Feedback for moderation policy post

[111]

>_< I feel like quoting and nitpicking people never seems to help the discussion..but it may just be me.

isn't that exactly how discussion works though?

 

Not really though. I mean I have no idea wtf Flynt is talking about regardless, but nitpicking individual bits is a bad way to discuss things.

 

An argument is like a complete thing, you need to attack the entire beast. Pulling specific sentences out and tearing them apart ignores the context in which they were written. For example: ( I don't necessarily agree with this point)

 

"Marriage is an economic and legal matter more than a romantic one. I oppose gay marriage, and feel that going down the road to allow it is wrong and a waste of time. Marriage should be controlled by religious institutions, and not dictated by the government. However the legal, tax, and benefits of marriage should instead be transferred to civil unions, and be a completely secular manner."

 

 

 

 

Someone could pull out, " I oppose gay marriage, and feel that going down the road to allow it is wrong and a waste of time. Marriage should be controlled by religious institutions, and not dictated by the government"

 

And tear that apart, a statement which by itself, does not really represent the argument that paragraph is making.

[Edvyn]

>_< I feel like quoting and nitpicking people never seems to help the discussion..but it may just be me.

isn't that exactly how discussion works though?

 

Not really though. I mean I have no idea wtf Flynt is talking about regardless, but nitpicking individual bits is a bad way to discuss things.

 

An argument is like a complete thing, you need to attack the entire beast. Pulling specific sentences out and tearing them apart ignores the context in which they were written. For example: ( I don't necessarily agree with this point)

 

"Marriage is an economic and legal matter more than a romantic one. I oppose gay marriage, and feel that going down the road to allow it is wrong and a waste of time. Marriage should be controlled by religious institutions, and not dictated by the government. However the legal, tax, and benefits of marriage should instead be transferred to civil unions, and be a completely secular manner."

 

 

 

 

Someone could pull out, " I oppose gay marriage, and feel that going down the road to allow it is wrong and a waste of time. Marriage should be controlled by religious institutions, and not dictated by the government"

 

And tear that apart, a statement which by itself, does not really represent the argument that paragraph is making.

what if you pull out each sentence individually and kill them one by one to make your response easier to read/process? like internet debate space invaders? that's basically tackling the entire argument

[FreelanceWizard]

So, teachable moment #3.

 

That video up there? And that meme image post? Those are both warnable posts. "Spurious off-topic posts, including meme images and patent nonsense." It's right there in section 1. Derailing threads with that stuff is a very, very quick way to run up your warning level. Does that mean you can never post such things? No. If you include some content and context as well and the image or video is germane to your post, then it's fine. If the thread is about meme images or videos, have fun. The policies are about context and purpose.

 

Consider this your "tap on the shoulder" notice. Next time's a formal warning.

[111]

what if you pull out each sentence individually and kill them one by one to make your response easier to read/process? like internet debate space invaders? that's basically tackling the entire argument

 

I mean it makes it easier to look like you're right, however it is still treating every sentence as a separate argument.

 

It depends if your goal is to wreck someone's argument and look right, or to come to the truth of a matter.

 

I think If you actually want to try and come to a common truth, then nitpicking every sentence is bad, since you tend to look at each sentence as a puzzle to be defeated and discredited (which is easy on their own) instead of considering the validity of their argument as a whole.

[111]

So, teachable moment #3.

 

That video up there? And that meme image post? Those are both warnable posts. "Spurious off-topic posts, including meme images and patent nonsense." It's right there in section 1. Derailing threads with that stuff is a very, very quick way to run up your warning level. Does that mean you can never post such things? No. If you include some content and context as well and the image or video is germane to your post, then it's fine. If the thread is about meme images or videos, have fun. The policies are about context and purpose.

 

Consider this your "tap on the shoulder" notice. Next time's a formal warning.

 

This is actually pretty reasonable. For example Something awful has had for a long time a no exceptions meme = ban policy. Unless of course its in a thread or sub-forum that allows it.

 

A ban that will cost you 10 dollars.

 

They don't really add anything to most conversations. And hey, now that they're banned, they're far more exciting.

 

Like heroin.

[Nero]

I'd like to go on record as saying that acknowledging inflammatory posts or strawman arguments--such as in my own post above--does more harm than good. Shining light on a bad flower does nothing but help it grow, in a manner of speaking.

 

I'm not exactly good at leading by example. This I recognise.

 

In the future when such posts are made, I strongly encourage everyone to do their best to simply ignore it, regardless of its content. Escalating a situation like I just did helps no one, and if your intention is to "get back" at a person or "put them in their place", then apathy, especially on a wide scale, is a far more effective expression of disdain than the most hateful vitriol.

 

When bombs are being dropped left and right, do as the British did: keep calm and carry on.

[Renata Turner]

.....

 

1. I have triggers. But I also realize that while I can ask people to respect that, not everyone will, and I deal accordingly. Trauma that happened to me should not affect the lives of others. Certain triggers, I draw the line at, but others I know are not intended to further traumatized me. Thankfully I am at a point where I can choose to refuse givingthe pperpetrators further power over my life. Not everyone is.

2. What in the everlasting frig did I walk into when I joined this community? The majority of you are great people...but dang, this crepe is crazy. I did not realize the RPC had turned into an online Baltimore.

[111]

 

 

When bombs are being dropped left and right, do as the British did: keep calm and carry on.

 

Or do what they actually did and build bigger bombers and bigger bombs and BURN THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS DOWN.

 

Actually wait don't, that's probably a warnable offence.

[Aya]

Can't we just.. have fun? 

[Edvyn]

Can't we just.. have fun? 

this is kinda fun to read if im going to be honest

[Aduu Avagnar]

 

 

When bombs are being dropped left and right, do as the British did: keep calm and carry on.

 

Or do what they actually did and build bigger bombers and bigger bombs and BURN THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS DOWN.

 

Actually wait don't, that's probably a warnable offence.

You forgot to invent concentration camps to store your prisoners of War in.

 

but he does have a point, inflamatory posts tend to exist to draw people into an argument.

 

however, we have had 3 learnable moments from this.

[Erik Mynhier]

So, teachable moment #3.

 

That video up there? And that meme image post? Those are both warnable posts. "Spurious off-topic posts, including meme images and patent nonsense." It's right there in section 1. Derailing threads with that stuff is a very, very quick way to run up your warning level. Does that mean you can never post such things? No. If you include some content and context as well and the image or video is germane to your post, then it's fine. If the thread is about meme images or videos, have fun. The policies are about context and purpose.

 

Consider this your "tap on the shoulder" notice. Next time's a formal warning.

 

The meme above... the Simpsons one? Im just asking because im on a phone and may be missing images. Confusion due in part to boost mobile.

[111]

Can't we just.. have fun? 

this is kinda fun to read if im going to be honest

 

It is certainly more fun than whatever variety of:

 

"What does your character spread on their toast?!" thread that is going on currently.

 

However fun for me and good for the community are not always synonymous.

[PerkPrincess]

So, teachable moment #3.

 

That video up there? And that meme image post? Those are both warnable posts. "Spurious off-topic posts, including meme images and patent nonsense." It's right there in section 1. Derailing threads with that stuff is a very, very quick way to run up your warning level. Does that mean you can never post such things? No. If you include some content and context as well and the image or video is germane to your post, then it's fine. If the thread is about meme images or videos, have fun. The policies are about context and purpose.

 

Consider this your "tap on the shoulder" notice. Next time's a formal warning.

 

The meme above... the Simpsons one? Im just asking because im on a phone and may be missing images. Confusion due in part to boost mobile.

 

I believe it's the uh, EVA theme. Though the simpsons gif also counts, I imagine.

[Bopdoot]

I'm genuinely sad that gifs and may-mays aren't allowed D:... They can be so much fun if used comedically and in a topical way

[Aduu Avagnar]

I'm genuinely sad that gifs and may-mays aren't allowed D:... They can be so much fun if used comedically and in a topical way

as long as its pertinent to the topic they are fine, just add some content with it, not just drop the GIF/Meme and go.

[ArmachiA]

I think if meme's are part of the discussion then they're fine. Like is someone was going "Do I level this class or this class?" and someone posts a "Why not both?" Meme then explains why. I could be wrong.

[TheLastCandle]

I think if meme's are part of the discussion then they're fine. Like is someone was going "Do I level this class or this class?" and someone posts a "Why not both?" Meme then explains why. I could be wrong.

 

This is how I feel about it.

[LiadansWhisper]

I think if meme's are part of the discussion then they're fine. Like is someone was going "Do I level this class or this class?" and someone posts a "Why not both?" Meme then explains why. I could be wrong.

 

This is how I feel about it.

 

Yep.

 

The rest of this thread is too off the deep end for me to really comment on.  >.>

[Xenedra]

Confirmed; memes and videos and all that fun stuff are fine as long as they're relevant and not posted to derail or instigate trouble.

[Erik Mynhier]

Confirmed; memes and videos and all that fun stuff are fine as long as they're relevant and not posted to derail or instigate trouble.

 

Ok, that's all I was confused about.

[Maril]

I like the new rules. I used to be a moderator on a huge forum in the past and it's no easy job at all, having clear rules really go a long way.

 

The only thing I'm not really thrilled about is your reluctance to delete posts - I agree it's not something that should be used left right and center, but I have been involved in a flaming incident where the attackers posts did not get deleted afterwards.

When it comes to flaming, I don't think it's a great idea to leave the posts visible because it empowers and gives an incentive to do these things even more, in my opinion. People might be willing to risk it more if they know that at least the posts wont get removed. And for me, I'm always worried that someone is going to re-find the thread and pass judgement on me/my fc based on what the attacker said in those posts (which I obviously disagree with.).

I don't want to discuss the moderator action in my incident here so I'm trying to make it a bit unspecific, but I felt like I had to mention where those concerns came from. I hope that is okay.

 

Is that something you've thought about, or has it changed in any way with these new rules?

[Warren Castille]

I only got obliquely referenced three times? Damn guys, I thought I was a bigger problem than that.

[FreelanceWizard]

The only thing I'm not really thrilled about is your reluctance to delete posts - I agree it's not something that should be used left right and center, but I have been involved in a flaming incident where the attackers posts did not get deleted afterwards.

When it comes to flaming, I don't think it's a great idea to leave the posts visible because it empowers and gives an incentive to do these things even more, in my opinion. People might be willing to risk it more if they know that at least the posts wont get removed. And for me, I'm always worried that someone is going to re-find the thread and pass judgement on me/my fc based on what the attacker said in those posts (which I obviously disagree with.).

I don't want to discuss the moderator action in my incident here so I'm trying to make it a bit unspecific, but I felt like I had to mention where those concerns came from. I hope that is okay.

 

Is that something you've thought about, or has it changed in any way with these new rules?

 

It depends on the flames in question. Personally, I feel we've been leaning a bit too much on deletion as of late, and that emboldens people because they feel they can do whatever they want since a mod will just clean things up later. It also eliminates our ability to publicly flag a post as having resulted in a warning (which we're going to try out and see how it goes). It undermines the concept of people standing by what they say. Finally, it spawns weird conspiracy theories about what clique is benefitting from the "censorship." So, for all those reasons, I really don't like deleting posts.

 

However, as I said, it depends on what's being said and why. For instance, racial slurs will get zapped, period. Posts that directly call someone out may or may not be, depending on exactly what's been said. Flame wars that happen inside another thread with good discussion will probably just be split off into a locked thread, with warnings flagged for reference.

 

If you want to talk about a specific thread, feel free to drop me a PM and we'll discuss it.

[Bopdoot]

I'm genuinely sad that gifs and may-mays aren't allowed D:... They can be so much fun if used comedically and in a topical way

as long as its pertinent to the topic they are fine, just add some content with it, not just drop the GIF/Meme and go.

Ahh this makes sense. 100% fair imho, sorry for misunderstanding!