... I love that word. Damnit, Limsa Luminsa).

 

Earlier on in development and prior to game release, it was made clear they intend to charge $1 per each additional retainer after the first.

 

You can probably figure it out yourself who benefits best in this situation just from that bit of knowledge alone. Especially since the game effectively forces you to be buried to your neck in regents and materials due to the multiple crafts needed for a vast majority of items.

[Hayden]

:cry: I'm sorry...but I'm just so happy...these are tears of JOY!

[Kashemia]

I quite like the changes. Sure, it makes it harder to have different type of things up at once, but I can live with that... This is more like the system I had hoped for.

 

I'm still not sure I'd really like an AH, this seems more personal in a way, and personally, it gets me to talk with my friends about helping me get the mats I need, rather than just buying then, which I'm actually enjoying. Community feel, yay!

[Aysun]

So close to a search function SE... c'mon you can do it...

 

This is a step in the right direction!

[DAISHI]

So close to a search function SE... c'mon you can do it...

 

This is a step in the right direction!

 

At which point they should just make it an AH.

[Merri]

At which point they should just make it an AH.

 

Depends, really.

 

Technically, they could add a search function that would simply show you what ward the item is in, but not the pricing or the specific vendor. That's what it seems like they're hinting at. Not showing prices would be a key point. If the aren't prices listed, people will have to either do their research to undercut prices, or just put a price on their item based on what they feel it's worth.

 

Where as with the auction house, prices become set in place, and they usually fluctuate between a high and low point. If there were no price listings, crafters would be free to charge prices fitting to their tastes, as people who are either lazy or in a hurry might just purchase their goods, regardless of whether or not they cost a little bit more than a competitor.

 

Plus, no direct auction house means no RMT attempting to control it.

[Ellion Goto]

Oh thank god. I have wasted literally hours sitting there browsing through random retainer #342 attempting to find a certain item. It was very frustrating.

[Skye]

At which point they should just make it an AH.

 

Depends, really.

 

Technically, they could add a search function that would simply show you what ward the item is in, but not the pricing or the specific vendor. That's what it seems like they're hinting at. Not showing prices would be a key point. If the aren't prices listed, people will have to either do their research to undercut prices, or just put a price on their item based on what they feel it's worth.

 

Where as with the auction house, prices become set in place, and they usually fluctuate between a high and low point. If there were no price listings, crafters would be free to charge prices fitting to their tastes, as people who are either lazy or in a hurry might just purchase their goods, regardless of whether or not they cost a little bit more than a competitor.

 

Plus, no direct auction house means no RMT attempting to control it.

 

Actually, the way the Auction House worked in FFXI, was that it didn't show prices.

You'd just have to guess your bid, if it was too low, you wouldn't get the item, if too high, well you just lost some extra gil.

[Therese]

Actually, the way the Auction House worked in FFXI, was that it didn't show prices.

You'd just have to guess your bid, if it was too low, you wouldn't get the item, if too high, well you just lost some extra gil.

 

Well... it wasn't quite that uncertain, since you could also pull up bidding history and try to make an educated guess where the few remaining stuffs on the AH was being priced at. ...and yell at that one guy who put the only Centurion's Sword and is charging 10k over the previous asking price and grumble grumble...

[Asytra]

It's a step in the right direction but...

 

Did SE REALLY have to separate everything down so distinctly? I mean seriously... just... ARMOR would have sufficed....

 

Leave it to SE to simplify something by adding more complexity... *sigh*

[Merri]

Actually, the way the Auction House worked in FFXI, was that it didn't show prices.

You'd just have to guess your bid, if it was too low, you wouldn't get the item, if too high, well you just lost some extra gil.

 

Yeah. I played FFXI for about seven years.

 

But prices were shown in FFXI, and it only aided the RMT in their conquest early on in the game. It showed how much people recently paid, and that served to create a median point for most items. Sure there was the occasional item that sold extremely low, or really high, but it all usually evened out around a price range. Plus, since it was a single auction house, it was a single tool that every player used, and gave RMT the ability to attempt to take control, what with their constant camping of NMs (Up until SE finally made changes to most major NM drops.) to monopolize the selling of major items. They ended up assisting in the inflation of several important items.

 

There would be no "single" tool for the RMT to control if there were no auction house in FFXIV. They would be hard pressed to hold monopoly over several dozen individual vendors. The search function i'm talking about would just allow players to know the item is out there, and in what ward. Not which individual person is selling it, or the price.

[Chveya]

I don't think a Search would make it an AH at all. It still allows for distinct vendors, BUT:

 

-- It allows buyers to see if the item they want is even available; and

-- It allows sellers to see what the market is like.

 

As someone who wants to sell materials, I'd really like to be able to find out what other people are selling them for, so I don't drastically undercut or overshoot the mark.

 

That can all be done without centralizing it into an AH style system.

[DAISHI]

I don't think a Search would make it an AH at all. It still allows for distinct vendors, BUT:

 

-- It allows buyers to see if the item they want is even available; and

-- It allows sellers to see what the market is like.

 

As someone who wants to sell materials, I'd really like to be able to find out what other people are selling them for, so I don't drastically undercut or overshoot the mark.

 

That can all be done without centralizing it into an AH style system.

 

I just don't see why NOT centralize it. Centralizing is good for efficiency. Streamlining. Capitalism baby.

[Tadir]

I hate to always go back to Galaxies, but just switch 100% to that system.

[Bryg Bluebeard]

@Asytra: Actually, if you ask me, they separated things rather well. Sure, certain wards could maybe be combined here and there, but keep in mind that this is an MMO, which means as time goes on there's going to be a whole lot of new equipment and materials to be added, and the level gaps between players (and therefore what they sell) will likewise widen. The game only just officially released today for non-CE PC folks, so for now it probably feels like this is too much separation because there's just not a whole lot out there right now. Give it time though, and each ward will fill up enough to warrant existing as its own entity. So while it may involve a bit of a learning curve while trying to remember which ward sells what, it actually helps streamline it because the wards are separated logically rather than just having everything in one big disorganized mess. It makes it more akin to an actual physical AH (as opposed to a menu-based one), just without the price-fixing aspects.

 

As for the search function, I sorta agree with Chveya on this one. I actually think that listing prices would do more good than harm AS LONG AS the prices are arranged from lowest to highest in the list. It's not like the list would show how much things have sold for in the past, it would only show what people are trying to sell it for right now. Furthermore, because nobody in their right mind would sell something for less than it took to craft it, it would set a floor value for people wanting to keep their prices competitive, which would all but ensure that the most reasonably-priced items would get the most attention by being at the top of the search list while the people trying to cheat you would be further down the list than anybody would care to check. Of course, some risk would be involved regarding the pricing of raw materials given that there is no specific floor value in that case, but you'd still be guaranteed to find the best prices easier if they were all at the top of the list.

 

As for getting more free retainers... Given the separation of wards that they're looking to implement, I'm hoping that they're going to let us have at least 3 retainers each, by default. And not just so I can have a harem of hot elezen women selling stuff for me.

[Chveya]

 

I just don't see why NOT centralize it. Centralizing is good for efficiency. Streamlining. Capitalism baby.

 

Cause they said they didn't want to. *shrug* I got nothin' on that one; except that the idea is probably to keep the market more in the players hands and do something about the RMT crap.

 

I don't understand economics, so I don't know if it'll help or not. Or maybe SE is just being stubborn and they want to do it this way because they want to. Who knows?

 

There's nothin' wrong with a bazaar system, as long as we can FIND what we want.

[DAISHI]

Well the price will be what the price will be. Price in open market economy is what the public is willing to pay. Price too high and eventually nobody can buy it, so the price falls to a medium that most people are willing to pay.

 

HOWEVER a key component of the open market is viable alternative. For this reason, I propose an Auction House or Market Ward or whatever, in which the average selling price is listed (as reference for merchants) while alternative prices are also listed (for buyers). Think of it like Amazon, where you can see what something is going for, but can also go into the details of what each seller is selling that product for.

 

This would force merchants to compete for sellers' attention and drop the price, but only so far, as they still have to exceed the costs of their materials.