RP and Theology

[Nanapariri]

Though I've been busy I was thinking how what we've read so far on ffxiv religion and government sounds a lot like ancient Greece.

 

Here's a snipet from about.com so you can see what I mean:

 

Everyone in ancient Greece defined their lives in relation to the sacred realm and in relation to the political organization of their city-state. In this way religion and politics were deeply intertwined - arguably, there was no obvious separation between the two.

 

The transmission of Greek legends generally occurred in the public realm. Dramas, readings, and other performances were integral to the rhythm of public life. Such poetic activity provided shape and cohesiveness to the political community, defining its internal structure as well as its face to outsiders. It was also standard that such performances involve the myths and rituals of Greek religion - completely secular drama that was divorced from religion was not normal, if it even existed.

 

The role of the city-state in the development and form of Greek religion could easily be overlooked, but it is vitally important. The social revolution which led to the formation of the Greek city-states occurred in parallel with the formation of the Greek pantheon, indicating a simultaneous reorganization of political, social, and religious life.

 

 

Furthermore, it must be remembered that each city-state had it's own patron deity, a relationship which played a decisive role not only in the character of local politics and community feelings, but also in the nature of the myths recounted in that region. The stories about Athena could be told one way in Athens where she was the patron goddess, another way in Sparta where she was not. Patron deities had a special kinship with their cities, playing a role in how local citizens saw themselves and understood their relationship to outsiders.

 

Much of this changed during the Hellenistic Age, usually marked by the conquests of Alexander the Great after 334 BCE. Under the rule of Macedonian lords, various Greek communities began to take a different perspective on religion which moved them away from community-oriented practices and more towards individualistic religious beliefs

 

Private associations were formed and interest in things like astrology bloomed. At the same time, politically-enforced veneration of divine rulers like Alexander himself began to develop. Such veneration was used to gauge one's adherence to social and political norms in a conscious, overt manner that contrasts sharply to more unconscious used of Greek rituals to do the same thing in prior ages. This probably helped drive people to the individualistic practices as more "authentically" religious.

 

If this type of structure seems built in I think its possible for the community to use the different Greek Gods as counterparts to develope city-state religions.

[HalaBasinah]

It does sound very Greek to me, what with the polytheism and the patron gods of city-states.

 

It also seems that the Primals may be something like the Greek Titans.

[ramdragn]

Taking from the comment from the post, if they are Greek based (speculatively) There could be not only temples but shrines. Small villages (maybe nomads Elveens) with portable shrines or set stones where rituals and such can be made. Probably seasonal routes leading to shrines where events will be placed. . . pretty much like FFX where some temples were elaborated and others were even forgotten yet everyone recognized the "all summons" but not everyone prayed to all or the same one.

[Nanapariri]

Taking from the comment from the post' date=' if they are Greek based (speculatively) There could be not only temples but shrines. Small villages (maybe nomads Elveens) with portable shrines or set stones where rituals and such can be made. Probably seasonal routes leading to shrines where events will be placed. . . pretty much like FFX where some temples were elaborated and others were even forgotten yet everyone recognized the "all summons" but not everyone prayed to all or the same one.[/quote']

 

Even if FFXIV officially doesn't make pilgramages an official thing it might make it interesting as an RPC event.

 

The possibilities are intriguing.

[Klare]

Having religion within any game to me automatically makes the game a little more interesting (so long as it's not just black and white). With FFXIV having 12 gods I can't wait to see the lore behind all of them and how SE will incorporate them into the game.

 

Will there be religious wars between countries/cites/races?

Will each of the gods offer something that the other doesn't?

What are the moral positions of each of the gods? are some good,evil or neutral?

 

There's plenty of interesting rp idea's that can be used using gods but I guess we'll just have to wait till more lore comes out.

 

A long time ago I played a game called "DarkAges" and out of all the mmo's I've played I think they had the most interactive and interesting religious system. I won't go into too much detail but the game consisted of 8 gods, all of which represented a certain aspect such as war, death, compassion etc etc. Anyway you as a player had the choice to choose one of the gods to worship and by doing so you gained their blessings. Of course it wasn't just as simple go into their temple and get a buff, you had to go through a role-playing system and attend mass (which was could last up to 30 min or more) or donate to the temple to gain faith and then through faith you gained certain abilities that the god you worshiped granted to you.

 

Now I'm not expecting FFXIV to be as intricate as that but it be neat to see if SE will make religion within FFXIV more interactive then just saying I'm a follower of said god.

 

Only con I see to this is if one gods become more popular then another just because of whatever buff or reason they give, people would just flock to that god to take advantage of the game mechanic instead of the rp.

 

 

As for a general consensus within our rp group and other rp groups I agree with Laychield in the idea that everyone's going to have different idea's or make up their own story or gods (depending on the lore).

All I know about that is if I run into someone's religion that is contradicting to the lore I won't be saying anything against it but will rp out Klare's thoughts depending on how believable it is.

 

 

Anyway, as far as Klare goes with religion she won't be giving any type of worship to any of the gods since in her eyes they didn't do squat for her when she was growing up in the streets.

 

Will be fun to rp her running into one though if it's part of the FFXIV storyline.

[Aveline]

Interesting thing just came up in my Greek lit class. The primary Olympian gods/goddesses numbered 12 in total, and in daily Greek life it was common to say "By the Twelve!" as in "I swear by the Twelve, I didn't steal your sheep, Amenekos!"

 

Did anyone's characters swear by any deities in XI? Do you plan to in XIV?

 

My character Niami was raised in Mhaura, around sailors so she would always say "Altana's tits!" when something surprised or amazed her.

[Mho]

I had a throwaway Sin Hunter character who'd mutter curses under her breath in Old Mithran when she was annoyed, most of which were made-up sufficiently guttural words. I usually had a rough idea of what they meant in case anyone asked, but many of them were 'swearing by the land' sort of. The few she got asked about meant things like "land-canker."

 

I also have a hot-tempered healer who sometimes (rarely) curses up a storm. "Prom" as a vulgar slang shortening for Promathia figures into her cursing a fair amount, she's said things like "Prom's chains!" when venting exasperation. She tries to avoid swearing by Altana, because her boyfriend is religious and frowns on blasphemy, but "Etna" as an irreverent shortening of Altana has slipped out once or twice too. :oops:

[Eva]

My character on FFXI was extremely religious, to the point of refusing to even speak Altana's name, feeling it blasphemous. Sure, it slipped a few times when he was angry or shocked, but he had always regarded her as the goddess, or the dawn goddess.

 

Towards the end of my time RPing him, he began to regard Altana less and less, instead taking on a more abstract worship of the sky itself - often talking about its moods, emotions, and misgivings. I figure if there is a god or goddess of the sky in FFXIV, than Kes's father will probably be a devout worshipper. Otherwise he will probably just continue to regard the sky as something sacred.

 

As for Kes, there's a very good chance she may be atheist. I've still got a few ideas bouncing around in my head, but I want to know more about these deities and the rest of the lore before I make any final decisions on that front.

[Nanapariri]

Well some of mine would use "Goddess" or "Altana" and one would say "By the Goddess". My favorite was an expression another player made up and most adopted though. "Bloody Chains" or "Chains" which was a shortened version of "By Promathia's Chains".

 

I think I'm going on the Ancient Greek model and using "By the Twelve" and maybe something relating to the patron god I go with. I still feel this religious system is based off the Greek. The more I read the more I feel of it.

[Varov]

With 14, My character will definately be going along with the Goddess of Navigation. I haven't really considered how he would react theologically, but I feel like he would react more supersticiously than religiously or piously. Offering up something to the wind and the water before sailing - etc.

 

As for the actual name of the Goddess, he'd probably curse up a storm with a nice little addition about "Llymlaen's fins!" or what have you. He's generally insulting to everyone, so...

[Zhavi]

If I do wind up playing a keeper she'll undoubtedly be stuck on the Lover, so it's likely when very frustrated she'd snap out something like, "By one and eleven, that is enough!"

 

She'd be moderately pious (if rather irreverent) so she'd be more likely to curse by what the gods are known for than by names. Things like "Navigator save you." Or perhaps, "Fate-weaver stake you to rot!" or "Lover bless."

 

And as I familiarize myself with them there'll be more, but it's far more likely my char will be using one or two epithets commonly rather than many.

[Nanapariri]

I like your idea Brisa because it does fit a polytheistic model where one god is seen as responsible for a certain thing.

 

I'm thinking most likely in this world view a person would swear or devote most time to thier patron but when faced with a particuliar problem would invoke the patron god of an activity.

 

"By the twelve" might come out when one wants to make the largest most pronounced point. You're not just invoking one god but all. lol.

[Aveline]

"Thal's balls" is commonly said around Limsa Lominsa LOL

[Menoe Valkyria]

Interesting thing just came up in my Greek lit class. The primary Olympian gods/goddesses numbered 12 in total, and in daily Greek life it was common to say "By the Twelve!" as in "I swear by the Twelve, I didn't steal your sheep, Amenekos!"

 

Did anyone's characters swear by any deities in XI? Do you plan to in XIV?

 

My character Niami was raised in Mhaura, around sailors so she would always say "Altana's tits!" when something surprised or amazed her.

 

Endinka did. If you made her angry you could often hear her saying "Great Goddess" or "For goddesse sake" or" I swear by Altana" thought I think i recall her using the first two the most. I'm sure her cousin would have scolded her if she had ever herd Endi saying those things; since her cousin was a priestess afterall.

[DAISHI]

A desert culture of nomads? What crazy nonsense.