Mercer

That is your opinion on things, not facts. Others have put down evidence on why those solutions are unlikely to work. I've put down my own reasons why Balmung won't reopen anytime soon. Your argument boils down to not believing that smaller RP communities can offer the same experience as Balmung. Do we want to RP? Yes. Is there RP to be found elsewhere? Yes. Is this the perfect opportunity to create a second healthy community? Very yes. But we don't have to be the same as Balmung's community. We don't have to be as big. And if Balmung lost half of it's RPers it would still be flourishing. The RPC alone has over 10,000 accounts. If even a tenth of them were connected to another server it would be more than successful it would be flourishing. That doesn't include the other players that don't touch the forum. And having a second server that isn't connected to whatever SE designates as official is good as well, because of everyone moved to the new server it would already be locked as well if RPC account numbers are even half accurate.

Welp. Shit. That's basically what this means to me the more I read it again and again. Also OP, hope you didn't skim over those poll results EDIT: Don't forget about Gilgamesh's population *and* the other servers all on the same datacenter. Not just Balmung players connecting in either. This is a very good point as well but I would like to clarify that it's on a different server level. Correct me if I'm wrong, Merc, but from my understanding the instance servers are more like a server farm that is connected to all the other Aether servers. Realistically, there should be enough servers to handle the load. If we go by the server limit it should be able to handle 7,500 players per server. Divided up Aether should be able to handle that load.

So, thank you Kage for linking the official forum posts. It allowed me to go a bit deeper on the current problems facing Balmung on a hardware level. I refer to this post from 2013: http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/news/detail/dba4c2a0cdfc83e184ee0eaac3ab27ba2fe51b35 This post details what we currently know of the queue system and login information. 7,500-7,800 simultaneous logins. To put that into perspective... That means that right now Balmung has over 7,500 people logged in at all times. There is always a queue, no matter how minor. We know the current active population to be around 22,000 players thanks to previous processing of characters on the lodestone cross referenced with achievements and changes between patches. There are flaws in such an estimate, but they are usually seen as being on the low end of estimation. It is also inline with the login limits compared to where the other locked servers are sitting at. If we take the hopeful approach that SE doubled their server ability to 15,000 in the span of three years, we are still looking at a huge number of people trying to log in. And considering the 7,500 limit is close to what the smallest locked server is, I can't see that even being possible. So we're looking at during the biggest down time in the expansion 22,000 active players or more. That is going to increase with Stormblood and more people will be on for longer. I want to hammer that point down. 22,000+ trying to log on to Balmung at the same time. The queue times alone would be staggering. The stability of the realm and data center is going to be flaky. We have seen this happen with Heavensward. The population has grown by over 6,000 since 3.0. To be perfectly frank, I think shit is more real than we've given credit for.

What have I become Kage? What have I become?

The 25 thumbs up have to count for something? And yes, a fine petition, I daresay. I'm surprised the PVEers didn't burn me alive. I've had better with less page count. Never mind the fact that posters just below him disagreeing have 4 times the thumbs.

So he did make a thread and didn't want to link it because it's a flame war just like this thread? Why are we even in this thread again?

I'll address this point since I've been in the thick of helping create a platform for smaller communities and servers. I will take Mateus as the example, because it is the most popular option at the moment. The RP-C linkshell is growing actively. A secondary linkshell was put into place late last night to help handle the new players that are joining. New Free Companies are forming, players are transferring. Of the players that have reached out to join the community, there are over 200 active players. The Free Company list continues to grow as well, there are 5 stable companies and others are starting up now that there are more active players. This has been within a week of the original threads talking about the crisis and community leaders stepping up to show alternatives. These numbers are only going to grow as we get closer to SB and as the news spreads. There is a very real movement to grow the community on Mateus and the community leaders are doing everything they can to accommodate and give everyone that joins an opportunity to have a voice. The implication that such a movement is fruitless is insulting to the leaders and players putting their time and effort into making their servers a viable alternative. And I'm not just talking about Mateus here, I'm talking about Faerie, I'm talking about Jenova, I'm talking about all the other RP servers out there that have been going weak or strong for years. That's great news that the Mateus RP community is growing and creating a place for new RPers to roleplay. Where we differ is on whether the RP community as a whole should divide itself across multiple servers [thereby creating an artificial barrier that divides the community itself]. I hope many who transfer to Mateus realize the value and importance of having a vibrant, diverse, and active RP hub, and will transfer to Balmung when the server opens. We're all losing something by dividing the community across multiple servers. Ideally, SE will simply designate an official RP server, or simply lift the transfer restrictions soon -- rending all of this moot. Great, so what are you going to do about it? You mentioned Nero's post, but what have you done with petitioning to accomplish such things? Have you created your own petition for people to sign? Because I haven't seen one. Have you advertised Nero's thread so others can sign it? Because I haven't seen you link it. Have you tried to organize tumblr/reddit/twitter? Because I haven't seen you link it or post. So far what I have seen is that you disagree with what people are doing, saying that there should be an alternative and that's it. You are arguing in this thread as others bring up evidence and facts to back up their claims. You want SE to change how they are handling things but you're not following through. You have made your decision on what you believe is right and wrong, why are you not actively trying to get your agenda and goals done?

I'll address this point since I've been in the thick of helping create a platform for smaller communities and servers. I will take Mateus as the example, because it is the most popular option at the moment. The RP-C linkshell is growing actively. A secondary linkshell was put into place late last night to help handle the new players that are joining. New Free Companies are forming, players are transferring. Of the players that have reached out to join the community, there are over 200 active players. The Free Company list continues to grow as well, there are 5 stable companies and others are starting up now that there are more active players. This has been within a week of the original threads talking about the crisis and community leaders stepping up to show alternatives. These numbers are only going to grow as we get closer to SB and as the news spreads. There is a very real movement to grow the community on Mateus and the community leaders are doing everything they can to accommodate and give everyone that joins an opportunity to have a voice. The implication that such a movement is fruitless is insulting to the leaders and players putting their time and effort into making their servers a viable alternative. And I'm not just talking about Mateus here, I'm talking about Faerie, I'm talking about Jenova, I'm talking about all the other RP servers out there that have been going weak or strong for years.

What it seems to come down to is one or the other. Balmung stays the RP hub or SE tags another server as the RP hub. Since the former is unlikely, I recommend organizing for the latter. Which means YOU need to organize this. Other people in this thread disagree with you. Others agree with you. What it comes down to that you need to organize a like minded group to petition SE. Others will organize how they see fit for the best of the community. There is no single answer and eventually the correct one will rise to the top. You believe that faith should be put into SE to fix the problem or find an alternative. That is fine, please go and get support for this action. But for other people, they feel the wait for such action to take place, if it will take place, to be too much damage to the community. I feel that by neglecting new players and not giving an alternative we are doing far more damage. Balmung is a sprawling RP community, the perceived cost of promoting alternate avenues of RP is negligible. There is not going to be a universal answer or decision for this. It is plainly obvious through this thread that you have already made your decision. You have laid out arguments in this thread for people to follow you. Now it is up to you to get people to petition and bug people. It is up to you to inspire them and give them information to back up your theory.

Sig, what evidence do you have to support any of this outside of hopeful idealism? There are people more experienced than you in actual network/software administration. There are people here who have attempted to do the very thing you have for years. There are people here who have brought numbers to show that Balmung can not continue how it is and the likely outcome if things continue. This is from multiple sources from varied backgrounds providing actual evidence to why action needs to be taken now. Is it possible SE will change their stance? Yes, but they have not with the RP community in the past.

As a follow up to my earlier post, a thread was made when the server restrictions were put into place. It was about talking to SE and organizing an RP alternative or having an alternate server labeled as RP. The poster was bullied so bad he deleted the topic and made another, asking why the community is so abusive. He was bullied again so bad he deleted his account. The meta topic still remains and if you would like some insight on how Reddit treats itself and the RP community it's good insight. EDIT: But my original point still stands. Momo, if this is what you think is best then you need to organize it. It's as simple as that.

Then I suggest you organize and do it. If that is what you feel like needs to be done, then please do it. But to be fair, the outlook on Balmung and the RP community outside of the RP-C and tumbler is pretty bleak. There was a recent Reddit thread about this infact. That was four days ago, and was hostile in the first place. That's generally how things are on /ffxiv, outright hostility to sub optimal playstyles and RP.

RPers are a niche. If we all cancelled our subscriptions Balmung would still be over populated. We do not have that kind of power. Refer to Unnamed Mercenary's post for an explanation of why this is happening and why this is not going to improve without drastic action on either players part of SE's part. New hardware servers on Balmung are not going to fix the issue. Petitioning them to open up the server isn't going to happen. They have already taken the stance of the community doing it's own thing with RP and has 5 years of examples of them telling us to do our own thing. Balmung is not going to reopen per the numbers cited here, in Unnamed Mercenary's post and throughout the general thread. It is not realistic to look to Square Enix to reopen the server or put a label on a different server. Just like it's always been with the XIV RP-C, it is up to the players to create answers to the problems Square and our own player base has created.

Might I suggest this? http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=19405 There was a discussion earlier in the week on how people feel on the different servers. There is a second thread and a tumblr post as well where people are talking and voting on the alternate servers they prefer. If you have more information on the benefit of the servers or want to ask for more information please do!

Please refer to section of OP regarding leaving server for personal reasons. Solidarity in the RP community (so that RP remains common, available, and diverse) is more important than misconceptions particular individuals may have about a community that is so large, diverse, and vibrant that it would be disingenuous to impute negative attributes to it as a whole. Perhaps I'm very lucky, but I've never had an issue with roving bands of stalkers, 'flaky individuals', or other negative stereotypes. RPers love to jest about the pervasive nature of such things, but in reality they remain largely mythical. But, as Gaeham said, these issues will exist on any server, and the problem with a smaller server is that you have no alternatives to escape them. Momo explained in a prior post the problems that happen if you encounter issues on a smaller server, and the OP explains those problems in great detail. Again, we don't need to be wedded to Balmung in particular: what is far more important is that the RP community consolidate on one server [at the present time Balmung]. With any luck, perhaps we'll get an official RP server one day, and then the community can move there. I take offense to this. To say that the player exclusion, stalkers and cliques are mythical is wholly uncalled for. There are many people that have experienced such behavior and to outright dismiss them is unacceptable. It could be in the minority of the experiences, but there are experiences that happen on a daily occurrence. The fact people have been on that end of the equation is why some of these small communities exist.

I completely agree that the optimal solution would be marking a new server as an RP server. It would give players a very clear indication where to roll.

You're correct in that no one knows what SE will do, but our efforts would be better be devoted to supporting this: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/324942-Transfer-Restrictions-and-Roleplayers (and making similar posts). Either the transfer restriction needs to be revoked, or we need an official RP server designated. I encourage all RPers, their friends, and their mothers (no matter where you roleplay or what type of RP you like) to post in support of the thread listed above. I agree that petitioning SE to have them hear our voice is a good thing. However, I understand the problem with Balmung is not only with RPers but with the population as a whole. Preferably, I'd like to see a smaller server marked as the official RP server and transfers allowed there. But I believe that would cause it's own issues, as Free Companies and Housing would not transfer leaving people less inclined to move. Given the fact that Balmung would need to shed roughly half of it's current server population to be equatable to other more stable servers, the likely hood of transfers being a legitimate and long term option is small. The fact they are doing the opposite and having people transfer off is a more telling example of their stance currently. Balmung is closed, Square Enix is giving people XP, Gil and money for houses to get off. I have a hard time seeing a situation they would let people back on.

The reason I present the example for Odin and XI is because it's the closest example we have of a similar situation developing in a Square Enix MMO. No one knows what incentives or punishments they may impose, but we do have an example of what they have done in the past. If server transfers are reopened and if your advice is followed I am concerned that history will repeat. If not a server split, but another server lockdown as the population on Balmung will likely continue it's growth. There are many things up in the air, but as far as the things we do know is that Balmung is far and away the most bloated server in all of XIV by a large margin. The server stands at a pinnacle of social interaction in part of the RP community, there is no denying that. The amount of people that play on Balmung versus the other North American realms is wildly different and Yoshi-P has spoken in the last few Live Letters that the population problems are a concern for him and his staff. It is why I have taken a more proactive approach to the server lockdown. Yoshi-P and Square Enix have made mention of the problems, there are similarities to XI eventual server split and there are people currently unable to RP. The future is very grey for new RPers and I personally prefer creating an answer before there is a larger problem. Thank you Sig and Momo for your responses, I'm eager to see where this thread goes.

This raises some questions as well that I'd like to ask. 1) How do you feel about the fact that a very similar situation has come up before in FFXI? Previously, the Odin server was bloated with the highest population. When character creation became locked, server transfers became the trend. Eventually that was locked, and free transfers were offered. The population imbalance continued despite efforts to alleviate strain on Odin and the server was split into two. Even after the split, the servers remained lock. This is a trend that mirrors Balmung's perdicament. Square Enix has reserved the right to split servers and has kept that as part of it's terms of service with the game itself, and with world transfers. 2) If these new RPers are happy with the server they choose and their communities what incentive should they have to pay $18 to transfer their characters away from the server and community? For some, that's a steep price on top of subscriptions. Even if transfers are allowed once again, it is unlikely that every player would be willing to pay that price and friends would be seperated. Do you believe this is a worthy price to pay for unity on Balmung?

It's been 48 hours so the poll should be closed or closing soon. As such, let's keep this thread going so we can continue to discuss merits of the different RP servers as we lead up to the incentive and transfer announcements. I greatly appreciate all the feedback that has been give in the last week, as it's helped many players find new homes. I know there are still RP communities out there that haven't had their voices heard so please speak up and let us know why your server is the best server for new players. The next thread and poll will not be until after the transfer information has been released so that a more educated decision can be reached. Again, thank you so much for the input!

There are also a lot of plots being opened with SB with another housing district coming. Even if current housing does get bought, it appears there are many apartments available and a few hundred houses being opened soon.

Why? Are you yourself going to be moving all your characters to the new server too? Because it seems you personally are putting an extended timeline on a pretty big decision, and I'm guessing quite of a lot those who did vote may want a determination earlier to find their own home. Just something to consider. It's very possible I will, for the moment I've been enjoying my time with the servers that have been mentioned. I want to take the time to investigate and look into the communities myself but I've withheld my opinions on it to best present a neutral position. And the reason I started this poll so quickly is for people that need a home RIGHT NOW to be able to find one. There's been a lot of people re rolling, transferring and communicating for the past week. It's given people direction. The new poll isn't going to invalidate this one, and people can look at the results at anytime to see where the trend in the community is going. But there are a TON of people out there that don't use the RP-C, and I admit, this is a very RP-C centric poll at the moment. The next one is going to last far longer, and will be website neutral so a wider population can cast their votes. This doesn't invalidate the poll happening right now and with the discussion thread is a great starting point for people to get a better idea of where they should go in the mean time. It's a difficult concept to balance. People need RP right now, but we also want an educated community. I've done my best to marry these two concepts, but there is going to be a lot of feedback over the coming weeks and as free transfers open up. I'd like to keep the conversation going so we can find the right answers.

The fact that some people don't like, visit the RP-C often is a prime reason I don't want this to be the end all, be all vote. I want news to spread and a resource created that makes it far easier to find RP on alternate servers. Leggerless has been spreading their vote over on Tumblr too, which I please ask people that use that platform to spread it. That poll has gotten a lot of attention and votes as well, some from servers that have no representation on ours. Going forward, I plan to run the poll through Strawpoll so that it can be spread far more easily through the community as a neutral look into the RP communities. I've learned a lot over the course of the last week and I want to make sure even more people get their voices in starting Monday.

I agree and that's why I clarified in the original post that it's not the end all be all vote, there will be more over time. But right now people need a place to go. There will be more votes, there will be more discussions as info comes out. Plans can change, they will change. But people are still looking for a home and a community right now. Information and guidance is needed.

And if we keep refusing to balance ourselves out, it will happen. At that point, they probably won't even give incentives, maybe reimbursements on housing, but they'll just dump us all in a server. Indeed. I don't want to be on the timeline that happens. I will actively try to make sure it doesn't. Exactly, the fact is that Balmung could be broken in half and still have healthy communities in both halves is concerning.