2.0 Marketing and the RP Community's Future

[Kylin]

So we have a newly designed RPC site. Patch 1.21 is out, further transforming the game from its initial horribly reviewed state. Patch 1.22 is due out by the end of the month. Thatâll leave only 1.23 left before 2.0 is right around the corner. So itâs high time we at least start this discussion.

 

How should we go about promoting the new FFXIV and RPC? What methods are best in gaining as many new/old role-players back as we possibly can? And when should this extensive marketing be done? Timing is crucial. Too soon could end up driving newbies and oldies away again before taking in the full breadth of changes. Waiting too late, on the other hand, could minimize the positive impact we could make on the overall RP community.

 

Mass emails via these forums are an obvious method to utilize. However, it would be nice if we could put together a simple, attractive, and coherent ânewsletterâ detailing the massive amount of change thatâs come and is still coming.

 

Iâll also definitely reach out to the other fan sites (Zam, Gamer Escape, and Core) to help with our promotional efforts. How and when we want to go about this is still unknown though.

 

Overall, itâs imperative that we come together with a solid attack plan in advance. FFXIVâs rebirth is a territory that few to no other MMOs have really ventured into. As weâre all well aware, the RP community as a whole has dwindled to quite a small size since launch. The opportunity for us to reach a new potential is there, we just have to approach it properly.

 

So please donât hesitate to list ideas, concerns, and so on in this thread so we can prepare for the fast-approaching 2.0 (can you believe itâs now only about 6 months away?!). We need lots of ideas to make the most of this upcoming opportunity, no matter how small. Weâll need talented artists, crafty marketing strategies, a strong presence, and as much unity as possible.

 

So letâs get this crucial discussion underway

[Riik]

All I can say is... stay active! Do plenty of events! Advertise, do loads of RPs all over Eorzea so that potential RPers can pass us and those with interest have someone to ask! Also, if we spend more time IC, there's a higher chance of getting noticed by people interested in RP.

 

Hopefully, we'll get an official RP server when 2.0 comes out, but before that, we need to get people who may not consider RPing interested... we don't want to get an RP server to find few people are interested, because then getting parties would be far more difficult. So for that, we would need to reach out to the people less inclinded to RP somehow, and draw out their inner RPer.

 

Oh and finally, we need too behave ourselves! We need to get a good reputation! If we look like a bunch of horrible idiots, nobody would join us... so let's be nice!

[Momo]

Well all I can say for sure, is I am coming back, as I am tired as heck of waiting for the PS3 to come out, and just bought a computer to satisfy my craving for FFXIV. I am seriously hedging bets on 2.0 improving this game to an extent that hasn't been done before, and hoping that people can handle the switch while also drawing in new players in general, much less RP. With that said, I agree with most of what you both have said, and I suppose I have a couple rather random suggestions.

 

Above all, I will reiterate, be active! Being active with the LS is so important to keeping the community alive, I have just logged in after quite some time away, and was a little scared that the community was dwindling down too much. Perhaps it is the waiting for the new version to come out, but then again, maybe not. The LS I originally was a part of, died out after only a couple months, so I knew that it may be the same for such a large number of groups when I came back, but we still have some! They need to stay active, if nothing else, if you feel you are dwindling down to no members, join together if possible so that we have strong groups to support our foundation of incoming people if we manage to get more (which we will of course). I know that it may not be possible with the varying practices in each shell, but what must be done, must be done? A group of 3 very active strong shells, versus a group of randomly active 8 shells: seems kinda obvious which i would rather have.

 

Timing is everything, but perhaps we need to get adverts going no earlier than the beginning to mid part of May, when the changes will begin enacting. A closer second round of adverts wouldn't hurt about 2 weeks from 2.0 going live as well, as a pick up in gaming advertisement in general, mixed with our own adverts could bring some more people in. Lets not forget a long term plan for PS3 players as well...though that is quite a bit of time away past the beta. As far as on other sites for the game, I think we need to create threads in their forums as well as any other kind of advert we choose. When doing so, we can also create a list of thread links (on our own board) to other places so that we can have the community members that are active on those forums, post on our thread to keep it up and active. Many sites allow advert threads if you are willing to do the same for them as I am sure most people know. Wouldn't hurt to have some people go and ask where they can find good RP, and create a dialogue that way as well by having other people from here post back to them with our link, as well as some info from other posters on what it is we do here. I do have a few questions though:

 

Have we tried getting onto fansites at the Loadstone? If so, how did it turn out, and what do we need to do to make ourselves a part of that?

 

Have we tried contacting SE about linking up with them in any other way, hence an RP server and such? If so, how did that turn out, and what ways can we try to do that more in the future, whether sending individual feedback, and what not as well as from the community as a whole through prominent members?

 

Have we contacted the leaders of our currently active shells on the site recently? Who is the most active, who updates the most, who can we get to help spearhead some of this other than a few random members posting here? Maybe if you are an LS leader, you should have a responsibility to the community as far as tie ins with our future plans, if that is too much for those already fairly active, perhaps a liaison from each group who is fairly active, but doesn't have too much on their plate?

 

For now, their is quite a lot of work here, so I suppose I will leave it at that, and check back soon. Sorry for the longness of this, I am just excited to be back after having waited to play this game I love for too long. Can't wait for next month when I can join everyone here, and hope we can get this thing (the game included) off the ground in the coming months!

[Mtoto Wamoto]

So with 2.0 fast approaching and the current client undergoing some massive changes to the mechanics and the way we, as roleplayers, play the game, there are some interesting points that are brought up as we proceed forward. I suppose the best way for me to explain them is in outline format, sooooo here we go~

 

Linkshells: Too many, too much?

As of 4/16, there are a total of 13 registered linkshells on the RPC. On average, there are roughly 10-15 members per shell, with the more filled shells balancing out the lighter ones. Taking into account that players have multiple shells, we're still looking at a rough estimate of about 150 roleplayers left on the server. My numbers are likely off, but one can look at that and easily see what type issues and problems such a high number of micro communities pose in such a scattered and lightly populated world. Competition is likely when linkshells are scouting for full time members, and even then, the more established shells will already have a much more solid foothold and established presence. The lighter shells would either be forced to disband or simply accept the fact that growth has become stagnant for them because the resources are in limited quantities.

 

The "simple" solution is to cut down on the number of shells present and reduce the number from 10 or so sporadic and semi-active shells into 4 or 5 heavily active shells. But who are we, or anyone for that matter, to suggest that a linkshell can't exist simply because it isn't recieving enough attention/taking part in enough events/ or because it doesn't have enough members? Last I checked, RP wasn't about the ego or size of a shell or guild, but rather the fun and immersion the RP presents. I'm willing to sacrifice the former in order to ensure that the future of the community isn't being hindered. However, I feel that we have other means to approach this before we suggest shells devouring one another for the sake of the community.

 

A better solution, in my opinion, is to create stronger bonds between shells, both in-character and out-of-character. This involves communication, forum usage, more presence on the RPC, etc. The only way I can see the current number of shells to continue to co-exist and function is to create and build the communication between them. Let's call this idea sister linkshells or something for now. We could have shells with similar themes work more closely together to develop more intricate and detailed content for members of both parties, therefore increeasing the activity within the shells and increasing the awareness of active, engaging RP. If we were to have all the current linkshells work together in a manner such as this, we would already be killing two birds with one stone: those being RP awareness and RP activity.

 

So to this end and to sum up this part of my wall of text, I propose that we establish some sort of weekly, or bi-weekly, or monthly gathering of linkshell leaders OOCly (and perhaps even ICly) to discuss the current and ongoing direction of the community and settle any disputes there may be for the greater good of the RP. This would be a great place for ideas to be brought to the table and linkshell leaders to brainstorm with one another for cross shell activity.

 

Free Companies: The Future of the RP Community

The next point of interest revolves around the upcoming Free Company status which will be made available to us come 2.0. For those that don't know, Free Companies are basically player-run Grand Companies, where the players are able to have a company building, custom company rankings, the ability to summon primals, etc. From what I understand and what I've read (spare me as I'm too lazy to cite my sources), players will be limited to one Free Company. From a player perspective, this is great. From a role-player perspective, it forces the community to work against each other in the grand scheme of things. The last thing I want to see is the RP community driving a sharp nail down the middle, further dividing us than we already are.

 

My suggestion to this is to establish some sort of IC Free Company for RPers headed by the various linkshell leaders. It ties directly back with my last point in that we can use it to further unite the community and ensure we strive and grow while showing to the rest of the server that we are indeed active and engaged in what we do.

 

I can go into further detail on this if need be, but I'm just tossing the idea up on the table for now.

 

External Sites/ Official Forums

While I know that the RPC isn't some sort of governing body, perhaps we need to get RPC representatives in place to help promote the RP on our server. I know Kylin, Oskar, Endricane, and several others have already been doing what they can, but perhaps it's high time the rest of the community stand up and help them in this regards? I for one have been a shade for too long even though I have been present in the community here and there as a leader and member. Perhaps we should have some sort of promotional team? A group of players to represent us on forums such as ZAM and FFXIVCore, while another group is in charge of Q&A with the dev reps on the official forums? We could even have a whole group dedicated to putting our creative talents to use through our art outlets and vocal forums.

 

None of the things I've proposed are original by any means, but I've yet to see them discussed in-depth or at much length. Having the ideas aren't enough however. Talk is still cheap when it all boils down, and what needs to happen is that we as a community need to take a stand and represent ourselves more to further encourage the growth and future of this diverse and immersive side of the game.

[Smiling River]

I've kind of been working IC'ly on the 'sister linkshell' thing for a while now, as well as a server wide RP storyline, involving all/most leaders of each LS meeting to kick it off. I have a lot of strong arguments against merging linkshells, for example, less fun, more drama- due to to lack of cohesion in RP style/preferences... but I just wanted to toss this in there. All such things must start IC, otherwise it's metagaming aint it? I don't think anyone should be forced to do anything they wouldn't want to do, IC and OOC. If you agree with the idea of dismembering linkshells, start with your own. Personally I am doing fine, almost too much RP for me and mine... so I guess I don't really feel the pinch which prompted this. That said, as I stated above I've kind of been pecking away at unifying things from IC. I may elaborate later, dead tired. Sorry if things are not explained well.

[Mtoto Wamoto]

Oskar, not sure if you were directing that last comment at me, but do watch using the term 'you' as it suggests that your regarding the author of the last post, which in this case would be me.

 

That aside, I'm against merging shells as I stated because there are other alternatives and better options instead of violating the sanctity of the current shells and their visions/goals. Oskar, I agree with you in saying that one shouldn't be forced to do anything they wouldn't want to on either level of character, and I don't think any force would be needed in the first place regarding communication. It's all just a matter of principle and extending an open hand to work to better a slowly dying community, which may or may not pick back up with the launch of 2.0.

 

While I agree that things should happen ICly first, that doesn't mean the OOC discussions can't be ongoing at the same time. Yeah, Metagaming is bad, but if we're always so afraid of not using information we may or may not know OOC, ICly, we place a growth cap on ourselves because we can't be in-game 24/7 and always in-character. The work needs to be there on both levels as things develop.

 

I'll state it again that there needs to be more discussion on matters like this in public forums for everyone to contribute to.

[Smiling River]

You as in whoever agrees with that idea. I think it's horrible. If anyone wants to challenge me on that- let's discuss, but it seems that it was brought up twice, and Mtoto doesn't support it, not sure about MoMo... so I am confused why it's up there at this point... just for the sake of tossing it the worst idea out there? Let's talk about ideas we actually support, new ideas.

 

And I agree, there are other options, which, as I said, something like alliances between shells has already been in the works for quite some time. So what new ideas does everyone have in regard to this? And I get that that one can be new to people who haven't been doing it, as well. But like Mtoto said in her post, a lot of what she said has already been happening as is.

 

Do we add a cap on Linkshells which are advertised here? It would seem unfair as well. Of course actually preventing people from starting RP Linkshells is impossible. So with regards to Linkshells, and keeping more people on one... what /can/ be done? Cleaning up the Guild Hall so that only active Linkshells are listed would be cool. Reaching out to some of those unheard of shells to poke around and see what's up is also good. That simply will eliminate those who aren't adding or subtracting to the equasion. It's not like if a RPer decided to join an inactive group, and got no response, that they will not join any active LS. No, they will try another time, with an active LS likely... So while clean up is nice, it's just that, clean up. Doesn't solve anything really.

 

I liked Mtoto's idea of basically a bullet point list of 'traits' each LS has.

 

Everwatch

• [*] Needs more male characters. Pay rate doubled if male.[/list:u]

 

I personally would rather RP with a small group that I agree with in terms of RP style than a large one where people frustrate me. I don't play the game for that, and there is no way I am willing to sacrifice fun/quality of my RP for a bigger shell, just for the sake of putting more people under the same pearl. I've been around, I know what is out there, I've sampled many Linkshells in the past. Not all linkshells will be able to RP on that scale, sad fact. Maybe a handful can enhance RP by linking up IC, but that depends on so many IC factors. If your LS is amazing, has events often, and really really nice members, but it's an assassin group, or a collection of thieves... there is no way that I'd be able to RP with them.

 

I am not saying that there should be no discussion, I am saying that I think a lot of what I have read just seems disagreeable to me. While the community may be small, I find that I don't have enough time in the day to RP, and there are plenty of IC stuff to do... so I guess I am not feeling the pain.

[Momo]

Certainement! Forgive the lack of agreeable ideas in my first post, but I just hoped that we could continue this discussion and wanted something on the table to be discussed period, bad or good frankly. I guess I would say that it would be nice to hear from maybe the less active of the Groups on their opinions rather than just the leaders of the clearly active (both here and within their own groups) and established groups. Not to say that I think it is pointless, but just to get a better feel for those groups who may need help sticking around? I am so happy to hear that some of you have so much going on as far as RP goes, but I think that a lot of this planning has more to do with growth rather than establishment.

 

That being said, I agree that it has always been a corner stone of the site hat this was more a connection making engine rather than a place for a ruling body to be enacted, and with that sentiment, and in that spirit we need to connect. This site in the coming months is undeniably one of our best resources for growing the community and organizing what we already have, better. Grand events, IC or OOC could be organized here for those groups who feel that they can work together on some larger scale, new LS can be given some recruitment priority, and those who have enough members can keep closed recruitment as it is now. Restructuring, or cleaning up I think is sort of integral to that, insofar as the new members can see oppurtunities better whether they will come back or not, I think from a community standpoint that looking organized and in contact will help foster members we have into coming back as well as better encourage new members to keep faith in our community as a whole.

 

I know I know, maybe we don't want to people who give up at the drop of a hat, but even I came back and was a little discouraged though certainly willing to keep eyeing the situation around the site. I think I will come back to the group merging idea that I originally posted, and agree that with many of the groups this is not possible unless they give up some of their major foundational points, and therefore not a valid solution, but I think that idea came from the spirit of group communication between at least the leaders to form a stronger unified presence here. I think that has a possibility of better handling recruitment organization and group degradation in the long run IF the leaders can be agreeable and share info and ideas. With that does come the statement that it isn't the leaders of he groups to actually conform to such and idea of community with increased communication and organization, but I think I would say to that maybe we need to bring out that sense of natural community that lies within most Final Fantasy (any game) gamers. So felt in FFXI, a gaming community that I feel is unlike most others I've experienced, where we actually take the time :joker: out of our day to interact wh one another and help one another towards our individual goals, a scenario I have experienced many times.

 

We need to find the spirit which Is necessary to counteract the widely known and greatly disheartening flare for drama in any RP community, much less one where it is amongst fellow gamers who then bring RP into that fold. I will admit, I am a bystander of this situation of course, I am not a member of a group, and not a leader of anything here, but I do hope you take my sincerity in that I wish all of us to succeed in our future paths wih this amazing world and these great people I know are around us

 

 

~Momo~

 

Edited to fix iPhone typing errors...

[Smiling River]

I agree completely that a clean up is in order.

 

Dissolving the brackets of RP based on weight (hehe) would also be a quick-fix to all of the Linkshells appearing to be "Heavy."

 

I actually am/was under the impression that most RPers are not into heavy RP, but somewhere in the 'moderate' range, so I am a llittle surprised that we have so many heavy RP Linkshells. Not to say that they do not 'belong' or something silly like that, since perhaps the few moderate LSs may be simply larger, but again - we face the problem of self-evaluation. I know some people who take their RP seriously and would call themselves heavy RPers, who I do not consider as such. It's difficult to represent these things on an unbiased 'standard'. So yeah, kind of supports the previous point about simply getting rid of the brackets and letting each LS stand on their own.

 

. I think I will come back to the group merging idea that I originally posted, and agree that with many of the groups this is not possible unless they give up some of their major foundational points, and therefore not a valid solution, but I think that idea came from the spirit of group communication between at least he leaders to form a stronger unified presence here. I think that has a possibility of better handling recruitment organization and group degradation in the long run IF the leaders can be agreeable and share info and ideas.

 

Momo and Mtoto (you guys and your funny names) have both now mentioned an OOC LS leaders meet (working on an IC one, just give it time, have to finish some of the current story arcs first). Especially with regards to Momo's previous point about the RPC being the place to connect for RPers rather than enforce rules upon the community - it sounds like a case being made (again) for the Leader's council here on the boards. Threads about it may have been nuked or moved to where I couldn't find them, the latest started by Eva, wherein several RPers wished to bring back the council - which is a forum only for leaders of linkshells on these boards (perhaps with viewing privileges for everyone) that can be used to start organizing cross-LS RP and so on OOC'ly. This has been discussed and obviously it didn't go through... I am happy to try again now, but I just wanted you guys to be aware of that... since it seems like in both cases same things are being asked for.

 

If worst comes to worst I have no problem picking one of our LS forums at random to host such a section >.>

But then again, I want to just do it IC'ly first and foremost so I may not even really need it as much.

 

Momo, I think you're right though on getting the opinions of the quiet folks that we never hear from, especially leaders of the community. Last night I asked over the OOC pearl if people were psyched to reply to this as much as I was, no one seemed to share the enthusiasm. I don't think many people care for these discussions unfortunately >.>

 

 

EDIT: Could not find Eva's thread, but here is a poll that was a byproduct of it LINK

[Eva]

I just wanted to clarify a few things. First, for those who may not have been around or who may be unaware of the threads posted in suggestion of a clean-up or overhaul of the RPC, there have been a couple good threads posted with a lot of great ideas:

 

1. Verence's Thread (10/10/2011)

2. Deirdre's Thread (2/13/2012)

 

Moreover, a suggestion was brought up by Merri while back that a weekly tavern night for all role-players be instituted. This was met with a whole lot of 'meh' unfortunately, but this is where I had first suggested reinstating some form of LS leaders section as mentioned above by Oskar. Kylin went on to create a thread with a poll for this but it seemed like a pretty significant number of RPers were opposed to the idea at the time. I still maintain that this would be a valuable tool for the overall RP community such that LS leaders can come together on neutral ground and organize events together, but the lack of such a forum has not prevented some cross-LS activity. But maybe it's time to re-examine that - I don't know.

 

Most of the threads linked above seem to have wound up getting somewhat derailed for various reasons. And I know a handful of us have lost some faith in the ability of people to work together towards common goals.

 

I also wanted to stick up for Crystalline a bit here. Somewhere in the midst of things a number of "new" linkshells cropped up all at once. I don't really view this as a negative. I had noted several months ago (I think it was September of 2011) that there were a lot of great linkshells out there, and felt like trying to make a new linkshell would be a lesson in futility at that point. However I found that a lot of the people whose friendship I had come to value in this game were spread out across a number of other linkpearls to which they felt great loyalty, and keeping in communication proved to be a bit of a challenge at times. So the concept was born. In truth, a handful of people have had this pearl going right back to launch of the game but it was never really utilized until a few months ago in any degree. Really all it is is a place for people who enjoy high-immersion RP to go when their main linkshell is quiet or OOC. Part of its intent has also been to bring not only the individuals who carry the pearls together, but also their linkshells. It's yet too soon to say whether it's a success or not, but... it's an effort. And right now I feel like we could all stand to give a little more effort to help bring the RP community together.

 

I don't really have any other suggestions to make. I would love to see the RPC become the bustling hub it was before the game's launch where it was nigh impossible to keep up with all the threads that were posted. But it seems like there has been a lot of disagreement, or a lot of hurt feelings, or a lot of he-said she-said, or longwinded threads about policy and such, or whatever else that puts people off from wanting to come here and share their thoughts. This really needs to end, but threads like this, and posts like this aren't getting that done. I'm honestly not sure what would. I'm not sure what I could propose that hasn't already been put forth in the threads linked above.

 

I hope this post at least helps answer some questions though for newer members and explains why there is a certain underlying ambivalance with regard to whether these sorts of proposed changes. It seems like there's something of a consensus with regard to there being a need for change. And that's a good start. Figuring out how to bring about this change appears to be the next step, and it's in this where the real challenge appears to reside.

[Smiling River]

I think the re-haul of the RPC has brought in more traffic though, since more people actually post.

[Shuck]

Just throwing my bit in here:

 

Free Companies: The Future of the RP Community

The next point of interest revolves around the upcoming Free Company status which will be made available to us come 2.0. For those that don't know, Free Companies are basically player-run Grand Companies, where the players are able to have a company building, custom company rankings, the ability to summon primals, etc. From what I understand and what I've read (spare me as I'm too lazy to cite my sources), players will be limited to one Free Company. From a player perspective, this is great. From a role-player perspective, it forces the community to work against each other in the grand scheme of things. The last thing I want to see is the RP community driving a sharp nail down the middle, further dividing us than we already are.

 

My suggestion to this is to establish some sort of IC Free Company for RPers headed by the various linkshell leaders. It ties directly back with my last point in that we can use it to further unite the community and ensure we strive and grow while showing to the rest of the server that we are indeed active and engaged in what we do.

 

I can go into further detail on this if need be, but I'm just tossing the idea up on the table for now.

 

I'm totally behind this. The very last thing that any community needs is further division. Under a Free Company, we maintain the individuality of the existing linkshells, but band together in a larger sense. With the talk of player estates, and the things hinted at on the Lodestone about Free Companies, it would also make us that much more visible, which is important, given that we are a minority. It's not impossible for roleplayers to be a prominent force, as my fellow TR alumni on these forums will tell you.

 

That being said, I'd love to hear more about what you've got in mind.

[Momo]

OKAY, thank you Eva for so kindly searching out those links, and bringing them to the forefront. It is an eye opener to read them, and frankly it has pushed me into posting so soon after I just posted earlier today. This is it...this is the thread, the time, that we need to change. We are looking for change, we need to do it, and stop bickering and fussing over random things that hold no relevance to this situation. If nothing else, we are looking like we have nothing left to lose at this point. There is little to no faith amongst the different groups in the RPC, and on top of that, the well thought out discussions we have begun, very unfortunately devolve into less that human arguments over randomness. I think we need to stop that here, and make a decision here!

 

Continuing from this point on, we need to decide which of these ideas is clearly the best, and work towards them. When you post to the person before you, just leave out the comments that aren't relevant to the discussion, and only work from a place of growth. Tensions, egos, and opinions on anything else besides how we can change, and better our community need to be left at the door, and we need to get this moving or this thread like those before it will become pointless. If you feel that little nagging feeling over something someone said that you think is slightly offensive, ignore it, move on, feel in your self that what we are trying to do here IS important enough that our own sense of self will come second to the community from a leader's standpoint. I implore you this favor please! I truly want something to come of this community, and the only way we can do this is if the leaders gathered here work together, and make decisions so that Kylin can carry them out, and we can be better for it in the end, or else only sink a ship we've already sunk and be no worse off. I am begging again, please for those of us who are coming in, or coming back, who don't have a community to reach out to, but desperately want one!

 

Before I finish the groveling part of this post, I want to say that: I know how you all feel. I may not be a big shot here, I may have just come back from a long hiatus, and frankly I'm not technically even playing until next month, but I know what this is about. I've felt that little voice in my head that says: "Be angry!" "They insulted you! Be passive aggressive just to get under their skin...!!!", but having been the leader of many an RP group in the past, across many different fandoms, we as leaders need to know when that voice is of no use to us and our greater cause as Leaders. Please, please, please don't let this stop because of personal hurts or opinions, please let it continue and become a real action and not just fruitless words. We all deserve what is best for the community, so let us make it what it yearns to be, and let go of all other views! Side note: You don't have to mention this paragraph, you don't need to agree with me, you can read it and pretend you never heard for all I care, all I ask is that you sincerely listen to my words, and understand that I am not interested in taking power from anyone or giving power to people beyond inspiring real and good change. In fact, it is probably best if not one gives a word to this, as that will prompt others to agree or disagree on it, and that IS NOT what it is for, it is said to each individual, from me to you, not from me to a random group, so please understand it that way.

 

Enough of that, back to the "Let's do this yo!" part of this post. We have gathered a few talking points, things that have generally been agreed on, and could bring results which I have narrowed down to these:

 

~Clean it up! : Hence, we clean up the dead groups, clean up the overall look of the board by getting rid of some clutter possibly? Start with a cleaner slate than we've had in a while.

 

~Restructure it! : Hence, we restructure the way the board is run and the way it is organized. We regroup the guild area differently, possibly getting rid of the "levels of immersion", and maybe going with a simple "Sell our own points" approach, which is all still needing a bit more discussion and agreement. Secondly, (maybe) we create a board on which leaders from linkshells can organize and discuss what is needed when it is needed, that I think most people will probably hope that normal members can at least view and monitor on their own time. This group will have no power but to communicate and organize, possibly enough power to suggest things to Kylin to help better the board again should this come to further fruition, but any member of this forum has that ability here should they choose it. This should possibly have a sort of "Rules and Guidelines" in which we state what this leader's board is, how it works, basically outline it best so we can make sure it is doing what it's supposed to, and not what it isn't.

 

~Let's do it! : Hence, we actually do all that we say we are trying to do. Kylin, reads these posts, and the ones that Eva linked in, and takes what we will surely come to a decision on, and actually makes it happen! I know, again, let's discuss it more, but let's do it after we discuss it, and not dilly-dally shilly-shally all day over this nonsense when we know it needs to change. I took what Eva said to heart, she said that she saw everything, read it all, agreed with most of it, but wasn't sure what to do, and I think that is the point, it is the DOING that needs to be done to make this work! So let's band together and do this!

 

~Momo~

[SamusKnight2K]

From the view of just another RPer one problem with multiple linkshells in existence is most often they tend to follow the same theme. Though fine, it limits the possible options that a roleplayer has for compatible linkshells when the theme is repeated. A heavy view of this is the mercenary theme. There's plenty of these linkshells around to choose from but what if your character or play style doesn't fit this? Ultimately you're left to scour around for one that does, or make your own. That is where the influx of linkshells comes from, people trying to either create their own personalized theme, or follow a popular one. The difference however could be in the set rules. Lore between varying shells tends to differ, some will accept one thing, but another won't. The theme could be right but the rules are not. Isn't to say we all must throw our standards out the window but with a higher standard one would restrict how many potential matches are available.

 

Another problem is some shells prefer to remain small, strictly to encourage interaction with their members. It's a double-edged sword in this sense. Keeping it small means it's easier to make lasting bonds with one another and promote character growth. But this also means creating the traditional niche that doesn't want to interact with others outside their comfort zone. If the RP community is to thrive in 2.0 this must be somehow addressed. All of this comes down to us as players too. I've noticed in particular that very often a request is made for help, be it an in-game thing, or perhaps just a request for RP. The request can often go unanswered by anyone. Many of us are off in our own world, instanced if you will, that we ignore these requests. Is it because we don't know them? Is it because we're busy? I don't know. One thing I am pleased to notice is the community seems to be far more willing to accept certain things, even stuff beyond what might be our comfort zones. Tonight I made that decision myself too regarding something that everyone seemed to be okay with, but I was not. I'd only be hurting myself to do so, and in the end it didn't seem like it was that big of a deal either.

 

Forgive me if I'm rambling, very tired but hope some of this helps.

[Smiling River]

From the view of just another RPer one problem with multiple linkshells in existence is most often they tend to follow the same theme. Though fine, it limits the possible options that a roleplayer has for compatible linkshells when the theme is repeated. A heavy view of this is the mercenary theme. There's plenty of these linkshells around to choose from but what if your character or play style doesn't fit this? Ultimately you're left to scour around for one that does, or make your own. That is where the influx of linkshells comes from, people trying to either create their own personalized theme, or follow a popular one. The difference however could be in the set rules. Lore between varying shells tends to differ, some will accept one thing, but another won't. The theme could be right but the rules are not. Isn't to say we all must throw our standards out the window but with a higher standard one would restrict how many potential matches are available.

 

Another problem is some shells prefer to remain small, strictly to encourage interaction with their members. It's a double-edged sword in this sense. Keeping it small means it's easier to make lasting bonds with one another and promote character growth. But this also means creating the traditional niche that doesn't want to interact with others outside their comfort zone. If the RP community is to thrive in 2.0 this must be somehow addressed. All of this comes down to us as players too. I've noticed in particular that very often a request is made for help, be it an in-game thing, or perhaps just a request for RP. The request can often go unanswered by anyone. Many of us are off in our own world, instanced if you will, that we ignore these requests. Is it because we don't know them? Is it because we're busy? I don't know. One thing I am pleased to notice is the community seems to be far more willing to accept certain things, even stuff beyond what might be our comfort zones. Tonight I made that decision myself too regarding something that everyone seemed to be okay with, but I was not. I'd only be hurting myself to do so, and in the end it didn't seem like it was that big of a deal either.

 

Forgive me if I'm rambling, very tired but hope some of this helps.

 

Hm, well this points out a lot of issues that you are seeing as a player, yet proposes no solutions.

 

Momo, I am sorry but I just don't see things the way you do, and it irks me that you speak on behalf of some 'group', or at least it sounds that way. Who is "we"? Do not attempt to unify all into one, because not everyone shares your point of view. Sorry but it's really annoying to me when people speak on behalf of the community. Not everyone agrees that the community is broken. Not everyone agrees that the community is broken in the ways you think it's broken. Not everyone wants what you want. Everyone is their own person... so speak for yourself, not the community. It may be a lot difficult to defend your views when you do not assume they are shared by everyone.

 

Aside from that, honestly if we want to better the community beyond just the clean up/reorganization we need to define what "better" is... what would be an ideal, and only then rally and march toward it. Otherwise even if we put in effort, we'll still be disjointed as a community since we're going 10 different ways.

 

As for all linkshells joining one Free Company... on what basis would this be? Simply all RP groups? So Knights and thieves in the same one? Sorry if it seems like I am trying to shoot holes through it. It's true, by the way, I am. This is a way to find if this stuff would really fly, though. Anyway, IC it doesn't make sense it seems to me... OOC it can cause tension to have people who clearly do not agree on basic RP playstyle somehow under the same roof. I would rather work from IC on. If my LS bonds closely enough with others, and if OOC'ly we have similar RP styles, then we can form a Free Company together. Makes sense to me, instead of metagaming and tossing everyone together just for the sake of what? I'd rather not be frustrated in-game. I am sure folks on all sides can agree on that.

[SamusKnight2K]

Sorry Oskar, wish I could offer solutions but I can't entirely think clearly right now due to being tired. My post was just to point out a few of the problems, that's all. Opinions were wanted, so it's what I gave. I'm afraid creating solutions to these aren't my strong suit but I'll try:

 

On the thing about multiple linkshells if there was a way to try more diverse themes rather than falling back on the same one time and time again then it might help. Again like I said the mercenary approach seems to be a pretty popular one. And given the state of the realm is in the midst of a war it isn't too far fetched to follow this route. A few linkshells I know tried to stray from it but didn't really appear to make the cut. I suppose the best approach might be to create a poll asking what the community is most interested in, what type of shell would appeal to them the most. From there, one can get a better grasp at what may bring in the most members. Maybe two shells with similar interests can form a negotiation on their rules/view on lore then merge into one another. It's a give/take relationship.

 

Now with small community shells this could be tough. Getting past our comfort zones and interacting with a wider array of RPers is quite possibly the best way. Like I said people are more open to accepting certain things than they did at launch so if we can find ways to work together on this it may make it easier to get along with each other. As for helping even giving a "Sorry I'm doing this right now." response would mean a lot. Make an effort to at least show you heard the person and respond. The time someone wastes waiting for a reply could be better spent finding another party, or coming up with a different activity to do. One shell could have 30+ members active at any given time and maybe only 3 will respond. What about the other 27 people? Are they all just AFK? Expressing interest in what others around us are doing or coming to their aid is what builds a stronger community.

 

Hope these responses help more. If not I'm sorry. I think I'm going to bed now before I faceplant on my keyboard.

[SamusKnight2K]

Sorry Oskar, wish I could offer solutions but I can't entirely think clearly right now due to being tired. My post was just to point out a few of the problems, that's all. Opinions were wanted, so it's what I gave. I'm afraid creating solutions to these aren't my strong suit but I'll try:

 

On the thing about multiple linkshells if there was a way to try more diverse themes rather than falling back on the same one time and time again then it might help. Again like I said the mercenary approach seems to be a pretty popular one. And given the state of the realm is in the midst of a war it isn't too far fetched to follow this route. A few linkshells I know tried to stray from it but didn't really appear to make the cut. I suppose the best approach might be to create a poll asking what the community is most interested in, what type of shell would appeal to them the most. From there, one can get a better grasp at what may bring in the most members. Maybe two shells with similar interests can form a negotiation on their rules/view on lore then merge into one another. It's a give/take relationship.

 

Now with small community shells this could be tough. Getting past our comfort zones and interacting with a wider array of RPers is quite possibly the best way. Like I said people are more open to accepting certain things than they did at launch so if we can find ways to work together on this it may make it easier to get along with each other. As for helping even giving a "Sorry I'm doing this right now." response would mean a lot. Make an effort to at least show you heard the person and respond. The time someone wastes waiting for a reply could be better spent finding another party, or coming up with a different activity to do. One shell could have 30+ members active at any given time and maybe only 3 will respond. What about the other 27 people? Are they all just AFK? Expressing interest in what others around us are doing or coming to their aid is what builds a stronger community.

 

Hope these responses help more. If not I'm sorry. I think I'm going to bed now before I faceplant on my keyboard.

[Mtoto Wamoto]

With only six months left until the release of Final Fantasy XIV, version 2.0, the community at large is left with a rather daunting task and a winding road filled with a myriad of obstacles we are in dire need to overcome. While there are several details regarding the future of the game that are still under wraps by the development team, we have a general understanding as to which direction the game is heading in, and more importantly, what's in store for us: the role-players who populate the game world.

 

However, before we can begin to take a serious look at the future, we need to look at the current condition of the community as well as the present and ongoing challenges we face.

 

Up to this point, the RPC has allowed new role-players and seasoned role-players alike to find a home within the over-arching community of Balmung and Besaid. It has provided players with a central hub via forums to discuss, advertise, and plan events for the player base. However, even with the strides the RPC has taken and the efforts it has made, it still seems to be lacking in many aspects and hindered by others. Among these aspects is the sense of community, the presence of ongoing and engaging activity, a sense of order, and of course, the presence of communication, not only between the role-players, but the linkshell leaders as well.

 

Communication

---

Communication is perhaps the bane of the current iteration of the RPC, or to be more direct, the lack thereof between the heads of the linkshells and the bodies they represent. Many of the shells remaining have adopted a rather wolf pack mentality, that meaning they feed for and care for only the members within their established groups. This, of course, is a natural occurrence and was bound to happen given the nature and traditions of linkshells to begin with. However natural forming or not, it does present a set of issues that sneer in the face of unity and growth which the community so desperately needs. Issues such as OOC cross shell conflict, competition for self-gain, linkshell isolation and seclusion, needless and biased stereotyping and discrimination, and blown up and out of proportion egos have all risen and taken deep root within our floundering community. Whatâs left is little more than a shattered field of glass that was once intended to be a mural and mosaic of art; while those who have the ability to help piece it all back together are either too content with their current positions or too tired to try to make any change. Whatâs worse is that there are still others who hinge on the notion that version 2.0 will come and save us with the influx of new players. The simple truth to the latter is that if the problems present now are still present in the near future, we would have solved nothing and instead left the issues to fester and form a bigger beast to tackle. Organizing two hundred people is a challenge without proper communication and structure. Organizing nearly a thousand without either is nigh impossible.

 

The issue and solution here lies in the hands of communication. The heads of the shells need to come together and discuss the current state of things, evaluate what they as leaders can do to help the community return to a state of growth and unity, and lastly, make plans and follow through with them. The talk needs to be there, but talks with no action are just words being said for nothing. The linkshell leaders as a whole need to realize that they have an obligation to the community they represent, that is to say, the heads of these guilds need to be in constant communication with one another to help better the role-playing community, the RPC (or what they choose to use as the central hub for the player-base), and ensure that we as a minority are able to stand tall in the coming surge of players and face of discrimination and adversity. Recall, we are not a popular group to begin with simply due to preconceived notions and judgement surrounding us as role-players.

 

Sense of Community and Order

---

Moving along and tying together with the previous point of interest is the aspect of having a sense of community and order. To begin, let's first look at what it truly means to be a community. By definition, a community is a unified body of individuals joined together by common goals, interests, policies, history and joint ownership and participation. By that definition, no single person can claim ownership over a community nor can they simply stand idle while twiddling their thumbs. To this end, the role-playing community is owned as a whole by the members therein and formed on the grounds they agree upon. What is acceptable as proper role-play and behaved conduct should be clearly defined by way of charter formed via unanimous decision of the role-players within. This means everybody has a voice in regards to the standards we as role-players should set and follow.

 

Does this mean that various styles of role-play can't continue to coexist? Not at all. Instead what this entails is a social norm that the community has established to prevent players from deviating towards extreme ends of the spectrum. Examples include unexplainable demonic powers and abilities, ancient powerful relics that can create and destroy worlds, magic which has not been seen, confirmed, nor accepted by the lore established by either Square Enix or the community at large, and etc. Without order within the community and a complete understanding of the standards set in place, players are left in a rather free flow position where they can role-play in whatever manner they please, often bringing up cases like the examples listed above. Examples like these, in turn, lead to the ousting of members from the community for being different when there was nothing in place to say that they couldn't be in the first place. Having an established order to begin with helps prevent this from occurring.

 

On a related note, the linkshells currently found on the server all vary in different ways. From leadership style to structure and organization all the way down to role-play styles. Each linkshell should be entitled to be able to role-play in a manner that they please so long as it stays within reason to what the community and the lore has established. Furthermore, if a linkshell forms sub-communities and micro-communities within the overarching community, they should be able to so long as it does not adversely affect or undermine the sanctity of the larger community. An example of this would be a linkshell intentionally shutting themselves away OOCly and ICly from the rest of the overall role-play population for self-gain or creating a means to place one person above the rest of the community through subterfuge.

 

Should there be a council of leaders to help establish a greater sense of community and order? Yes and no. Ideally, the leaders of the shells should be communicating together to establish potential role-play avenues as well as plan and discuss ideas. This can be done on both fields of character, and regardless on where it starts, what matters is that content is being developed that is agreed upon and is for the greater good of the community, not the self gain of one party or individual. If a council is formed, the only authority it would have would be over the members the linkshell leaders therein manage. It should not act as a central body of government, but rather serve as an assembly of leaders called together for consultation, deliberation, discussion, and advising.

 

Revamp of the RPC

---

 

Spearheading into what is the final part of this post is what has already been stated by others in minute details and in redundant repetition.

 

The RPC as a website serves the function it is currently in place to do, that is, it acts as a central hub for members of the community to discuss, plan, and advertise events made by role-players for their fellow role-players. It also serves as a means for potential role-players to find groups they can better associate themselves with while still being part of the overall community. The problem with the RPC isn't about how clean or cluttered it is, the problem rests in the fact that it does not receive the proper support it should be getting and that the moderation and the administration is not there, leaving only one person to effectively handle things under the hood. What needs to happen is that more people need to take a stand to assist in rebuilding the website to be friendly, lively, and active place.

 

Having a shell like Intermission more intertwined with the inner workings of the RPC would help bolster the community because there would be moderators present who are able to advise and direct new players towards the community and places of interest both in and out of game and character. Consolidate the resources available.

 

In regards to Free Companies, there isn't much that can be truly said at the moment simply due to the lack of information available to us. We only know a handful of details, and even then, that may just be the tip of the proverbial iceberg. It's too early to decide a theme when we hardly know our options, but it would be naive of us to simply put it off and wait.

 

(Quite honestly, another thread is needed for the last topic and I'm simply far too tired to go into further detail of my thoughts on a Free Company. Expect a new thread either later today or tomorrow)

[Momo]

I say we, because I mean we as a community. If we don't start acting like one now, when will we start? So I will continue to say we, because I never said anything was broken, I said that we need to talk about to better it. Better, meaning make it more functional, make it more welcoming to new members, make it more open to trying new things, make it more open to communication, just make it more than what it is now, and essentially it will be a better place for it. Certainly not everyone agrees that it needs betterment, but it seems to me from reading those interviews that Verence did, people do believe it needs to be bettered in many of the ways I mentioned, and others here are mentioning, and there is nothing wrong with making a community better, so there should be nothing against it.

 

I am not offended that you say that Oskar, because that's how you often are in these sorts of threads, but I also won't apologize for something that I am doing deliberately with thought put into it. We need this, to work together to bring about change, and we can outline as much as we want, but I think that we are beating a dead horse when we say things like, lets take a poll, let's outline thus again, and all I hear is lets do the same thing we've always done until we areso tired of it for the third time that we give up. I urge us to make decisions, because whatever a single person believes, it seems fairly c,ear that something has to get done so that we can follow a path that leads us to an RPC we can all enjoy. This thread is nearly identical to the last two, and will end just the same if someone doesn't make some choices, hard or not, on what needs to be done.

 

I'm not speaking from the standpoint of a shell, I'm not ONLY speaking from the standpoint of the current community, I am also speaking from the standpoint of fellow future RPers who will come to this site, and think all the negative things about this site that we've discussed and run for their lives away from such a great opportunity that we have here. So, again, I urge us to make a decision on something.

[Kylin]

I agree with a lot of whatâs been said so far, especially about the lack of communication that exists. Itâs sad when you know just about every Rperâs name by heart but havenât interacted with so many of them on any level (IC or OOC). The âwolf packâ mentality most definitely exists and has for quite some time.

 

Regarding âcleaning up:â I have actually tried multiple methods to do this (not counting just the aesthetic changes to the site). There was a new RP linkshell roll call thread posted several months ago. Not one person responded though (I since deleted the post as a result during the site overhaul). Iâve also sent emails to some of the more obscure RP linkshells, particularly the âlightâ ones in which so many of us have never even seen/heard of. One of their leaders insisted that he wanted to keep the shell active (even though by anyone elseâs definition, it clearly wasnât/isnât). So I canât really up and remove it from the list just because I /think/ itâs inactive.

 

The old inactive moderation team has been wiped and replaced with some more active mods to help oversee the forums as well. So thatâs helped a bit considering you can actually see moderators posting now.

 

Regarding linkshell leader stuff: As I said on another past thread, Iâm not opposed to adding a LS leader forum section. However, keep in mind weâve tried this before. While Iâve since buried most of the threads there, I can tell you that the section got really ugly toward the end. Elitism reared its ugly head and some smaller linkshells were even dubbed âlolshellsâ just because they had a different style than some of the other more established shells at the time. Politics swirled out of control and it caused an intense amount of drama that killed friendships and caused the community itself to become incredibly turned off from this site. This is why the original RPC charter was killed. If weâre going to do a round two of this, we need to ensure the past doesnât repeat itself somehow.

 

I also agree with Mtoto about the community being oversaturated with linkshells, considering the current size of the community right now. Too many leaders, not enough followers. This is why, after 6 months of struggling, I had no choice but to dissolve Archavalon. As you can see though, Iâve kept the noble house concept alive IC even without the shell and plan to take the story to a glorious finish nonetheless >.>. Itâs extremely difficult to compete with already established shells, no matter how active you are in the community or how aggressive you are in recruitment or how experienced you are in leading shells. However, what can really be done about that? Nobody has any right to tell another RP group that they shouldnât exist. Nobody is going agree to a merge since it will kill their own concept and undo all of their own hard work. We have no right to put a âcapâ on how many RP shells the server can have, and even if we did, we couldnât enforce it.

 

This site has definitely picked up activity in recent months compared to the stale atmosphere that existed for a long time not too long after launch. Communication is on the increase, though it still needs a little push here and there. Iâm still shocked when I learn that some Rpers have never even heard of the RPC. I meanâ¦maybe I have a lot of bias due to being an administrator. But everyone playing this game has a PC. Everyone playing has Internet access. Therefore, everyone playing has access to these forums. Yet so many donât utilize them. Itâs frustrating to repeat information over and over again (whether itâs about an upcoming event or an important thread like this) when all the information is right here on these forums to begin with. I know itâs impossible to force people to come here every now and then, but itâs frustrating when people just outright refuse to check out the forums out of laziness or whatever. In this day and age, this type of global communication is imperative in any MMO. This is why so many linkshells require prospective members to register/apply through a website.

 

I also wanted to take this moment to mention other fansites. When the RPC first launched, I had managed to snag support from Zam and Eorzeapedia (now Gamer Escape), along with a host of other smaller fan sites. Our server choice was promoted on the front page of many of these sites. The administration of these sites have been supportive in other ways as well. Zam gave us a wiki page, Eorzeapedia gave us a podcast, both offered to set us up an IRC room if needed, and more. Obviously these other sites will be imperative to our future promotional efforts, though their own activity has dwindled quite a bit. In regards to an earlier question about getting on SEâs fansite page, I have indeed tried that. Pikko, an admin at Zam, sent an email about us to her SE contact. No response was ever made however ; ;. Gamer Escape asked SE directly in an interview about their plans for the RP community. Thatâs when we got our first official response related to a RP server, and it was later confirmed that we were indeed getting one in 2.0. That leads me to another point (I know Iâm all over the place right now ).

 

Balmung may very well not be our final home server. When SE does designate a RP server, it may be a brand new one that comes with PS3 launch. This makes promoting Balmung a very tricky situation. Also, while I have no issue at all jumping to the official RP server when it's given, I fear that not all Rpers will share that sentiment. We have to be prepared that some may stay behind to stay with their OOC pals, further splitting the community.

[Shuck]

Couple things:

 

 

As for all linkshells joining one Free Company... on what basis would this be? Simply all RP groups? So Knights and thieves in the same one? Sorry if it seems like I am trying to shoot holes through it. It's true, by the way, I am. This is a way to find if this stuff would really fly, though. Anyway, IC it doesn't make sense it seems to me... OOC it can cause tension to have people who clearly do not agree on basic RP playstyle somehow under the same roof. I would rather work from IC on. If my LS bonds closely enough with others, and if OOC'ly we have similar RP styles, then we can form a Free Company together. Makes sense to me, instead of metagaming and tossing everyone together just for the sake of what? I'd rather not be frustrated in-game. I am sure folks on all sides can agree on that.

 

From an IC perspective, any group deciding that they would rather fly solo than unite in the face of an extinction event on the continent would, and frankly should be shunned. Distinctions of nobility kind of cease to matter when someone is gunning for a complete and total Terminator 2 style cleansing.

 

From an OOC perspective: I've said this on intermission, and I'll say it again. If you're expecting people's egos, grudges, and highschool style bickering to get in the way of cooperation that benefits everyone, then you're expecting entirely too little from the community at large. As far as becoming "frustrated" while playing, I'm not entirely sure what the issue is. Are you frustrated by the other members of the Grand Company you currently belong to? Is it required that you interact, at length, with all members of said company? Does the mere existence of other players in the game world rub you the wrong way?

 

By your own admittance, you're trying to poke holes, but these are some incredibly weak arguments against a case that has the community's best interests in mind.

 

Regarding linkshell leader stuff: As I said on another past thread, Iâm not opposed to adding a LS leader forum section. However, keep in mind weâve tried this before. While Iâve since buried most of the threads there, I can tell you that the section got really ugly toward the end. Elitism reared its ugly head and some smaller linkshells were even dubbed âlolshellsâ just because they had a different style than some of the other more established shells at the time. Politics swirled out of control and it caused an intense amount of drama that killed friendships and caused the community itself to become incredibly turned off from this site. This is why the original RPC charter was killed. If weâre going to do a round two of this, we need to ensure the past doesnât repeat itself somehow.

 

And I've got a question on this: Was that kind of behavior a bannable offense in the past? If not, why not?

[Eva]

I'm still of a mindset that the RPC isn't something that a linkshell necessarily "joins" but rather is a hub for all RPers from all different communities to come together to discuss that. I don't think mandating this in any form is a good idea, for a myriad of reasons which really should be obvious enough that there be no need to outline them.

 

I have little else to contribute at this point that can be deemed constructive, though I will add that I think that if any real progress is to come of this discussion, the best thing that can be done by everyone is to omit any use of quote tags. These sorts of things almost inherantly wind up either being intended as jabs, or misperceived as such, and progress is stymied as good discussions turn into pissing contests. And this is why these sorts of threads seem to fall off track. That's just a suggestion though...

[Smiling River]

Isaac you are creating a strawman argument when you say that a group flying solo should be shunned, because no one made that case. I made a point against uniting everyone under a single Free Company, simply because of the OOC reason that we all self-identify ourselves as Role-Players in this game. I never made a case for solo groups. What I have said though, is that I aim to unify ICâly. I am not apposed to multiple Linkshells sharing a Free company, it just has to make sense ICâly.

 

If a linkshell is a bunch of Imperials who aim to help the Empire, would they still be in this company? You speak of uniting people as if every character has the same goal. Some want to fight, others want to just live on without much care, while others prepare for post-war conditions⦠there are many possibilities there, and uniting everyone not only doesnât make sense ICâly it also limits future RP linkshells. For example we have no Imperial LS atm, but in the future if all Linkshells unite under one Free Company, there may never be one, if you define the members of that FC as your RP community. It would be pretty implausible for them to join and remain with some other groups. And we are not even sure how the FCs will work so itâs hard to say how much anyone will have to interact with one another, but if there are multiple FCs, why would one company join the same FC that has their opposition? Itâs not like SE intends to imply that all people of Eorzea must join one FC to unite everyone under one flag⦠So the whole unite or die logic doesnât quite work⦠it matters how you unite, why, with whom etc⦠because the fact that there can be a number of GCs/FCs indicates that the setting of the game isnât as drastic, else there would theoretically be only one GC, and so on.

 

You use the words âeveryoneâ and âcommunityâs best interestâ in your OOC reply to this issue there⦠but Iâve not yet any poll up with significant number of voters to indicate communityâs desire for any of this. Nor do I think popular opinion is automatically the right opinion. Even if 99% vote for something, it can still be wrong. Much like Momo, it seems you reply on the support of the âcommunityâ behind you to cushion your point of view. Guess what? I am part of the community to. I feel like your entire post marginalizes those who are not on the same page with the premise of some of the things âin the name of the communityâ that have been said here. That will only divide the RP community further, if you make people with different views feel like outsiders.

 

And yeah, mere existence of certain RP does rub me the wrong way at times. I know a number of people donât mind, but I need for it to be at a certain quality (from my point of view) for me to enjoy it. Itâs like watching a movie where you can see the awkward dialogue and the predictable plots and so on versus a movie which completely drags you in and hours fly by without you noticing. Thatâs one way I can describe how I feel about other styles of RP vs one I am comfortable with.

 

But then, I am pretty satisfied with the RPC framing the picture, instead of being used as a brush. We can agree on basic changes, but beyond that, I think that as a community of role-players, itâs best to not try to regulate to a degree which people here propose. Much like Eva, I feel that Iâve nothing left to add, as this sort of discussion seems to be pushing out decent. I just hope you guys donât take that dive, of putting a fence around whatever you think the community represents and pushing people out because they donât agree. Itâs arguably one of the reasons the RPC took a plunge some time in the past, and while specific points of arguments have changed, that ideology seems to be creeping up again, so Iâll just excuse myself and do whatever I think would work instead.

[Shuck]

Piece by piece then. With respect to what Eva had said, these are not intended to be jabs. Just a point-by-point discussion. Here we go:

 

Isaac you are creating a strawman argument when you say that a group flying solo should be shunned' date=' because no one made that case. I made a point against uniting everyone under a single Free Company, simply because of the OOC reason that we all self-identify ourselves as Role-Players in this game. I never made a case for solo groups. What I have said though, is that I aim to unify ICâly. I am not apposed to multiple Linkshells sharing a Free company, it just has to make sense ICâly. [/quote']

 

Right. And that's what I addressed. Your initial point, if you'll remember, used the example of a division between "knights and thieves", suggesting that one group would intentionally avoid any kind of cooperation with another, opting to "fly solo" rather than unite under a common banner.

 

In contrast, a strawman fallacy is erecting a point, and then attacking it. Which isn't what happened. Not even kind of.

 

Now, if survival as a realm isn't a good enough IC reason to put the active shells in Eorzea under one tent, I don't know what is. It's not as if the military in the real world is made of front-line fighters, and nothing but. There's a huge swath of professions and skill sets that make the whole thing work, which means there's a whole swath of necessary professions to make said Free Company work. There's a lot of talk of this not making sense "IC'ly", but frankly, open competition between Free Companies when the world is falling apart makes even less.

 

If a linkshell is a bunch of Imperials who aim to help the Empire, would they still be in this company? You speak of uniting people as if every character has the same goal.

 

We don't have any. That kind of concern is really not one we need to look at, given that there's...you know, no one in that corner.

 

Some want to fight, others want to just live on without much care, while others prepare for post-war conditions⦠there are many possibilities there, and uniting everyone not only doesnât make sense ICâly it also limits future RP linkshells.

 

First bit: Which is fine and dandy, save for that whole extinction event thing. No one's forcing anyone to hop on board this idea, so those that don't care, for whatever crazy reason, about life ending on the continent are free to abscond.

 

Second bit: How...do you figure that it limits the creation of future roleplaying shells? That's totally inexplicable. The creation of an umbrella group does not preclude things existing outside of said umbrella. Think on it this way: Your umbrella is Everwatch. Other shells exist outside of Everwatch. In fact, all other shells in the community exist outside of Everwatch. The existence of your shell does not make it impossible for other shells to exist.

 

Therefore, a larger organization, made of many shells, would not keep other organizations from popping up.

 

If you could explain this point of yours a bit further, I'd appreciate it.

 

For example we have no Imperial LS atm, but in the future if all Linkshells unite under one Free Company, there may never be one, if you define the members of that FC as your RP community. It would be pretty implausible for them to join and remain with some other groups. And we are not even sure how the FCs will work so itâs hard to say how much anyone will have to interact with one another, but if there are multiple FCs, why would one company join the same FC that has their opposition? Itâs not like SE intends to imply that all people of Eorzea must join one FC to unite everyone under one flag⦠So the whole unite or die logic doesnât quite work⦠it matters how you unite, why, with whom etc⦠because the fact that there can be a number of GCs/FCs indicates that the setting of the game isnât as drastic, else there would theoretically be only one GC, and so on.

 

Those are some incredibly large leaps of logic. Why does an umbrella organization equate to exclusivity to you? Where was that suggested? How are you arriving at that conclusion?

 

I can't even begin to penetrate the last half of this paragraph. It just straight doesn't make sense. Maybe you can elaborate?

 

You use the words âeveryoneâ and âcommunityâs best interestâ in your OOC reply to this issue there⦠but Iâve not yet any poll up with significant number of voters to indicate communityâs desire for any of this. Nor do I think popular opinion is automatically the right opinion. Even if 99% vote for something, it can still be wrong. Much like Momo, it seems you reply on the support of the âcommunityâ behind you to cushion your point of view. Guess what? I am part of the community to. I feel like your entire post marginalizes those who are not on the same page with the premise of some of the things âin the name of the communityâ that have been said here. That will only divide the RP community further, if you make people with different views feel like outsiders.

 

To clarify, I never said "everyone", but a prominent force in the world composed of roleplayers and their linkshells raises our visibility to newcomers, and that is in the best interest of the community. Any argument to the contrary is either shortsighted, or straight false.

 

Without new people, the community as a whole dies. Without visibility, we don't catch the eye of new people. Simple. It's not my intention to marginalize anyone. Quite the opposite. Bringing folks together under a larger umbrella breaks down those sorts of self-imposed, cliquish barriers that naturally pop up from time to time. If someone doesn't want in? Well, no one's twisting their arm.

 

And yeah, mere existence of certain RP does rub me the wrong way at times. I know a number of people donât mind, but I need for it to be at a certain quality (from my point of view) for me to enjoy it. Itâs like watching a movie where you can see the awkward dialogue and the predictable plots and so on versus a movie which completely drags you in and hours fly by without you noticing. Thatâs one way I can describe how I feel about other styles of RP vs one I am comfortable with.

 

Not really what I asked, but ok, we'll go from here: To me, that sounds like a personal issue, and not one that needs to be aired in this discussion. I'm sure that there are people who would say the same of any kind of Everwatch event, what with the quality of storytelling being entirely subjective and all.

 

However, these folks who may think the same of your stuff? They all carry on just fine, from what I can see. You can do that too.

 

But then, I am pretty satisfied with the RPC framing the picture, instead of being used as a brush. We can agree on basic changes, but beyond that, I think that as a community of role-players, itâs best to not try to regulate to a degree which people here propose. Much like Eva, I feel that Iâve nothing left to add, as this sort of discussion seems to be pushing out decent. I just hope you guys donât take that dive, of putting a fence around whatever you think the community represents and pushing people out because they donât agree. Itâs arguably one of the reasons the RPC took a plunge some time in the past, and while specific points of arguments have changed, that ideology seems to be creeping up again, so Iâll just excuse myself and do whatever I think would work instead.

 

That's just melodramatic. No one's being pushed out, people are being invited in. The reason for unification makes sense. It's written plainly in the game's lore: You come together, you live. In an OOC sense? Who /doesn't/ benefit from this? Who looses out on a greater organization working toward a common goal? Sharing resources?

 

I think the issue you're running into is that the case against an in-game unification of players is just kind of flimsy. There's a ton of check marks in the "Pro" column, and one tiny mark being "Sometimes, I don't agree with stuff" in the "Con" column.

 

That being said? Once again, no one is making you sign on. No one is making anyone sign on.

[NKato]

That's just melodramatic. No one's being pushed out, people are being invited in. The reason for unification makes sense. It's written plainly in the game's lore: You come together, you live. In an OOC sense? Who /doesn't/ benefit from this? Who looses out on a greater organization working toward a common goal? Sharing resources?

 

I think the issue you're running into is that the case against an in-game unification of players is just kind of flimsy. There's a ton of check marks in the "Pro" column, and one tiny mark being "Sometimes, I don't agree with stuff" in the "Con" column.

 

That being said? Once again, no one is making you sign on. No one is making anyone sign on.

 

Eh...when you look at me and my issues with the community, I'd have to disagree with your position regarding the whole "no one being pushed out" part.

 

However, I feel that a restructure would be best planned for 2.0, and made to take into account the plethora of new features in the game. Such as dueling, which can also serve as a proper conflict resolution system, as opposed to simply RPing it out and it ending up with two people still upset at each other - though RPing it out to a conclusion is doable provided both parties had it planned out. (This is, in my opinion, one of the problems that continues to periodically rear its ugly head in XIV)

 

On the other hand, I'm also more concerned about whether or not linkshells/free companies will talk to each other more often in 2.0 than they have in the past. I'm talking about inter-guild events, story arcs, etc that take into account multiple parties, instead of just one or two.

 

The key to people understanding one another is consistent, regular interaction, regardless of the setting. You can't "know" the person or groups if you've interacted with them a handful of times with limited progress.

 

The biggest pitfall as I see it with 2.0 and the RP community, is seeing the same shtick repeated as what we had to go through in the first eight months of the game. That could lead to another "isolation" of the community by grouping, if left unaccounted for.