Coil T1-2 Advice on Getting Started/Learning it

[LiadansWhisper]

To be honest, I'll be watching the videos soon after I make a few CT runs...

 

But all day while I was at work the words "what in the world is allagan rot anyway?" swirled in my head. I pretty much joined in during the time my friends were wondering if Enrage method would be considered an exploit or not. (I have a vague idea of what it means from my friends and what people have posted).

 

This is my opinion, but I don't consider it an exploit.  I am of the opinion that Square has made many raid fights at this point.  They know the difference between a "hard" enrage and a "soft" enrage.

 

A "hard" enrage is essentially an insta-kill mechanic.  It's the, "You took too damn long, bye" moment.  There is a hard enrage in BCOB - Twintania has a hard enrage.

 

A "soft" enrage is generally when whatever mechanic kicks in at that point doesn't kill you, but makes it increasingly difficult to keep people alive - i.e. you're running out of time.  Examples of this in BCOB are Caduceus (your tanks will eventually run out of CDs, and your healers out of mana), Turn 2 (high damage AoE that doesn't outright kill but requires extensive healing that will run your healers out of mana), and Turn 4 (there's a very similar, but much less damaging, AoE that goes out if you take too long killing the last Dreadnaught, that will run your healers OOM and/or cause tank death (due to having to spam AoE heals to keep everyone else alive rather than healing the tank directly) if you don't kill the Dread ASAP).

 

Square knows what a soft enrage is, and they know what a hard enrage is, and if they intended for Turn 2 to have a hard enrage, it would have a hard enrage.  It does not have a hard enrage, and I can only conclude that this was an intentional decision on the part of the developers.  Did they foresee people using this as part of a strategy?  Hard to say.  Probably not, as this would not be the first time that players did something developers didn't expect.  That said, you are not "glitching" anything in this fight by employing the Enrage Strat, so it's not really an exploit.  Plus, if it was, Square would have already banned people just like they banned groups that killed Twintania by glitching her out.

 

As far as Allagan Rot goes, it's a mechanic in the fight that has to be passed around to ranged.  It's passed by proximity, and puts two debuffs on you.  One prevents you from receiving the Rot again for a certain amount of time.  The other is the rot itself.  The rot counts down (buff duration gets lower).  If it reaches 0 before you've passed it onto someone without the prevention debuff, everyone in the raid dies.

[Naunet]

I never said it was an exploit, just that the strategy cheapens the fight and really doesn't help you in preparing your personal raid awareness for the final turn. Especially if you're new to raiding, I think it's well worth learning to do it the "right" way.

[LiadansWhisper]

I never said it was an exploit, just that the strategy cheapens the fight and really doesn't help you in preparing your personal raid awareness for the final turn. Especially if you're new to raiding, I think it's well worth learning to do it the "right" way.

 

That's why I was responding to him. :-P  He specifically asked if it was an exploit.

[Aleister]

I would agree and disagree on Enrage method. It IS an easy way out to clear Turn 2, but for those who have been running many times has still failed to clear it normally because of lack of gears and DPS. Honestly, the worst part is when you are trying to fight ADS withing 4~6 clicks and you can't seem to kill it in that amount of time. 

 

I would suggest to try and do enrage and do it normal way afterwards because with the way people want to get Allagan gears right now is just a milestone if you try it regular way.

 

Eh.  I'm pretty Lassiez Faire about the whole thing.  If you can't get past Turn 2 the regular way, you won't make it past Turn 4 anyway.

Pretty much what Liadan has said, sadly if you don't have 7 friends or a FC willing to teach the intended way of handling Turn 2 you won't get far in T4.

 

Just throwing this random piece of info out there but I noticed (yesterday to be exact) That Cad can be singled tanked with a WAR with 8k+ hp and can handle its own CDs well with the same raid comp idea for T2 enrage strat. Only discovered this after the MT died and I tanked a enraged Cad with 8 stacks for over a minute with two healers. But this wouldn't benefit raiders at all for the real fights like T4 and T5 unless they can do coil regularly without evening flinching.

 

Despite learning this and sharing it, I and hope majority here prefer to do raids as intended first and know it like the back of my hand and flawlessly kill the boss before even trying these cheap easy methods discovered to kill bosses easier. Its more fun and provides skills, no? :roll:

[Aleister]

I don't know who the real lead is in it. Either our FC leader or one of my friends...

 

I tried to avoid the DL because its a cowl that woukd take up the hat and the chest. I'm really hoping a crimson vest pops up on me tonight

If you're looking to poke into Coil ASAP (Which Yoshi has stated its contents will be the hardest in the game for now.) I wouldn't neglect gear just because it has something you dislike for example, a cowl. Only gimping yourself and hurting the rest of the team plus it only requires philo tomes to buy it which.. aren't a big deal haha and you could easily just grind myth for 2 weeks and obtain the BLM i90 chestpiece which is better than the CT stuff. If you really dislike the cowl, you could just equip the DL gear for hard dungeons and raids only and then swap to something you prefer on downtime, I use to do that. Heck I still do, just with snowman gear now.

 

Always bring your A game to raid content you're progressing and even afterwards. That is how I see it though everyone has different opinions.

[LiadansWhisper]

I don't know who the real lead is in it. Either our FC leader or one of my friends...

 

I tried to avoid the DL because its a cowl that woukd take up the hat and the chest. I'm really hoping a crimson vest pops up on me tonight

If you're looking to poke into Coil ASAP (Which Yoshi has stated its contents will be the hardest in the game for now.) I wouldn't neglect gear just because it has something you dislike for example, a cowl. Only gimping yourself and hurting the rest of the team plus it only requires philo tomes to buy it which.. aren't a big deal haha and you could easily just grind myth for 2 weeks and obtain the BLM i90 chestpiece which is better than the CT stuff. If you really dislike the cowl, you could just equip the DL gear for hard dungeons and raids only and then swap to something you prefer on downtime, I use to do that. Heck I still do, just with snowman gear now.

 

Actually, trying for two separate pieces ends up working out to a stat gain.

[Aleister]

I don't know who the real lead is in it. Either our FC leader or one of my friends...

 

I tried to avoid the DL because its a cowl that woukd take up the hat and the chest. I'm really hoping a crimson vest pops up on me tonight

If you're looking to poke into Coil ASAP (Which Yoshi has stated its contents will be the hardest in the game for now.) I wouldn't neglect gear just because it has something you dislike for example, a cowl. Only gimping yourself and hurting the rest of the team plus it only requires philo tomes to buy it which.. aren't a big deal haha and you could easily just grind myth for 2 weeks and obtain the BLM i90 chestpiece which is better than the CT stuff. If you really dislike the cowl, you could just equip the DL gear for hard dungeons and raids only and then swap to something you prefer on downtime, I use to do that. Heck I still do, just with snowman gear now.

 

Actually, trying for two separate pieces ends up working out to a stat gain.

Sure, CT promises you a loot item of your choice, sure but how many runs would you have to do just for that item piece to drop and also have a small chance of losing to another player? Yeah tis a stat gain but it'd be much more easier to just grind myth tomes to get a i90 myth piece and use that with another piece of gear you have saved. Its offers more stats than a CT gear + HM dungeon.. But thats my thought on it, it can be simply ignored.

[Aldotsk]

I would agree and disagree on Enrage method. It IS an easy way out to clear Turn 2, but for those who have been running many times has still failed to clear it normally because of lack of gears and DPS. Honestly, the worst part is when you are trying to fight ADS withing 4~6 clicks and you can't seem to kill it in that amount of time. 

 

I would suggest to try and do enrage and do it normal way afterwards because with the way people want to get Allagan gears right now is just a milestone if you try it regular way.

 

Eh.  I'm pretty Lassiez Faire about the whole thing.  If you can't get past Turn 2 the regular way, you won't make it past Turn 4 anyway.

Pretty much what Liadan has said, sadly if you don't have 7 friends or a FC willing to teach the intended way of handling Turn 2 you won't get far in T4.

 

 

 

.... Not everyone has 7 friends or has huge FC/LS community to work things out to do Turn 2 like you say. So that argument is kind of invalid.

[Trigonxv]

I got by t4 with a pug and we decided to ls up been doing fine clearing t4 even when we do t2 enrage, so it's not a matter of o you cleared t2 enrage style? sorry but you prolly can't do t4 it's just a matter of working together with people and adapting to various people's skill sets which is something of a rarity in mmo's. my advice if your question still hasn't been resolved form learning groups you have a significantly higher chance of getting patient and fun individuals in which you can learn content at your leisure

[LiadansWhisper]

 

 

.... Not everyone has 7 friends or has huge FC/LS community to work things out to do Turn 2 like you say. So that argument is kind of invalid.

 

I think you're misunderstanding what I was getting at.  If you don't have the ability to get past T2 (i.e. your personal skill level is too low) via the normal method, then you don't have the ability (i.e. personal skill level) to get past T4.

 

What I was getting at is that if you are able to clear T4, then you have the skill to be there.  There isn't a way that I know of to "cheese" T4, so you certainly have the ability to clear T2 normally if you can make it through T4.

 

I hope that made a bit more sense.

 

I got by t4 with a pug and we decided to ls up been doing fine clearing t4 even when we do t2 enrage, so it's not a matter of o you cleared t2 enrage style? sorry but you prolly can't  do t4 it's just a matter of working together with people and adapting to various people's skill sets which is something of a rarity in mmo's. my advice if your question still hasn't been resolved form learning groups you have a significantly  higher chance of getting patient and fun individuals in which you can learn content at your leisure

 

The point is that T4 is a step up, in terms of skill required, from T2.

[Aleister]

I wouldn't worry about it if you're not crazy into PvE endgame content. when 2.2 comes out which is like.. perhaps the end of march? Coil will be getting a 'echo' buff for the Coil T1-T5 to make it easier. Just learn the fights by whatever method you can and enjoy it until it gets uber easy.

[synaesthetic]

If you don't like the darklight cowl, do what everyone else does and get a weaver to craft you caster vanya. The HQ versions are just as powerful as darklight cowl when taken together, and if you meld them, they're even more powerful.

 

I've been using a vanya robe on SMN with a few materia in it (not overmelded, though) since both Acheron and the ADS hate me and won't drop caster body pieces.

[Dakki]

"Sooooome daaaaaaay over the raiiinbooooow!"

 

 

We'll get you that caster body some time soon. :moogle:

[Kage]

If you don't like the darklight cowl, do what everyone else does and get a weaver to craft you caster vanya. The HQ versions are just as powerful as darklight cowl when taken together, and if you meld them, they're even more powerful.

 

I've been using a vanya robe on SMN with a few materia in it (not overmelded, though) since both Acheron and the ADS hate me and won't drop caster body pieces.

 

My friend wasn't able to HQ mine and we threw a Savage Aim IV and Quicktongue IV onto it to "sort of" make up for it. We all just decided that I'd go for the CT body and myth robe. I don't mind getting the myth robe, as everyone says it IS one of the better alternatives to the Allagan tunic of casting. (It's just really ugly in my opinion and it'll take me just about 2 more weeks to get it).

 

Acheron dropped the crimson vest on Sunday. 4 days after I already took my loot

[synaesthetic]

The AF2 robe for BLM is better than allagan body unless you can make up the 34 accuracy somewhere else. This is not especially easy, and most BLMs can only make use of allagan body after they already collect a significant amount of allagan gear (specifically the shoes, circlet and pants) or they have allagan scepter (which has a lot of accuracy on it) or they have titan earrings, garuda ring and allagan ring, plus hero's belt.

 

If you can get the accuracy somewhere else (like on allagan scepter or have a bunch of EX primal jewelry), then allagan body is great for BLM. But even if the ADS finally stops hating me next week and drops it (unlikely) I'm still going to be using sorcerer's coat on BLM because I can't really make up the 34 accuracy anywhere else. However, it'll be used on SMN instantly since I am still using vanya on SMN.

 

(Unless, of course, Turn 4 drops another pair of allagan pants. Unlikely as well, but it could happen... we had two allagan healer body pieces drop two weeks in a row...)

[LiadansWhisper]

(Unless, of course, Turn 4 drops another pair of allagan pants. Unlikely as well, but it could happen... we had two allagan healer body pieces drop two weeks in a row...)

 

o_O

 

We had the same loot table this week and I think last week, too.  That is...weird.

 

Don't talk to me about pants.  MY PANTS ARE OFF TWINTANIA.

[Kage]

I've always in the long term planned on getting the AF2 chest piece because of the better stats but it was also a sort of question of whether or not I'd go for it first.

 

I had decided that if I saw a Crimson Hat I'd need it... but it never showed up and Crimson Vest did. So I got the Crimson Vest and bought the AF2 hat to make up for it previously still being a Warlock's Hat. 

 

At this point I'm ilvl76. I don't have many of the cross class skills. How detrimental is that?

[synaesthetic]

I've always in the long term planned on getting the AF2 chest piece because of the better stats but it was also a sort of question of whether or not I'd go for it first.

 

I had decided that if I saw a Crimson Hat I'd need it... but it never showed up and Crimson Vest did. So I got the Crimson Vest and bought the AF2 hat to make up for it previously still being a Warlock's Hat. 

 

At this point I'm ilvl76. I don't have many of the cross class skills. How detrimental is that?

 

The "really important" ones are Raging Strikes (if you don't have this one, you're just being lazy, getting level 4 on archer takes like 10 minutes tops) and Quelling Strikes (this one takes quite a bit longer since it's archer level 34).

 

The cross-class actions I assign are Raging Strikes (ARC 4), Quelling Strikes (ARC 34), Physick (ACN 4), Virus (ACN 12) and Eye for an Eye (ACN 34). All of these are useful, though some more useful than others.

 

Raging Strikes and Quelling Strikes are absolutely the most useful. Quelling Strikes becomes all but required when you're fighting bosses that spawn adds that must be burned down ASAP. Chirada on Garuda EX is a good example; you don't really have time to be screwing around and letting the tank get aggro, so you burn Quelling and can open up right away. Under the effects of QS, your threat generation is so incredibly tiny that the tank would literally have to be standing still and auto-attacking for you to actually pull aggro.

 

Raging Strikes is a damage cooldown. Use it when you want or need more DPS. Useful for burn phases. I do not macro it to anything and reserve it for when I need to put out a lot of DPS all at once (dreadnoughts in Turn 4, conflagrations on Twintania, Garuda EX during plume phases after the Razor Plumes are dead, etc).

 

Virus is situationally useful, especially now after the Virus nerf prevents Virus from being applied to the enemy more than once every one minute and twelve seconds. Cross-class Virus only reduces STR and DEX by 15%, which means it only affects physical damage. I use it when you have a mob being tanked but the SCH or SMN doesn't want to use their full-power Virus yet. Examples would be when pulling Caduceus in Turn 1; he hits very hard and deals only physical damage. While the party moves into position, the tank can end up taking a lot of damage. Once the tank tosses Tomahawk/Shield Lob, I use Virus as I run into position. Helps save the healers a few MP. I also use it on the sisters in Garuda EX and on the Clockwork Soldier that I kite in Turn 4. Lately I've been doing T4 as SMN and just having Titan-egi tank it instead of kiting it... though I still use Virus!

 

Physick is not that useful, really, but there aren't many other things to stick here. I've found ways to make it at least somewhat useful on BLM, even with our painfully low MND, it still heals for about 350-400 with plus-one relic. I will use it any time that I cannot attack for whatever reason and cannot pull aggro (Mistral Song, Mistral Shriek, Aerial Blast, Geocrush, Inferno, etc).

 

Eye for an Eye is, again, situational. Usually your healers will be able to keep this buff on your tanks when they need it, but I've found that when you have dicey pulls (Twintania comes to mind) putting Eye on both tanks helps make the transition more smooth. I also use it on cooldown in Turn 4 because those dreadnoughts hit hard.

[Naunet]

Don't talk to me about pants.  MY PANTS ARE OFF TWINTANIA.

 

But the myth pants are better anyway! Live the pantslessness.

[Kage]

Once again thank you so much for all your help and advice! I hope you all get your loot soon!

 

The "really important" ones are Raging Strikes (if you don't have this one, you're just being lazy, getting level 4 on archer takes like 10 minutes tops) and Quelling Strikes (this one takes quite a bit longer since it's archer level 34).

I would also be stupid to not have put it in when ARC needs to be 15 for BLM. I just... need to get in the habit of using it more often than in burning phases so it becomes second nature. Quelling Strikes is a different matter since my ARC is lvl 23 or so and it's become a bit of a chore to level it.

 

The cross-class actions I assign are Raging Strikes (ARC 4), Quelling Strikes (ARC 34), Physick (ACN 4), Virus (ACN 12) and Eye for an Eye (ACN 34). All of these are useful, though some more useful than others.

 

Raging Strikes and Quelling Strikes are absolutely the most useful. Quelling Strikes becomes all but required when you're fighting bosses that spawn adds that must be burned down ASAP. Chirada on Garuda EX is a good example; you don't really have time to be screwing around and letting the tank get aggro, so you burn Quelling and can open up right away. Under the effects of QS, your threat generation is so incredibly tiny that the tank would literally have to be standing still and auto-attacking for you to actually pull aggro.

Of the ones you've listed and described I only have Raging Strikes and Physick. I leveled my ACN just about to get Physick. Would you agree then that if I wanted to use all of the cross-class abilities, in order, I'm best off getting Quelling Strikes and then working on ACN?

 

Since I'm now in DL or higher and barring able to get actual experience in Coil soon, I'd be aiming for Myth Belt, Choker, and earrings before say... pants and shoes. Right?

[synaesthetic]

Get QS first before you mess around with leveling ACN. It's the most important, especially as your gear ramps up and you start encounters where you need to be able to kill adds quickly.

 

It's also valuable for the ADS in Turn 2, because one of the buffs the ADS receives when you fight him is a 30% slashing resistance buff. This means your tanks have a harder time keeping aggro.

[Kage]

I honestly felt a little bad recently since I only got to ilvl78 in the last week and will be getting my Relic+1 or Myth body next week... but I took in a lot of the great advice here! I wasn't really thought of to be taken along when mentioned but people have started to consider it... so when my FC's static really couldn't get a good set time for this week my friend said we'd do it on Monday so 6/8 of the group was our FC or our FC LS friends. We got through T1-T3 but I don't nearly have the gear for T4.

 

It was quite fun even though Caduceus really wanted to eat me when the split happened and the tank on my split died and we had to wipe... He liked me so much he took a bite out of me, left me with about 100 HP, took everyone else down and then came back for the rest!

 

We didn't make it clear enough that it was going to be greed rules so I lost out on the casting bracelets to the PUG BLM that joined us... and I also died to the mobs at the end of T3 because most of the group made it and I didn't realize that I wasn't supposed to go to the pad but to the allagan teleporter.

 

Here's to hoping I'll get Quelling strikes (2 lvls away) this week...

 

Quick question though: I have Crimson Gloves but the DL gloves have the accuracy so I used those. I went into T1-2 with 394 or so accuracy w/o food and whatnot. I of course decently missed a few spells. I've been told to get Zenith first then the myth body but while Zenith gives more DPS the myth body would give me a good boost in accuracy. Which would really be better to get next week?

[Aleister]

I honestly felt a little bad recently since I only got to ilvl78 in the last week and will be getting my Relic+1 or Myth body next week... but I took in a lot of the great advice here! I wasn't really thought of to be taken along when mentioned but people have started to consider it... so when my FC's static really couldn't get a good set time for this week my friend said we'd do it on Monday so 6/8 of the group was our FC or our FC LS friends. We got through T1-T3 but I don't nearly have the gear for T4.

 

It was quite fun even though Caduceus really wanted to eat me when the split happened and the tank on my split died and we had to wipe... He liked me so much he took a bite out of me, left me with about 100 HP, took everyone else down and then came back for the rest!

 

We didn't make it clear enough that it was going to be greed rules so I lost out on the casting bracelets to the PUG BLM that joined us... and I also died to the mobs at the end of T3 because most of the group made it and I didn't realize that I wasn't supposed to go to the pad but to the allagan teleporter.

 

Here's to hoping I'll get Quelling strikes (2 lvls away) this week...

 

Quick question though: I have Crimson Gloves but the DL gloves have the accuracy so I used those. I went into T1-2 with 394 or so accuracy w/o food and whatnot. I of course decently missed a few spells. I've been told to get Zenith first then the myth body but while Zenith gives more DPS the myth body would give me a good boost in accuracy. Which would really be better to get next week?

I'm assuming you're a black mage? You have the regular relic weapon so either keep it or try to knock out extremes. The chestpiece is far more needed if your static will be working on T4. T1-T2 (T3 is a joke) you can get away with having not met the accuracy cause its there to gear you but T4 and T5 you must meet the ACC requirement or you're not gonna get the turn done.. So if you know what you need for range try to aim close for it and get the rest via food.

 

I looked around for a ACC cap and it seems to be somewhere 432-451. I would aim for the 451 for turn 4/5 to avoid any misses.

 

Turn 4 is a pure DPS race along quick thinking for tanks. Turn 5 is a endurance test while meeting trying to beat the hard enrage. ACC is pretty important as you'll want to land every hit.

[Kage]

To be honest I think most of my FC would be less willing to take me through T4 (while being ok with me in T1-3) so it may not be the issue. It seems like I'm able to make it through T1-2 fine (T3 well.. I can't dodge things that hit me as I bounce through the air and die after a large mob aggros... or if they're sitting right outside the exit). So I don't think I'm quite in a "hurry" to join them in T4 as it seems to be at least a month or so in the future before I can.

[Aleister]

To be honest I think most of my FC would be less willing to take me through T4 (while being ok with me in T1-3) so it may not be the issue. It seems like I'm able to make it through T1-2 fine (T3 well.. I can't dodge things that hit me as I bounce through the air and die after a large mob aggros... or if they're sitting right outside the exit). So I don't think I'm quite in a "hurry" to join them in T4 as it seems to be at least a month or so in the future before I can.

Then aim for the Zenith.  Just offered my two piece of thought from the view you were concerned about getting into T4.