Hyrist

Thinking a good scenario would be - The creation of a new server. It would also have to coincide with a housing expansion, likely. It would involve the server first being opened by people transferring off of Balmung, housing would switch 1 to 1 for those who transferred. At that point, the one of two scenarios would be up to SE, regardless of which designate one or the other server as the RP Server. They could hold the housing expansion off for those transferring from other servers to the designated RP server. Then either have houses transfer 1 to 1, or offer full refunds and have it be first-come-first served. I'd honestly think this could be accomplished sooner if they held back further housing expansions until they could effectively double housing, then merge a couple low-population servers together to free up space for this idea. This is only if they can't afford the creation of new servers due to population disparity. But in the end - I think overall the above methods may be the only real solution to the population disparity problem - Merge the low population servers, use the freed up space to offer splits for special interest servers such as RP.

Lin Celistine Vanilla and Wildness (For someone called a Wildling... that's quite accurate!) Hyrist Verus Bacon and the Jungle (Really? Not booze? Okay... he's a cook, so the bacon works!) Eric Verus Nutmeg and Integrity (Uh... this kinda works?)

This is sort of inverted for the character that actually drinks, which is Hyrist. It's less Hyrist's 'Drunk' Personality than so much Hyrist's public personality. He presents the public face of being a complete lush. He drinks, he's vastly inappropriate with zero social stigmas. (Woman: "My eyes are up here!" Hyrist: "Yes but your tiii-tanic center of gravity is right there, how do you STAND!?" Are they stuffed with wind-crystals?) He'll state whatever's on his mind in the most low-brow humor possible. Getting him to be serious is the trick. Drunken silliness is the norm.

We know from Alberic's tale that Stoulstones are not returned upon retirement - as, if the Warrior of Light is a Dragoon, Alberic's Soulstone that we acquire. On the point of the armor. Alberic no longer wares his, and had stepped down from the upper echelons of the Dragoon. We see this with Estinien, leaving behind his helm at the end. But note that his own soulstone was never indicated to be left behind as well, and indeed he still carried his lance with him, assumed complete with at least the base line of his skill with it. So, if we were to establish a rubric to advise retired Knights Dragoon, I'd say at the very least the official Drachen Mail gets retired. There are plenty of alternatives as seen in lore (Often depicted as replicas or discarded designs.) that fit the Dragoon motif if desired - however I'd assume someone walking around wearing Drachen mail or a variant would be considered simply an adventurer aspiring to be more than what they are - whether or not they had the skill to back it.

Anyone who knows me from the XI days knows that Hyrist was primarily a Red Mage and has always been the part of a magical Swordsman. I've kept Hyrist away from 'job' aspects intentionally because I was holding out for RDM specifically. Lin's been at the forefront of my storytelling where Hyrist has effectively played the part of 'a drunken lush'. I don't expect that to change too much. :angel: As far as how it ties into his personal plot, or even if it becomes an IC thing, it will depend on the lore of the job. But Gameplay wise, yes, playing. They got blind loyalty and a decade's worth of gameplay programming backing that up. I can't shake the thought, however, that the job will be Thavnarian in origin, so that might be tricky.

Lin's voice is a touch softer than this, but the Ashera's voice, the calm and deep that belies Lin's small stature. (@56 seconds) More to come.

I do very much like this theory, but where I come with the disconnect with is the underlining premise in which I always have to make a separation in lore. What is said in game, by characters, can never truly be taken as absolute - as it's being thrown in as a lends of perception. What is being said by developers and story staff, however - is being told to you by the creators of that game, which holds the weight of 'Word of God'. Even in free-form roleplaying, which pools the majority of my roleplay experience, "House Rule" is typically respected. In which case, it's Koji and Oda-san who's word succeeds anything short of Yoshida who can say "Recompose". That said, that does not mean that the Au Ra themselves could not have made the mistake on their origins and based their creation story on Bahamut and Tiamat, much in the way that it's speculated that some of the Eorzean gods are based off the Triad and fables of old. This theory may very well be the legend upon which the Au Ra have created the their faith base. The fact that it does not line up to the origins Koji and Oda say they come from is irrelevant in this case. Faith and Facts do not have to necessarily coincide. Either way, it's a fun parallel to draw I see where it could be lined up and even if it is or isn't true, there's been a lot of thought and investment into it and I like concept.

Oli, you... are very familiar. And I'll leave it at that. I'm not going to make a speculation here. I'm catching a lot of argumentativeness in your posts as well. As a suggestion, instead of disseminating my posts based off their diction, perhaps you would like to analyze it again based off of intent? [align=left] Some counter pints, truncated to be concise and prevent quote wallings:[/align] [align=left]- If you feel you are unaffected by my statements, perhaps it is simply just that, you are not the addressee of my statements, and therefore are excluded from them, instead of thinking that I am implicating you in them? [/align] - Lore is subjective. Therefore it is perception. Anytime a lore lacks an absolute it is up to the reader to speculate upon on, and FFXIV also has a tendency to also completely disqualify its absolutes. Beyond this, you have to consider the fact that the majority of the lore we have is told through perception of character, therefore even if an absolute statement is made by then, it may, in fact, be false. Put bluntly, unless you're an SE staffer, most particularly the story staff. You're viewing the lore through a lends, we all are. [align=left]- As far as me saying it's fanfiction. It's not meaningless to remind people of the core premise of what we are doing. In fact I feel as if it needs to be more emphasized, you're doing more the encourage that by the cross-examination trend then discourage it. It is meant as a reminder to take a step back from one's own 'personal stake' in the matter and remember that ultimately we are achieving the same goal through different means. - As far as the 'Peer pressure', you may have missed it in all the thread trimming.[/align] - Additionally, I never denied the responsibility on both ends of the the debate and repeatedly cited the problem as a two prong spectrum. However what I was describing was a case example of where one side is feeling it whether the other may not realize, in showing that there's an underlining premise in trying to enforce lore that comes off as unwelcoming to others. This does not deny the fact that there are those who, on the other end, are guilty of forcing their hand. We can touch further on that subject if you wish, but in that case I was directly addressing one side through the perspective of an other. - As far as me 'making projections' this is a double edge sword of an argument. You made the assumption upon me that I haven't done my homework on this issue, instead of asking. I've done three years of research on this by repeatedly and privately inquiring current and former members of this community, as well as those without it. It simply just isn't as easy to post when you're ghosting on your phone and my home time is limited. [align=left]I will however, take your criticism to heart to say that my words may well not build a bridge between the segments of the community - if I am to take it on faith that you speak for said community. So far, you're the only one with outspoken critical feedback on my delivery but I'm willing to learn more of your particular perspective on how this might be accomplished with better diction. However, keep in mind that all of this is pretty much just high-level discussion as I've cropped several of my posts for the sake of length and tangent - of which I am hopelessly prone. I wonder if this is causing a lot of the issues you're having with my posts - but I digress.[/align]

I don't think anyone going to go out and make you feel terrible for making a character that adheres to your perception of the lore Valence. I feel sorry if someone has. But the real argument being made here is that you accept others who are playing a method you do not. Take a moment to suspend disbelief when the retired Isghardian Knight Dragoon walks in the bar and hear their tale to see if it's written well enough to make a believable story premise, before writing them off as a lorebender and deciding not to play with them. 'Being lore compliant' is a perception. We're all writing fanfiction. The fact that our characters exists at all, no matter what the premise, can be put into question. Making your character as close to what is known of the lore is possible can be fun, and I don't deny that. But it can and often does fall into the cycle of peers pressuring one another to fit within their individual perceptions of the lore -( even if their basis of that lore comes with innate flaws and contradictions.) It's at that point that I disagree. It's just not in me to try to justify if a character's perception exists one way or another. I want to see if it's well written. Even saying something as 'lore compliant' indicates that somehow your character is more valid that someone who falls within the margins of the written lore, or contrasts a claim made by an NPC character in the game somewhere that's being taken as fact by a circle of players. It's that level of microagression and the constant cross examining by certain other players that's causing what is being perceived as a hostile environment by those outside the regulars here looking in. Something that would bear dispelling, in my opinion, as there are really good people here. All I've asked of people is to not take role-playing so seriously. If you're having fun scouring through the lore and writing off sections of it where you feel is forbidden for you to play, do so. What I'm asking of the wider community is to be welcoming of other perspectives when someone sees the same segment of the lore and sees an opportunity, rather than a wall. In this specific instance, seeming the Knights Dragoon's have fallen so low in living members, perhaps this may spark a desire in Adventurers to attempt harder to adapt their martial techniques in an effort to make sure they survive, even if the order is eventually retired due to the developing peace with Ishgard and Dravania.

I've said this before but it bears repeating. No matter how seriously you take the matter, there is nothing that will absolve the fact that any and all form of role-playing within established canon context not of your own origin can and will only amount to mere fan-fiction. You pair this with the fact that a community can only thrive if it remains open and welcoming, and that cannot be achieved when valuing subjective (even if literal) interpretations of the lore against gameplay elements - and you establish one over-arching code beyond all others. Play to have fun. For all the intensity of trying to maintain seriousness with the lore here, Square Enix, on the other hand, is quite capable of self-satire for the sake of humor, and has displayed it regularly with each Hildebrand story iteration. I'll be replying to my own thread during this weekend (work kinda dragged me down, and I'm posting this with the last ounce of my sanity) regarding one of the clauses that tend to undermined how the lore itself tends to be more perceptual rather than factual, with plenty of loopholes for players to do what they want - but it really does boil down to this simple question: If Square Enix can have fun with its own game, why can't we?

Odd that I would think that, unless they existed in adventurer circles, the only real reaction to someone claiming they wanted to be the best White or Black mage in the would would be: "What's a White/Black mage?" Eorzeans as a whole are not always well learned, even of their own legends. As far as this not being a 'get out of jail free' card. I have to question what would be at this point and not at the same time be damaging to both the lore and the roleplay. Put bluntly, the harder your confirmation, the less options you have for roleplay. As it stands, what SE has given is clear licence to peruse. Anything beyond that is open grounds for RP plot discussion. For example, if they went ahead and said: "This is the method in which Adventurers were able to replicate the skills of a Black Mage." It would, very quickly, become the only accepted method, instead of leaving it to the interpretation of the readers to write, roleplay, and explore the possibilities of pursuing them. By giving us examples of successes in Warrior and Bard, they give licence for the pursuit of all of them. Pursuit, however, does not guarantee success and it will be on the writer to create a convincing story within which success is justified. However, in my opinion such prospects should excite, not discourage. So this is less about "I'm going to be the best White Mage ever seen!" So much as "I am going to single-handeledly revive this lost art!" Or "I am going to pass along this rediscovered secret art!" Pursuit, investigation, rediscovery, refinement, failure, persecution, reeducation, are all great story concepts before we even talk about the execution or perfection of the craft. I'd caution not to sell what officiating this with the lore entry can encourage.

My guess is that they're holding back on that because if they were to make another example, people would take it as confirmation that that Job is going to be a gameplay element. Moreover this confirms the fact that not only are Soul Crystals found, but they're also potentially created continually, as they serve as both methods to record, and pass on techniques as well as objects to learn from. This also hints into the fact that no two Soul Crystals are identical, providing roleplayers onus to produce some variance in Job techniques, especially in the case of lore specific skills like Blood of the Dragon, which is listed as specific only to the Azure Dragoon. Seriously though, this is great for the RPC, but it does not satisfy my want to dig more into the lore of Adventurer Culture itself. I'm still going to be looking for screens while on the waiting list for my own copy of the Lorebook to try to glean more info on how Adventurers have developed and live their lives in Eorzea and beyond. There's so much we don't know about the Adventurer's Guild, for instance. But this piece of info I thought would be really beneficial to the RPC as a whole. Edit: As far as the inclination that this will add fuel to the fire. That depends on whether or not people can make the leap from the specific Job Order storylines implying exclusivity, and the now revealed fact that the attempts to replicate these techniques are occurring regardless of attempts to obscure them. What it really boils down to, at this point is that each individual roleplayer of a job will likely need to write a backstory or do roleplays displaying how they came upon these techniques - same as before. However, this provides an official backdrop of canon to work from - rather than pure speculation.

After doing some digging, I found some interesting tidbits in the Lore book. Apparently the reference lore of the Dragoon in the previous discussion thread is out of context of the greater over arching matter concerning Jobs and adventurers. Here's the relevant Screenshots to explain that yes, Adventurers's have been perusing and replicating Jobs even outside their specific select orders: (Credit goes to amdapor township , please visit and show appreciation for their diligence in this.) Looking at the context, I think this should put to bed any lore concerns regarding Adventurer's pursuits and various successes and failures in the "Job" arts - as we now have a dedicated lore entry for what was long suspected true among roleplayers. While this does not absolve lore conflicts for those attempting to play as members of the select orders they represent, the practitioners of the martial specified discipline that select order has coined isn't just permissible now, it is canon. This is an acknowledged movement among adventurers, to the point where the military of Eorzea has taken notices and are attempting to integrate. This should also affect the lore base surrounding these aspects. We will need to reassess the individual storylines regarding jobs and their context within the wider Lore world with this preface in mind now - but for the more part we should diffuse any tensions with those attempting to play practitioners of Jobs - and hope to work to be involved on how to use these martial arts as building blocks for characters, rather than something one dimensional. Most noted among these is the fact that Soul Stones are something not for everyone and must also be trained with in order to master, no different than any other martial art. This will still enable those wishing to peruse these forums to retain their humble development role-plays while still having access to they gameplay elements we've long debated over being able to adequately roleplay. Furthermore this highlights that there is much unspoken lore regarding the Adventurer Culture that needs to be dug through and pursued - as well as remaining open to discussion and exploration in roleplay. :arrow: Discussion point: Will the knowledge of this Lore Book Entry affect how you address roleplays you see or have in the future and if so how?

You'd be surprised. No offense but that's kinda appalling. And tantamount to harassment to boot. Fortunately the wider community is like to isolate extremists on both sides for being drama mongers. It is becoming more clear with each of these heated discussion, however that some greater reconciliation between the gameplay and the lore my be called for. There may be somthing said for roleplayera coming together and writing something in the margins of the lore to keep things player friendly to build upon while at the same time marginalizing extreme cases of bending. All optional of course. But finding middle ground would help slow and at time repair some damage to the goodwill of the community. Not to mention give more avanues for creativity.

Questions about the validity of those who attempt at lore adherence aside - I wanted to ask a bit of feedback from across the isle about peoples opinions on how this, and other restrictive lore documentation feels on the opinions of people. It's fairly clear that, baring the massive gray area that is elite adventurers and adventure culture in general, that the lore was written without any consideration to gameplay or role-play features. This is evidence by the multiple job organization lores that completely contrast one another, from the fairly open free Paladins to the dwindling Knights Dragoon to even the non-existent White Mages. From complete acceptance to lore bending, this has left a pretty divisive mark on our Roleplaying community, as indicated by the sharp discussions and mod invoking. Where do you stand, opinion wise, on this kind of lore? Do you consider it good writing or bad storyplay design? As for my opinion: "You can play or work with this, you can't with that.", In my opinion, does not sit well in a multiplayer field. The game is written very much from a single player RPG prespective, taking great strides to make the individual "Warrior of Light" feel special and central to the story to the point of exclusion of all else... with one exception. That grey area mentioned earlier - the Adventurer Culture. I find it funny that, in a book made of lore, the most central developmental culture of an entire continent is left with so little information and time worked upon. I can't help that this order is left intentionally vague to be the ripe soil from which players can grow their own stories. But let's touch on that matter another time. Without this exception, the game to me just isn't well written enough to accommodate the large number of RPers we have - at least not as a whole. Which means no matter how close you want to get to the lore itself, it's just completely unsustainable at this juncture as we're too numerous, and the game's writing anticipates far fewer of us in the long haul. (This is kinda indicated by the housing market to, I suppose.) Anyways, those are my scattered thoughts on it. How does everyone else feel - as this changed to Dragoon is just another indication of implied exclusivity among the many parts of the game's lore. I'll reply to other segments of this discussion likely on a different thread, as talking about using existing mechanics in game and implying whether they do or do not lend to characters with depth is sort of tangential here.