PVP as an RP element...?

[YesGood]

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Either way, I don't feel that a PVP duel detracts from Roleplay. In fact, RP almost always seem to be derailed when things devolve into text-based fights, even when done by the most expert roleplayers with the best intentions. People on the sidelines inevitably will try to get involved, and likely be ignored. People instinctively resort to self-preservation and almost no one can subconsciously agree on what a 'expert' level entails. People who normally roleplay as open novices, still manage somehow to elude veterans, and will continue to do so. And, along with everything else, it takes time. If it happens with a group of other people and those people aren't involved in the fight itself, they're stuck sitting there watching you pound out paragraph after paragraph, move after move, and if they try to get involved and -aren't- ignored, things can suddenly become uncomfortably imbalanced.

 

 

Bolded the part that happened to me when I was RPing with Shurin and we encountered Deirdre and Navei out in the boonies.

 

Tried to resolve it through OOC discussion in /tell, that went nowhere. I threw up my arms in exasperation and just played along what I could.

 

To be honest, examples like these are why I've decided to give up on trying to enjoy roleplay on Balmung. It's just not worth the hassle anymore.

 

As I mentioned further above, GMing will not be tolerated when it comes to anything RP, including sparring. The reason you were ignored was because of that fact, and because of the rude OOC comments you made.

 

You really have no argument here, if anything you are an example of why things go awry.

....

 

Wow. I'm not even going to dignify that blatant accusation with a response. All I was trying to do was illustrate the lack of an appropriate resolution to the issue while we were roleplaying at that point in time.

 

I don't like it when two actors can't even improvise to produce a good performance, and it ends up being a hilariously god-awful act that even a five-year old child could surpass.

 

That said, PVP should be taken as an optional, serious RP mechanic.

 

Alright guys, enough. Lets not derail the topic please.

 

 I think that whatever happened there is fairly an example of what I mean by people perceiving something as GMing whether or not it's intentional, based on their role in a situation. Not going into that, not going to continue responding in this thread beyond: PVP, if it is available, should be 'taken as an optional, serious RP mechanic' and one more-- not be continuously spoken down on in case new RP'ers want to at least try it and fear not being taken seriously for giving it a shot, or feel 'excluded' by existing, older members of the RPC that they may generally want to get to know. Saying "Everyone should do things their own way" is stifled by "But I think it's stupid and a waste of time and no one should do it."

 

Peer pressure is no bueno.

[Eva]

This is more of an aside, but I felt it was relevant.

 

I'm unfamiliar with the incident in dispute, however many times RPers will be - for whatever reason - enacting their combat/events in a place that is not actually where they are physically located.  As we do not always have the luxury of RPing in a bubble, we have often stated that a particular out-of-the-way area is to be treated as a linkshell's private training base, to use an example from my own history.

 

I'm not assuming this was the case, but I just wanted to offer a possible explanation why one might be ignored if involving him-or-herself with RP in progress.  A simple explanation that it was not open RP would probably have been more proper, if that was the case.  Sometimes it's interesting to try and involve yourself with another group's ongoing RP scenario as it adds a feeling of realism and community to the thing.  Other times events are treated as happening within a bubble for some reason or another.

 

To reiterate - because I know someone is going to be all, "zomg that's not what happened!!!" - I make no assumptions about how this transpired but only wanted to offer an alternative viewpoint.  I don't really need nor wish to know the details since it seems like a bit of a sour subject anyway.

[Momo]

I've always been curious about these sorts of situations, and how everyone deals with them.  I personally have noticed that there is a general consensus that you actual level and gear do contribute to your character, because I have seen a great deal many people choosing that this is how they want to play, and therefore making the rest of us choose a similar path so that it doesn't come into conflict.  I am not placing negative or positive connotations on that, just stating it as an observation.

 

I personally am a fun-seeking, relaxed gamer, who enjoys RP, and can play the game for it's gaming quality, but am shit at getting to those top tier performance battles without someone guiding me most of the way.  That being said, I didn't really get to have a character I would have liked, because most people seemed to regard your ability IC the same as your actual ability, and I think with the coming ARR, I will just say screw it and make the character I want without worry of others not taking him seriously enough because he doesn't have the best gear or skill set or whatevs anyone wants to figure in.  Once again, this is more a declaration of personal freedom to do what one wants, rather than looking down on the practices previously taken for custom, I can say I had plenty of fun RPing on FFXIV, so no hard feelings at all.

 

All that being said, I guess I will fall on the side of having no interest in PvP as a means of resolution to any IC disagreements, but then again, I would be willing to allow others to make it policy for themselves and have no hard feelings.  I suppose the fact that my character has always gotten along with most people, and is carefree by nature, has factored into a disinterest in even emotive battle, but figured I would cast a stone for one side anywho.  I also looked back at previous info releases, and found that this ultimately will play little to no part unless in the heat of the moment, one person looks at the other and says, "Let's take this to the arena then!" and means that in a "let's take this outside" sort of manner, due to as said above, the PvP areas are few and designated as far as we know.

[Rhio]

The downside of reading through this thread, from my perspective, is that I think to myself "oh, I could write a column about this." Then I realized I already did.

 

Generally speaking, for PvP to work as a fully proper mechanic, you have to either be willing to accept an outcome based on which character/class/whatever is better suited to PvP matches, or you have to go in with an expectation of one party or the other winning and then take actions to back it up. Neither one creates a very compelling game state. It's not that PvP can't work well as an addition to RP, merely that it generally doesn't.

 

That being said, if there's a way to make it clear that your character is accomplished in PvP, it would make sense that you're a bit better in a duel against another player than someone who spends all of their time fighting monsters.

[Moltove]

And I 100% understand the fact that one class would be better over the other and that is also where I disagree with Siobhain about being able to adapt to your weaknesses or the strengths of another class. In PvP, there are simply classes that dominate the other classes no matter what and that depends on how the balancing is done.

 

Take Lineage 2 for example...

EQ2 was the same way when PvP was introduced as Battlegrounds on PvE servers There was a Paladin and Mystic duo that dominated some grounds, actually. Some classes we're so OP that you had to throw waves at them, such as Brawler.

 

But I feel confident in saying that it won't be as much of a case in a RP community, since it seems we all have different levels of progression, so everyone could, effectively be a wildcard. Well, mostly.

 

I like the points mentioned about backing up your character's taunts. While RP fighting and PvP could be a solution in either way,I think it's most important to actually...I dunno, not be a bitch about it and cop out. But that's a different thing entirely, probably built for a thread named "RP Etiquette"

 

Otherwise, as this thread has shown, I think there's an interest in PvP here, and it should remain a choice. Maybe not an all the time thing, but it's certainly nice to mix things up a bit, especially if you know you and your opponent are evenly matched. More importantly, it should be met with the same respect as we give each other when RPing normally.

[Asyria]

PvP in ARR?

Woot!

 

As fun as PvP (especially organized guild vs guild or linkshell vs linkshell, in this case) an be, I could tell you a cautionary tale or two about how it can literally destroy guilds and rp alike on nothing but a misunderstanding or disagreement.

 

Gotta make sure everyone agrees to and abide by the terms of whatever is decided as far as the PvP itself goes and especially how the results of it should affect the storyline between and within the involved parties.