Lament

I don't see what the problem is with not being "skilled" at RP (enough to pull off a concept "well")? We're not writers. We're not writing a book. We're having fun. It's a hobby. If someone has fun playing a character who is that powerful, that influential, that special, why not? You're basically judging people for not having fun the same way you do. You don't have to like what they like, so judging them for not liking what you like is pretty hypocritical. Edit: This is why I defend not RPing with people if you disagree with how they conduct their RP. You don't have to interact. This isn't a group with set rules that someone is breaking. Unless someone is outright trolling or otherwise trying to purposefully disrupt your RP, let them do whatever they want. Do your own thing. RP with like-minded people. Problem solved.

$0.02 I am not playing on a PS3, so this is only what I've heard from other PS3 users (mostly in dungeons): You definitely want to plug your keyboard to your PS3. It does suffice for communication, but (I am told) it's a bit of a hassle to juggle typing and playing. I've also run into a PS3 player who didn't know a PC version existed and was set on finding a physical copy to switch to PC. He was that frustrated with it. Most PS3 users I run into are very quiet, which probably is because it's hard to play and type at the same time, so you may have trouble RPing if you like to emote and move as you do, I suppose? Someone with a PS3 can give a more informed opinion, though. Yes, the login issues are mostly gone. I land a queue on Balmung now and then. Balmung and Gilgamesh are open on and off throughout the day, so it's possible to roll either. As for which, that's your choice to make, but it does seem like you could find more people on Balmung.

Being hostile to someone because they're new and learning the ropes, because they don't know enough of the lore, or because they RP differently from you - that's elitist. There's no excuse for it. It's a hobby, it's for fun, people are allowed to have their fun if they're not hurting anyone, and it's nobody's business how they go about it. By that same token, nobody should be judged for wanting to stay inside their comfort zone, as long as they're not hurting anyone, or fancy themselves superior for it. They are more than likely missing out on meeting some great people, or finding some amazing RP, yes. But they, too, are allowed to have their fun in whatever way they choose to go about it. I think it's a wonderful mindset, wanting to include everyone as much as possible, and being proactive in that regard. But it's not a mindset for everyone. Asking people who really are not interested to compromise, however, is futile. It's much better for everyone involved if they're left to do their own thing rather than expected to do anything else, really. Now, if there's any kind of superiority complex going on, or if they're patronizing, demeaning or mocking other RPers for doing things differently in any way, then they can go roll in a bed of Cactuars. Flaming Cactuars. Edit: Drat, new reply! I will edit my edit with a reply to the reply... er. Edit of the edit with a reply to the new reply: I didn't tell you that, and nobody should tell you that, either. In fact, I specifically said you can even consider that the main storyline actually happened to your character, which seems to be a big no-no as it would mean your character is really important, has a really rare talent, has met with every important person known to man, and has basically defeated every Big Bad under the sun, which is the quintessential Mary Sue. But that is how the game's story goes, that is the canon, and that is, obviously, entirely possible. With 'standards' in this case I just meant what you, personally, are looking for in RP. Not unlike your standards for finding a significant other. Or your standards for music. Or food. Or clothing. It's probably a terrible choice of wording, but I can't think of anything else... preferences? Personal choices? 'Standards' does seem to carry a rather elitist tone to it, but I'm not actually sure if it always does, it's the word I've seen used in this kind of context. Sorry, my first language is actually Portuguese, some nuances are lost on me. I did not actually mean to imply any particular choice was superior to the other, but I can see how it came across that way. I apologize for offending you, it was definitely not my intention. That said, I also did not call anyone a mary sue, overpowered, ridiculous, munchkin(, etc.) and I mostly glazed over the topic but I didn't see much of it here, either. And I'm also not choosing to ignore the lore in any way, shape, or form. I voted yes in the poll. Of course Primals can be killed ICly, though I would personally not involve my characters unless they had a particular reason to be fighting a Primal (they don't, as of yet, anyway). Even if I was, though, it'd be a personal choice. I don't want to tell others how to RP. They know what's fun to them, I don't.

Sewer systems are far cleaner than simply dumping waste wherever, especially since it means you can contain the waste and treat it, if their society has access to such knowledge. It depends. Dumping waste wherever in a city is unclean, but Gridania doesn't even have pavement - it's a city, sure, but it's also pretty much integrated into the forest, and around it there's earth and grass and trees as far as you can see. Waste is a natural fertilizer and though it's never particularly pleasant, it's not as out of place in a forest setting as it would be in a city. They seem more likely to bury their waste than feel the need to find a way to contain or treat it.

I agree plumbing seems reasonable when they're capable of making flying contraptions, since plumbing is more a matter of engineering than technology. Gridania does seem unlikely to have plumbing, but for me more because of their attunement to nature than anything. I can't imagine them being very partial to sewer systems that would drop waste into clean water.

I figure they're there as a way to slow the run down, even if they don't drop anything. Maybe there would be better ways to do that, but that is pretty much the only purpose enemies that give no xp/loot would serve, especially since the dungeon as a whole has rewards. The incentive (which is bad incentive, I know) is getting them out of the way so you can move on.

Paint them different colors, like keys! ...Attach each to a different earring? Keep them in a jewelry box and hope nobody mixes them up? Linkpearls, for all your IC mistell needs. PS all you need to make a pot of coffee is fire, a pot (ok, two pots), water, cloth, and coffee powder (and sugar, if you don't take it black). So fear not! Your character can make a pot of coffee in the morning.

Yes, being new comes with its own set of issues, especially when trying to fit into an established group. It's extremely intimidating to try to fit someone else's firmly established standards - I've been there. The first RP group I was ever in (before then I'd only done one-on-one) was controlling, judgmental and extremely toxic. They bullied someone out of their corner of the internet because she said she disliked a character that the moderators liked (I wish I was kidding). They kept private chatrooms to mock and laugh at other players and their characters. I'm not even exaggerating out of spite - they openly edited their profiles and made lengthy posts with insults and mockery for everyone to see. Eventually they managed to drive out 90% of their players. They are so incredibly possessive that they actually took over the characters of players who left. That was my first exposure to group RP. All of these people were extremely well-spoken and wrote lengthy, detailed, convincing explanations. Naturally, I took it as the RP standard for a while, and so did others, or we wouldn't have joined - but eventually, we realized that those were actually terrible standards, and left. Which isn't to say every newbie's experience is as extreme - there are great people out there, just as much as there are jerks out there. Both can be equally eloquent and sound equally convincing, and both can surprise you with how accommodating they can (or can't) be. I'm past the stage of experimentation and I know exactly what I'm looking for in RP these days - new people often do not, and the only solution is to get out there and experiment. You may be really impressed by someone's character and a big fan of their interpretation of lore, and then end up really disappointed in the person themselves. Or you may think someone sounds uninformed and outlandish, and they're the easiest person in the world to work with. I can only speak for myself, but while I am very set on what kind of RP I am looking for, I am also very likely to do as much as possible to include someone who wants to try it out. I likely can't/won't change a group's established lore to accommodate one person, since that'd be unreasonable, but I'm more than willing to try and find alternatives/explanations for things. Sometimes a thing or two about a character just won't fit with the group's headcanon, which is unfortunate. I have, personally, rolled alts before to fit in with a group, because an existing character wouldn't. It happens. I've been called intimidating multiple times. People are often afraid to talk to me and end up judged (or worse, somehow). But in the end, if people don't put themselves out there and try to talk to RPers/groups they like, then they really won't find a group to belong in. Everyone who is experienced today started somewhere, too. On the plus side, since people who have set standards also tend to be very vocal about those standards, you have a better idea of what to expect, and if you want to avoid those people, you can. Ironically, I am shy about open world RP. It intimidates me to not know what other people's standards are, to not know if I'm intruding or not. I can't just walk up to someone and RP, anxiety dictates I need to know what to expect before I try. ...Which is why I only even signed up in these forums after a topic I could identify with came up.

I posted similar things, I ran RP groups for years in a highly judgmental environment, so I'll take a gander: You can RP however you like. If you want to RP a different fandom altogether within FFXIV, you can. Nobody has any right to judge you for what you like to do, especially as a hobby, if you're not harming anyone. But RP, ultimately, comes down to compatibility. You can be the most open-minded person in the world, but if your style and someone else's don't match, then they don't match, and there is little anyone can do about it. I like planning things in advance and discussing characters extensively. I like having an idea of where my character is headed. I also know that plans are fluid and can change, but I still enjoy them, and I especially enjoy figuring out ways to get two seemingly unrelated characters to interact based on discussion (which by default requires some planning). I RP best with people who like to mix spontaneity with a bit of planning and plenty of discussion. Likewise, someone else may not enjoy planning in advance at all. If I suggest planning, this may annoy them, and make them feel like I'm trying to control the direction their character goes in, for instance. They may prefer to not disclose details about their character at all, and let everything happen naturally and spontaneously. They would RP best with like-minded people. Neither style is superior to the other. They're just different. I probably would not RP with someone who likes full spontaneity only, because it's likely to cause conflict - not because I think they're inferior. If there's a part of lore someone would prefer to be moderate about (or disregard), that's their prerogative. If someone wants to disregard lore altogether, that's their prerogative. If someone wants to consider the main storyline as actually having happened to their character, that's their prerogative. There's no elitism in having standards. There is in pushing them on other people. You don't need to RP with someone if you feel their standards are too different from yours. That's okay. RP is like any other hobby - you like some things, other people like other things, and nobody needs to change what they like to fit the needs of someone else. If you dislike classical music, I shouldn't be making you listen to it. If I dislike rock, you shouldn't be making me listen to it. You can listen to rock and I can listen to classical music and we can both be happy.

I don't know about WoW, but it's definitely easier to address the issue in FFXIV, with dungeons having more contained spaces and limited surfaces that can be walked on, than it is in GW2 where you can pretty much jump on anything and fall anywhere and have your path limited only by walls and falls that will kill you. Skipping is still a huge problem there - I don't know a single person who will run a certain dungeon and not skip a certain battle on a certain bridge. The issue in GW2 was so impossible to deal with that they ended up settling for limiting dungeon rewards instead. People are still incredibly elitist regardless, often requiring specific gear or a specific class, so all it did was slow down the farm, unfortunately. And being a long time GW2 player I'm really glad the issue is being addressed here. It's bad enough with gear elitism and class elitism that we don't need people also yelling at each other because someone would dare to want to do all the content. :\

If you rolled Need, his Greed roll wouldn't even come up. I think it's commonplace where people just roll Greed on everything just because they'll eventually level another class. At least that's what I do (unless a party member realllly wants something, then I'll pass), but I'm generally queuing from the Dutyfinder LS. Hurp. I meant Need, yes. In my defense, it was early in the morning! ...Not in my defense, I should've been asleep.

Category A: You, OOCLY 1. Are there any any races you particularly love the opposite (or same) gender of? The models, the history, the lore, anything. I am a shallow person, and as a shallow person, I like all the pretty models (Miqo'te, Midlander Hyur, Elezen). Lalafell are adorable, but too young-looking. Highlanders and Roegadyn are too manly. OK but seriously, looks aside, I don't actually have a particular preference. I like the lore as a whole. 2. How do you view interracial couples in -game-? Specifically, let's not get into a debate about whether or not it's 'gross' to you as a person or if there are too many people doing it. The lore obviously supports interracial boinking, at least as far as prostitution is concerned, so I don't see why not. Some couples may be... difficult... mostly due to body differences (I'm looking specifically at Lalafells and... anyone else), but seriously - every humanoid race can communicate, which by default means they can bond, which by default also means they can bond romantically. Physical attraction would factor in, so interracial couples may be less common, but they certainly seem possible to me. 3. Do your OOC feelings towards a particular race make you more open or affect what your character is looking for when they're either flirting around, pursuing romance, or just, in general, acting differently towards those individuals. Nope. I may have created my character, but they are a separate entity from me. Sure, there are things I would be uncomfortable playing due to OOC reasons, and some traits I wouldn't ever want a character of mine to have (I'm not a fan of the sadist evil for the sake of evil types, for instance), but nothing related to any of the races. Category B: Your character 1. Does your character seek friends or partners based predominantly on race? I have several working concepts, but my current main definitely does not. She's a tribeless Miqo'te, so she could never afford to be particularly choosy re: who to interact with or what race they are. 2. How does your character view interracial pairings and are their feelings different from your own? She is tribeless, as far as she is aware, because her parents broke a tribal rule (she was sired by a Tia) and were cast out, so she has certain... reservations about couples which may be considered taboo. I'm not sure whether or not interracial couples would be taboo in every single case, or at all, but she would be wary of anything that is outside of the conventional, since she saw how it affected her parents and, of course, how it personally affected her as their child. Worth noting she does not believe she herself should be in a relationship, interracial or no.

Right? Which I know will bring me at odds against my belief that taking down Titan or Garuda would be a much more Herculean effort than taking down Ifrit. I actually don't know yet how I'll handle someone showing me Titan-egi or Garuda-egi, . That's part of why I reserve the right to not RP if I think someone's pushing the canon too far (for my personal tastes). The lore is there, yes, and people will choose to follow it to varying degrees. We all have our little headcanons of how things related to our characters actually work - one summoner's take on canon may be different from the next, so it would boil down to incompatible RP. If you play a SMN who would, logically, keep track of when Titan and Garuda show up, and then suddenly another RPer comes up and their character makes contradictory claims to that knowledge, providing IC proof (in this case the egi)... you can just choose to disregard that particular interaction. When joining a group with a joint storyline, though, these things should probably be discussed beforehand so everyone is on the same page. It wouldn't do for the group to have established that their particular headcanon is that Titan and Garuda have been out of reach for decades, and then a 20 year old SMN joins the group with both egi and starts showing them off, disregarding what was previously agreed on. For me it's similar to like... someone's character having the Echo and proving it by knowing things that you've revealed about your own character OOC, but not IC. Yes, someone with the Echo *could* find out, but if you don't want that to happen, nobody can force it on your character just because it's doable in-game.

I think it'd be fun to see how characters would react IC to an impossible claim. Mine probably don't know nearly enough about Primals to make informed comments, so they would probably think it very much like a fisherman talking about catching one, nay, TEN sharks! But if the player is the one insisting that their character vanquished THE Primal, whoops I left a cake in the oven...

@C'io: I think Summoners have plenty of IC reasons to take part in the killing of Primals - heck, you could even justify one obsessing over the next time Titan is going to show up so they can use its Egi, that sort of thing. So I agree! A player could choose to disregard the lore and make the claim that their character killed the actual Primal. And then I would choose to disregard the player, as far as RP is concerned - I wouldn't react ICly to it because it's an OOC decision, not a player purposefully making their character claim to have done (what the player acknowledges as) the impossible. And I prefer to RP within the lore, myself, even if it does need to be twisted a bit sometimes (e.g. to explain the existence of multiple WHM even though the game says you're the first one in ages, that sort of thing).

I don't need to believe or acknowledge someone's character's claim of killing Ifrit, but whether my character will is another story entirely. If it would fit the character to call another character a lunatic, then by all means.

I'm more of the mindset that it's within my right as a roleplayer to refuse to RP with a person if I disagree with the way they're playing their character.

DPS queues are cray, even for earlier dungeons. Tank or healer can land a party in seconds, DPS waits forever. I usually am healing or tanking so what I usually do if I need a dungeon is to ask in /say or /shout before going to Duty Finder, pick up a pair of DPS that have been waiting around, then queue up. This only gave me trouble once, was healing, landed two *very* bad DPS and one who was AFK nearly the whole run and then rolled greed on every single piece of caster gear (that he didn't deserve), which was pretty irritating, but otherwise I generally end up with a couple of really thankful and nice folks that way.

With an IC excuse, I say go for it. But unless you're a summoner, who pretty much needs an IC excuse to actually be one, or otherwise formerly part of a group who would have a reason to have been in the presence of a Primal at some point or another (e.g. part of a tempered community), I'd say skip it.

Yep, I found that too. Actually, what I misread was another forum topic that brought up that they -could- be patriarchal or they -could- not be patriarchal and probably both forms of society exist given the number of different tribes. I also think I took the part about Nunhs not always becoming leaders and the part where, even though they are the root of a new clan (when they establish one) they are also replaceable and my brain equated a fact out of that that doesn't actually exist. Sorry 'bout dat. D: I was hoping for more lore. Darn. Thanks for clarifying though! The naming conventions topic does state they are patriarchal, just not the degree of it. I imagine women do hold important positions in most of the tribes - at least most of the NPCs don't seem to be the submissive, meek types, which would be expected if the patriarchy was very strict - and that each tribe has its own quirks. I always took the Keepers as more extreme in the male/female value gap, since their naming conventions are way more severe and imply a lot more disregard for the individuality of males than the Seekers' conventions do for that of females. It reminds me of an ancient Korean dynasty that is alluded to in a visual novel, where women were so unimportant in the hierarchy that they didn't even get their given names written in family trees - just the name of the family they came from, whereas men got their given name and their family name.

A bit off topic, but Siobhain, I'd love to know where that knowledge of Miqo'te lore comes from - what I've seen on the wiki and in the naming conventions page is vague, and while the comparison to lions seems valid, the naming conventions do seem to imply that for Seekers, the male is the root of the family. The naming conventions also specifically state that Nunh status does not equate to leadership and that very few Nunh ever become leaders, so it seems like while being a Nunh seems to be a desirable element for breeding, it doesn't actually have any impact on your power within the tribe's hierarchy (though I'd wager it would make you important, as a source of new offspring). I haven't gotten far enough into the game to see if there's any further exposition there and I am really curious if there are other sources of lore I haven't found yet! I also remember reading somewhere that one Nunh per 10-50 females is average, which seems to imply there can be more than one Nunh per tribe, but for the life of me I can't remember where it was I read that. Herp durp I have a high quality memory. It's in the naming conventions topic:

I find that when I have trouble coming up with a backstory, brainstorming with other players helps a ton. Experienced RPers can also give advice on what 'traps' to avoid - things that normally cause drama in RP, like something being too OP or going overboard with the past traumas in a group that mostly does casual, light-hearted RP, for instance. Plus, talking to people about your character can help get them interested in them, so it never hurts to try. If you're new, try to be open to criticism, though, and if you're a veteran, try not to be rude just because you've seen that concept done dozens of times. The newbie likely hasn't.

It's much the same with the way Miqo'te are portrayed in some areas, though - the game isn't skirting around mature themes just because they may be uncomfortable. Miqo'te seem to be the typically fetishized race, so it's not too unusual that some of them would resort to things like exotic dancing or prostitution. It's a way for them to make a living when there are no other options, and being part of a fetishized group means you get more work, so to speak. It doesn't actually imply promiscuity, like it doesn't for those women in Sastasha - hell, I doubt most real life prostitutes do it out of personal enjoyment. You gotta do what you gotta do to get by. So don't let it bother you too much. And for the few who do it out of personal enjoyment, good for them - might as well make money doing what you like. If a male Seeker's primary duty can be breeding, I don't see why a female's primary hobby couldn't be.

....is he too good for us??!! What does this mean, Michi?! TwT ;-; No bro I... I mean. I mean he is.. very kind hearted and probably a little odd for even a Miqo'te with his emotional connection to things. Contemplates a lot of things. If it makes you feel any better, based on the lore it is my headcanon that male Keepers are expected to be introverted, contemplative, maybe even submissive. I imagine it'd vary a lot from group to group, since they live in small familial communities, but Keepers are matriarchal, and the males don't even get their own given names (It's always # Son of Mother Lastname). So they probably are quieter and possess more typically feminine qualities (e.g. being sentimental) to begin with. It seems to fit, especially when you consider how assertive the Keeper females you encounter around Gridania are.

Since the FATE example came up, here's another example you encounter much earlier: If you pay attention when running Sastasha, you'll notice a couple of things: - There are a lot of female NPCs dressed as maids in there. - The captain specifically asks where his 'maidens' are. - One pirate NPC shouts to 'take the women alive'. - A few of the NPCs have little dialogue bubbles which make a very interesting story. When you enter the captain's chambers, a maid asks what the captain would like today - then realizes you're not the captain. One female swears she is not one of the pirates, 'on what little is left of her honor'. Another (a Lalafell, to be specific) pleads for you to help them. It's obviously implied the captain kidnapped those women (regardless of whether they were prostitutes or not) and forced them into servitude, likely sexual slavery too, based on the little honor left bit. Yet one of them still cheerily asks what the captain would like today - likely because if she tried to resist or was rude, she would get punished for it. The game really makes no effort to skirt around the more mature topics, and while Miqo'te may be portrayed in that light more often, and that one Miqo'te's client was a Roegadyn... we have a sleazy captain (Hyur or Roegadyn, I can't remember right now) with Hyur, Miqo'te and Lalafell in his service, too.