A Duskwight Discussion

[Eva]

More really good points, and there's not much more I can add here.  I'm still in love with the idea of a Duskwight LS, even though Eva might never wholly feel a sense of belonging to such a group.

 

I wanted to talk a little more about backgrounds and heritage, since I've found I've had to take a lot of artistic license with this for Eva's own backstory.  I confess I've intentionally kept her at a distance from her ancestral homeland and the people there, since it's entirely unofficial and only my own interpretation of one possible way a duskwight community might exist.  This has been left to speculation, so I did just that.  I've known other RPers who have taken similar liberties with regard to their own duskwight backstories, just as I would imagine some miqo'te, hyur, and others have had to draw certain conclusions for themselves.  Much of this also plays off what another RPer I interacted with at the time had done with his own upbringing - specifically Oskar Helvig, for those who may have known him.  I don't want to discuss too extensively what he had done, but it's impossible to talk about Eva's original homeland without giving some nod to him, since he effectively gave me a launchpad from which to create something similar, but also a little different.  To keep things as brief as possible since Oskar's player may come here and explain things more fully than I could possibly hope to do, Oskar came from a cavernous place "somewhere north" where there were multiple clans who feuded with one another for survival and his people were very cognizent of that, celebrated a sort of ancestor worship, sung hymns, had certain women who were regarded like shamans sort of, and were generally very warlike - as they had to be.

 

It makes sense that the duskwight may have split apart into different factions and spread across Eorzea, just as all the other races are generally distributed across the world.  I know another RPer whose duskwight people lived in caves in Thanalan.  I see nothing wrong with this, though I can see where some might argue that most duskwight settlements be located in woodland areas - I think someone earlier suggested the Black Shroud and Coerthas only.  I don't know that I see a Thanalan settlement as ignoring the lore so much as having a slightly different interpretation of it.

 

Eva's clan was sort of a moot point early on since I had little intention of actually RPing her backstory to that depth, but it became an issue in RP and it became clear that I had to come up with something.  So what follows is a kind of an analysis of Eva's culture, which aims to explain some of the more 'odd' traditions which she upholds.  She had to go back to that place when her father died in order to enscribe his name upon a cavern wall.  That will make more sense later in this post I suppose.

 

The clan to which Eva's family belongs (or 'belonged' depending on your interpretation, though they themselves were very welcoming of her in the few occasions where she returned) are situated very deep beneath the mountains of Coerthas.  Getting there has been described as a difficult descent that takes several hours.  Getting back up is even more taxing.  I try to keep things as vague, but I also try to keep them extremely displaced from everything else.  There are few other clans that deep down, and runoff from one of the rivers of Coerthas provides a sort of underground waterfall (dubbed by those people as Flowstone Falls) which brings with it food in the form of fish, and also a variety of edible mushrooms that grow nearby.  Life is relatively pastoral, peaceful, and probably relatively boring by most peoples' standards.  The people have established a harmony with the caves.  There are occasional skirmishes, and they have warrior-protectors, but it is not the central way of their life.

 

Written word in this particular offshoot of duskwight culture has been regarded as something sacred.  Literacy is important and children of this clan are taught it at an early age.  One usually needs to be able to see in order to write, or read, and light is another important element as a result of the first.  Candles are sacred items and those who are able to procure beeswax to make them are well-regarded, though this generally requires travel closer to the surface in order to facilitate.  There have been a few interesting traditions as a result of this.  First, the family has kept a collective journal that goes back generations.  Eva's great-grandfather did not start it, however they are the oldest journals she owns.  His earliest tome reveals that the earlier books were lost in a fire, and he endeavors in the first few volumes to recap what he remembers of the earlier family history - which is probably muddled a bit from the actual truth of much older events as a result.  Eva keeps a few dozen volumes of these journals in a safe place though, and continues recording her own experiences and adventures in journals of her own.

 

As mentioned before, candles are an important symbol in her culture.  While young men when they came of age would choose a single mate for life, it was the women who would "offer a candle" as a showing that she was interested in being chosen for a mate.  One might argue that the women held a lot of influence here, as a result, since a man could not take a mate who had not first offered him a candle.  This has been described as a very old tradition, and even more recently in the clan-lands men have given candles to young women as a similar gesture.  There has been at least one time in RP where someone offered Eva a candle with no understanding whatsoever of this practice and she blushed and felt awkward over the whole thing, even though she realized he had no idea what the meaning was.

 

There is also in her clan-lands a wall made of what is called "The Living Stone" (credit again goes to Oskar for originally coming up with this concept and allowing me to play around with it).  Apart from being a sort of special sort of rock from which jewelry may be fashioned and such, the only significance as I've RPed it is that there is a sort of abstract tie-in with thaumaturgy in general, and under certain [unknown] conditions, blood causes the stone to glow faintly.  "Enscribing" is a ritual Eva's ancestors have been practicing for generations where they bleed themselves, then use that blood to write the name of a fallen family member upon this wall.  Imagine a large chamber deep underground with names of hundreds or thousands of duskwights written upon it in blood that sometimes glows.  I don't know - I just thought it was pretty cool.  There is no lore around to completely substantiate it, but it's also not entirely impossible.  It's just one of those licenses we've taken.

 

Now that I've shared all of this, most of it is almost a moot point as the ancestral clan-lands were completely destroyed by seismic activity when Dalamud came about.  Eva wasn't down there at the time, but two people were above the surface, and only one actually survived.  So I guess this pushes Eva a bit farther away from her heritage in a sense, but it was a plot twist we felt was necessary and we really also wanted to drive home the destruction caused by Dalamud/Bahamut.  "Everything trickles down," was a common expression of those people.  Indeed it did.

 

 

I'm curious now if anyone else has taken liberties with the lore and such things in similar ways.  I know Isobeau's story mentions "Nymeia's apron-strings" as something which would make a great deal of sense in that sort of a culture.  And I think Kari mentioned how her clan has a sort of special regard for its women.  Are there any other rituals, customs, traditions, or anything else that you've concocted for your duskwight character along the way?

[Kyatai]

Very interesting background culture you've established, Eva- a spin off of Oskar's ideas or not. I love it

 

As far as my ideas, cultures and so on for Chiané- I'll have to get back to you on that. Am presently focused on my Miqo (how she cut ahead of my DW, I dunno. I attribute it to, once again, the DW has been kicked aside... *sighs* I suspect Chiané will make her displeasure known soon... *coughs*)

I've very excited about this discussion and seeing how others are envisioning playing their characters (and willingness to play them as true to lore/form as possible).

Conflict is good in story development- I'm glad we're all ok with not wanting to sit about singing Kumbayah and ignoring strife that is lore-supported.

 

Keep it coming

[Teardrop]

There's a couple parts in the lore where it basically says the Duskwight retreated from the surface in order to live a peaceful life away from conflict and among themselves. Why would they retreat from surface wars only to create eternal clan conflicts and inner warfare within their own kind? Maybe a family or two with disagreements between themselves, but honestly, it sure looks like everything points to the opposite. In fact, I'd say the the only real thing Duskwights have going for them is internal bonds and loyalty. If everyone else thinks you're scum and wretched, who else are you going to turn to except your own kind?

 

"Centuries ago, a number of Elezen sought out a life of peace and seclusion in the depths of Eorzea's caves and caverns."

"while the Duskwight Elezen withdrew to caves and sub-terrain, opting instead to avoid all contact with any but their own."

 

Again, you retreat from the surface to find peace among yourselves, then you create bitter struggle and warfare with yourselves. Not sure that situation is the plight of the Duskwights on a larger scale, based on the above comments. Rather, I think they know their kind is all they can depend on. They will feed on the other races, hence their reputation as thieves an pillagers, but I don't see anything to support that large-scale violence or animosity occurs within the Duskwights against others of their like.

 

I really enjoy reading the cultural rituals and symbolism you've used in your background, Eva. I delved quite a bit into that sort of development as an Elin in Tera, to take them away from the simple cutsie-character everyone took them as :dodgy:. Those kinds of things really breath life into a people, and as I further explore what it is to be a Duskwight, I'll definitely delve into that further :roll:. My Nymeia's Apron-String" was a lifeline the Clan Miners used to trace the route to the furthest extension of their dig. It was named as such because it was used to not only mark the direct path out of the depths, but would also help locate their remains should a collapse occur, so, like fate, it was going to bring them out of the tunnels alive or dead...it mattered not which, for its purpose .

[Eva]

There's a couple parts in the lore where it basically says the Duskwight retreated from the surface in order to live a peaceful life away from conflict and among themselves.  Why would they retreat from surface wars only to create eternal clan conflicts and inner warfare within their own kind?  Maybe a family or two with disagreements between themselves, but honestly, it sure looks like everything points to the opposite.  In fact, I'd say the the only real thing Duskwights have going for them is internal bonds and loyalty.  If everyone else thinks you're scum and wretched, who else are you going to turn to except your own kind?

 

On earlier points pertaining to Oskar's duskwight backstory and warlike clan, I should perhaps be clearer.  I don't want to speak to what exactly he was doing since he could probably better explain it.  I also don't know if his particular ancestors turned against each other.  It's possible that their lands were shallower caves closer to the surface and those that they fought with were of the other races.  I honestly don't know.  I just know they were described as much more Spartan in nature and couldn't see well enough to read and write so passed their history down by way of hymns and such.  Oskar used to regard other duskwights as 'Brother' and 'Sister' even when they belonged to different clans, so this leads me to believe his particular group wasn't so isolated that they held so little regard for duskwights who were outsiders to that group.  I recently spoke with him and made him aware of the existence of this discussion so perhaps he may post in reply for himself to elaborate further for us, however I'm not sure he has any plans of playing FFXIV any longer so I won't make that assumption and hope that what I have said about it so far is accurate.

 

For myself I agree with what you've said and felt it made a lot more sense to have Eva's ancestors segment themselves but remain peaceful towards each other.  Eva only went back to visit her ancestral homeland on three separate occasions (all within the last six months or so of 1.0), and on the second occasion she brought with her another duskwight who was welcomed into their lands as one of their own.

 

I think it makes a lot of sense that they sort of cling to one another when they happen to find each other.  This has actually happened in RP that I have been involved with.  To Eva it might be some comfort to find those who are familiar with rituals and traditions with which she was brought up, but which seem odd or foreign to most of the non-duskwights with whom she associates.  To someone less-integrated or not as assimilated into surface culture (i.e. the melting pot), it would certainly make sense to seek out another of their kind.  While it may go against more modern OOC mainstream beliefs that people should be diverse and all-encompassing, in-game adherence to the lore suggests that it would make a lot of sense for there to be this almost sort of magnetism between duskwights when surrounded by outsiders.

 

Have I mentioned enough yet that I'm really looking forward to this Duskwight LS that Kari's working on??  

[Asyria]

Okay I'm late in the thread, I'll try to poke in. ^^;

 

Racism and prejudice in games vs in real life.

 

The post about character perceptions being altered by player perceptions and cultures made me smile a bit. I was one of those players in Rift who looked down upon those wanting to kill the other faction on sight... in civilian areas. Sure on the battlefield, it was kill or be killed and there was much at stake, but Defiants came to a Guardian RP hub (partly bcause Defiants had little in terms of RP hubs) to RP peacefully so my character considered them civilians from an enemy nation and treated them as such. As long as weapons were kept sheathed, she was polite. One time some Defiants came to town flagged and looking for a fight.. my character gleefully jumped in!

 

So, while today's society may influence our perceptions, I firmly believe our characters have a right, as unique individuals, to see things a bit differently. Or even a lot differently. Our characters are not the majority and don't have to be representative of the masses.

 

As easy as it is to forget that the world we RP in is different than the world we live in, I think it's even easier to forget that even if there's more players than NPC's in the FF XIV game, the world of FF XIV has a lot more people living in it than the game shows us (and probably a lot more towns and much bigger ones too). It's all a matter of perspective.

 

 

 

Now, that Duskwight LS.... I'm almost afraid to ask.. but what server is it gonna be on?

 

As far as my own Duskwight goes, I'm not one to do a ton of research on lore, if it's not readily available. I took what little I had and went with it. Which is, Duskwights separated from the other ones, went underground, and came back out some time ago. So kinda like Drow but without the evil-ness, black skin, spider-loving and dual-wielding gary stu. Okay!

 

So I kept it simple, since what I had to work with was simple, and decided her mother was a weaver and her father a thaumaturge, and didn't think further into the past.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think this thread and all the digging that's been done is awesome!

But the fact you guys had to do it is just bad. This kinda lore should be readily available straight from the developers, if you ask me. ^^;

[Kari Illderthane]

 

Now, that Duskwight LS.... I'm almost afraid to ask.. but what server is it gonna be on?

 Balmung ^^

[Twinflame]

I really enjoy reading the cultural rituals and symbolism you've used in your background, Eva.  I delved quite a bit into that sort of development as an Elin in Tera, to take them away from the simple cutsie-character everyone took them as :dodgy:. 

 

At least with Elin we had the lore to back up that they weren't supposed to be cutsey moeblobs, even if most folk didn't pay attention to it. Actually, you know what? Let's just forget most of the Elin RP in TERA ever happened.

 

So, while today's society may influence our perceptions, I firmly believe our characters have a right, as unique individuals, to see things a bit differently. Or even a lot differently. Our characters are not the majority and don't have to be representative of the masses.

 

Oh, yes, definitely. I'm completely behind people RPing their characters however they want. But when someone is more tolerant than the norm of the world around them, I'm going to react ICly as if that is strange, not as though it is typical. It'll be notable. I'm also hoping to encounter other points on the spectrum of prejudice, from the norm (which sets itself against Duskwight) to the extreme (where one refuses to tolerate a Duskwight's presence). I think it would be best if there were characters in the community representative of each point.

 

---

Catching up on this thread took me forever. >_< Mostly because I haven't had the time to really sit down and read it in the past few days. At least it was a great read when I finally sat down to go through it. I love how much time and thought y'all have put into your Duskwights, and I'm looking forward to seeing them each IC. For this reason, I'm liking the idea of an IC LS for Duskwights. I'm not sure how much honest use my character would make of it, since he'll have his primary LS in the Commerce Regulation Agency, but anything that keeps me connected to people in a way that leads to RP is most welcome.

 

It's nice to see that most folk are RPing in a way that agrees more or less with the backstory I've got set up for Megiddo. Just so you don't have to go back two pages for a refresher: Megs is an elderly Duskwight who was the patriarch of a small family group (think like twenty people) who lived in shallow caves in the Black Shroud. So I guess we're calling them clans? I don't know why that word hadn't occurred to me before. So Megs was the patriarch of a clan.

 

I think the way I'm seeing this set up is that Duskwight society is greatly fragmented and spread out. The various clans found deep places in the earth, but didn't stay together, and didn't necessarily stay in intimate contact with one another. Over time, these split clans developed different ways of coping with life in the dark, with the peoples that lived above, with one another and with themselves. Some of them grew cruel (like Megs' clan), some of them became resourceful (teardrop's miners) and some of them developed deep-held traditions (Eva's very strong and tragic culture). Each of these flavors are fantastic and vivid, and now that we've moved into the overland again, we get to roleplay reconciling with one another as well as handling how the overland peoples perceive us.

 

I doubt SE is ever going to put out lore that tells us anyone one of our clans is wrong. Even if they eventually add an entire ancient Duskwight city full of lore for us to explore, they will always have been outliers from that culture.

 

So here's my idea:

 

What I think would be great is if we all accepted the existence of one another's clans and accepted each of them as canon (within reason. As long as nobody does a werewolf-vampire-angel clan, which I don't really expect to ever come up ). We should attach labels to our clan -- probably based off of location and the name of the original progenitors -- and then describe and define their believes. We can attach them to our wiki articles (my own is forthcoming, so I can just tack it in there). The reason I think this would be awesome is because Megiddo is an Elder, more than sixty years old; he's traveled a lot, met a lot of Duskwight, and knows a lot. I would like him to have incomplete IC knowledge of different clans, and it would be interesting to try and attach his heritage to a few different clans.

 

For instance, Megs' family group would have been Clan Desfosse of the Black Shroud. Their culture would have emphasized family relations, reverence of one's ancestors, and surviving at the expense of overlanders. Nothing was sacred except for one another, and everyone was equal in responsibility, but clan leadership fell upon a single patriarch. Of course his clan is dead, now, but I plan on rolling up a full family tree and, if I go crazy, may go back several generations. In the process, I can connect his ancestry to some of y'all's clans.

 

What do you guys think of that? *is super excited to be back in the conversation*

[Teardrop]

Actually, you know what? Let's just forget most of the Elin RP in TERA ever happened.

 

 

Oh, I'm proud of my time as a Daughter of Elinu...some of the things I'm most proud of I've written about my Elin. If I can develop Isobeau's character a fraction of how my Elin was, I'll be a happy role player in FFXIV 8-).

 

Moeblob...heh :dodgy:

 

I'd love to know more about everyone's background, and how it might relate to Clan Mauvaix . There is still a lot for me to learn about the setting we're about to delve into, so a lot of the things I have conceptualized are not quite set in stone, simply because I'm not sure where those stones are to be found yet . I'm certainly one to respect other's choices as far as their clan make-up, structure, traditions, etc...I do think, as in real life, there is great room for diversity in such things, and I look forward with great interest to see what those things are .

 

It seems that the general consensus of those commenting is that the Duskwights for the most part are a close community within themselves, and I think thats really the only way that a Duskwight Linkshell would work. If the thought was our race was troubled with internal conflict, warfare, and strife, well, it would set up a situation where we would be at each other's throats much more than even the Wildwood's. "Sure, treehugger there called me a Grey, but your cousins stole the last bags of blackrock fungal florets we had tucked away in our winter stores, and my clan elders starved as a result...I'M GONNA KILL YOU :evil:!!!" We would obviously look to each other with even less trust than those races who merely call us names.

 

From a role play standpoint, what are some of the reasons one might put a Duskwight linkpearl into use?

From an OOC standpoint, how might a player utilize a Duskwight linkpearl to enhance their role play experience?

 

Some things to further ponder...we have a couple of weeks to do so

[Kari Illderthane]

Going to take a break, then later do the write up but I did make this today.

 

[Eva]

Kari that's beautiful!!

 

I'd honestly never thought to giving a label to Eva's ancestral homelands clan ('clan' just seemed appropriate, but I suppose tribe, lineage, or whatever other communal noun might make sense could as easily be substituted). Her family's surname - Zelorius - would only encompass one branch of a greater tree. The signature landmark of that place was the Flowstone Falls I'd mentioned in an earlier post, so perhaps they could all be lumped as "The Flowstone Clan" or somesuch - though from all I've seen of elezen arrogance it would probably make more sense for a name to be used. Even though the lands are destroyed they may still be regarded historically by other duskwight who may have traded, bartered, or whatever. I'll give this further thought, or perhaps I'll finally figure out a surname for the clan's Elder (a man we've only referred to as Elder Roven so far).

 

From a role play standpoint, what are some of the reasons one might put a Duskwight linkpearl into use?

I can only speak to my own character here, but to kind of reacquaint herself with people similar to her own after her original homeland was wiped out would bring her some comfort, I think. She now has no remaining family except for one very distant cousin, and that - to her - would make preserving those traditions she was brought up to follow even more important.

 

From an OOC standpoint, how might a player utilize a Duskwight linkpearl to enhance their role play experience?

A place to duskwights to call for help when they feel no one else would answer? A place to rally duskwights together to celebrate cultural things like festivals and such, if such things are a part of one's clan's culture. I am probably overlooking some other great possibilities here as well. What if there was some overlap in traditions between the clans? Perhaps some sort of annual ceremony that's celebrated by many/most of the groups. Or perhaps representatives from each of the clans assembled on regular schedules to discuss things like truces, sharing of resources, and whatever else. I'm reaching a bit maybe, but just trying to brainstorm.

 

 

Also as kind of an afterthought, when I have RPed Eva's descent to that place, her linkpearls ceased working. While we know for a fact that linkpearls do continue to work underground in places like Mun-Tuy Cellars, Nanawa Mines, etc. I've left the reasons for this obscure intentionally. Perhaps it's just so deep underground that they stop working. Perhaps the "Living Stone" interferes with the signal. I don't give any specific reason, but it's always been important to me that the trek down there leave her isolated from the surface. I just thought that was an interesting point I'd add.

 

I love this thread~ :lol:

[Teardrop]

 

Also as kind of an afterthought, when I have RPed Eva's descent to that place, her linkpearls ceased working. While we know for a fact that linkpearls do continue to work underground in places like Mun-Tuy Cellars, Nanawa Mines, etc. I've left the reasons for this obscure intentionally. Perhaps it's just so deep underground that they stop working. Perhaps the "Living Stone" interferes with the signal. I don't give any specific reason, but it's always been important to me that the trek down there leave her isolated from the surface. I just thought that was an interesting point I'd add.

 

I love this thread~ :lol:

 

I had to kind of think about this as well, Eva, as to why my Clan would use a physical line with a coded set of yanks and tugs used as signals for communication, when a linkpearl should work :dodgy: And, I also made mention that for whatever reason, linkpearl communication wasn't always reliable in certain subterranean locations. We'll have to keep an eye on a more thorough explanation why that might be the case if one turns up in lore or whatnot, but I'm comfortable with that assumption as-is for our purposes :thumbsup:

[Twinflame]

From a role play standpoint, what are some of the reasons one might put a Duskwight linkpearl into use?

 

 

I would say the fact that the Duskwight can't count on anyone that is not a Duskwight, and since Duskwight are relatively rare and reclusive by nature, having a constant connection to them would be self-evidently useful. Besides just the social aspect, it would be nice if there were people one could turn to for help that would not deny that help based on the fact that you are a Duskwight.

 

From an OOC standpoint, how might a player utilize a Duskwight linkpearl to enhance their role play experience?

 

 

As a Duskwight RPer, roleplaying with other Duskwight is going to be a cool experience that I might not just stumble across. As well, Megs is sort of prejudiced against non-Duskwights, since he was raised to believe he must exist in conflict with the overlanders. Any relationship is has with a Duskwight will be unique to that he has with others, and I'd like for him to have those connections.

 

 

Actually, you know what? Let's just forget most of the Elin RP in TERA ever happened.

 

 

Oh, I'm proud of my time as a Daughter of Elinu...some of the things I'm most proud of I've written about my Elin. If I can develop Isobeau's character a fraction of how my Elin was, I'll be a happy role player in FFXIV 8-).

 

Moeblob...heh :dodgy:

 

 

Ah, I didn't mean that all Elin were moeblobs! I knew some very good Elin roleplayers. They were just incredibly few in number. So, I was talking about, y'know, all those other folk. The kawaii desu desu kyaaa cutsey anime Elins. Those were just. You know.

[synaesthetic]

Ah, I didn't mean that all Elin were moeblobs! I knew some very good Elin roleplayers. They were just incredibly few in number. So, I was talking about, y'know, all those other folk. The kawaii desu desu kyaaa cutsey anime Elins. Those were just. You know.

 

Indeed.

 

The mad scientist argon cyborg and the cheerfully sociopathic artificial being who enjoyed playtime with knives.

[LeCard]

 

Also as kind of an afterthought, when I have RPed Eva's descent to that place, her linkpearls ceased working.  While we know for a fact that linkpearls do continue to work underground in places like Mun-Tuy Cellars, Nanawa Mines, etc.  I've left the reasons for this obscure intentionally.  Perhaps it's just so deep underground that they stop working.  Perhaps the "Living Stone" interferes with the signal.  I don't give any specific reason, but it's always been important to me that the trek down there leave her isolated from the surface.  I just thought that was an interesting point I'd add.

 

I love this thread~  :lol:

 

I had to kind of think about this as well, Eva, as to why my Clan would use a physical line with a coded set of yanks and tugs used as signals for communication, when a linkpearl should work :dodgy:   And, I also made mention that for whatever reason, linkpearl communication wasn't always reliable in certain subterranean locations.  We'll have to keep an eye on a more thorough explanation why that might be the case if one turns up in lore or whatnot, but I'm comfortable with that assumption as-is for our purposes :thumbsup:

 

It may seem a simplistic option(though it wouldn't explain why they wouldn't work) but one reason that LP communication may not have been in use by DW clans may be that it was viewed as an outsider tool. The clans could have chosen to avoid using this method of talking just because they wanted to distance themselves from everyone else. afterall, if we think of LP communication in terms of any type of communication through a medium that transmits waves, it could be "hacked" into by people with the right skill. maybe that wouldn't be easy becuase it functions like a radio but with a potentially much wider range of bandwidth options, so sifting through the various frequencies to find the one you are trying to listen in on. However if anyone ever captured/killed a DW with one of the pearls on them would make listening in that much easier.

 

On the note of how Rogier would use a DW LP, I think he would use it more as a source of people he could trust with helping his research without asking too many questions. He would also be likely to help others, if it was requested of him. Though he may not jump at the chance to go interact with others.

 

OOCly I would say that it would be a good tool to get rogier out of his books and into the world of others. It would also be a good way of building up a nice safe group that rogier could rely on, kind of like a clan since he technically doesn't have/know of a clan that he belongs to. He only had his parents and his fathers pirate crew(what little he saw of them) his life was otherwise secluded from everyone else.

[Yssen]

From a role play standpoint, what are some of the reasons one might put a Duskwight linkpearl into use?

"I against my brother; my brother and I against our cousin; my cousin and I against the stranger."

 

 

In a word, unity. While the consensus seems to be that the Duskwight are broken up into smaller groups such as families or clans, they still have an overarching culture that is uniquely Duskwight and puts them outside of mainstream culture. Even if they are all an assortment of clans that disagree with one another on different issues, there is still very much an "us against the world" vibe in the air. To expand in the above quote a bit. You don't always agree with your sibling, but if your cousin threatens your immediate family you shore up against that threat with your brother. When something from outside threatens your cousin, you shore and unify against that threat with your cousin. You do not shore up against the stranger against your cousin or your brother. You don't know the stranger, and they don't know you. 

 

 

Most Duskwights are placed outside of society as a whole, either by choice or by prejudice. An LS would exist to present unity (subtle or overt), against the threat of outsiders. Outsiders being defined as "anyone who is not a Duskwight," in this case. Individual motives may vary from character to character. Re-connecting with a culture one has never really known, trusting Duskwights on a whole more than non-Duskwights, being involved in the culture politics of the tribe, or even attempting to study and make sense of all the varied different practices of the smaller groups of the culture. All of these are very good reasons to be a part of a Duskwight only LS. Perhaps the simplest reason is just that we know Duskwights are not exactly forthcoming or open about their ways to outsiders. They have to talk about that stuff with someone, and that someone is other Duskwights.

 

 

From an OOC standpoint, how might a player utilize a Duskwight linkpearl to enhance their role play experience?

Most of the reasons above lead to great RP, and would probably lead to enhancing the overall Duskwight RP experience. It promotes shared experience across a racial tie, and promoting shared experience is never a bad idea. Connecting players and characters across as many different lines and such as possible is generally awesome. It will help to really get a sense of a living breathing world, even if it is only just a small part of it. I think it is a great step forward, and I will be supporting it however I can. ^ ^

 

One thing pops into my brain to add to the discussion over the next couple weeks. Has anyone given thought the the idea that there is a reaver or raider aspect to Duskwight culture?

[Kyatai]

Few things:

Eva- have you thought of torquing your Clan name idea (aka Flowstone Clan) into a French-esque translation? Coulanchute d'pier is kinda... long and unwieldy, (a smush-blend and abbreviation of the literal coulant chutes de pierres (flowing stone falls or coulant chute de pierre (flowing stone waterfall)) but... well this is how I look at language:

It evolves. Over time, it is tainted and altered based on external influences (other languages, new technologies, new discoveries, cultural differences, interacting with other clans, ... laziness... hehe) So... I'm not suggesting a literal french translation, but maybe a bit of influence, since that is lore-appropriate in naming.

I also suggest this because, it sounds like your clan might have been one of the more reclusive and 'pure' clans mentioned (with the exception of Meg's more primal one *grins*).

C'lanchu d'pierre?

C'lanchu d'pier?

 

... something...?

 

IDK... just a thought. hehe

 

Second...

LS's weren't possible for 5 years after the Calamity, right? Quite a short time to develop a tradition/culture around any adaptation you might have to make to communicate (aka Teardrop's idea), but if coupled with the overall distrust of 'uplander technologies that could be used to spy on us' as Rogier mentioned... might be cool. As in, initial distrust of linkpearls for the reasons he mentioned, then 'validated' by the Calamity- perhaps even making the DW able to 'recover' faster than the upworlders afterwards? Especially in addition to the chance that maybe more DW communities were more unaffected by the scourge of Balamut being underground. Saving earthquakes and the like, of course...

 

So... maybe the traditional root is there, the local adaptations... then the recovery is: a necessity to connect to more DW after Calamity to maybe... IDK... bind together to take advantage of the situation? Or create a stronger community in the face of continued prejudices- despite the world being weakened overall and kinda... NEEDING... everyone to pitch in and help with recovery?

*lots of thoughts beating about and I fear I'm not making sense- lol*

Just thinking binding together in a DW LS might serve a variety of purposes, depending on the DW character. Exploitation, building an army, simple connections/support, plotting, history acquisition & tradition recovery, Clan bonding... etc

 

AND... as part of Chiané's history, she'll be proficient in 'tinkering'- being one of those people that take things apart to figure out how they work, then try to put them back together and make them better. So... if the more suspicious DW or the community,.. she could work with others to alter the linkpearls to be more private and less risky if they fall into the wrong hands.

 

And yes... I love this discussion too! :love::love::love:

---

haha Yssen posted as I was writing...

 

I agree... and yeah, I think a reaver and raider aspect is totally logical. I mean, I don't think the tradition would be to get caught much *grins* which makes them so annoying to the rest of Eorzea for being thieves and scourges of society.

I can see an elite branch training to be such. Especially if they are more along the lines of Meg's clan archetype. I suspect any coming out of HIS clan would be truly terrifying indeed!

 

Oh... and I think coming up with Clan names and a bit of history of that Clan is very cool (just got done working on my Miqo's... haha) and linking it to our wiki pages... Esp for those of us that will be scholars and Clan/DW history gatherers.

Which, in the wake of Balamut and the overall anarchy and chaos following his arrival, I think would be VERY VERY desirable. I mean- I see DW as holding their histories and 'identities' as sacred. Even if they don't follow the traditions or whatever they came from... just having it... knowing it... gives one a sense of belonging.

[Smiling River]

What up my Duskwights.

 

Eva directed me here to elaborate on Oskar Helvig's background, which was a lot of fun to RP and make up as I went along. Here is the general stuff you can use if you wish, or dismiss entirely. This is all lore created by me and is in no way represented by SE.

 

 

 

Setting:

Due to the subterranean caverns that, unlike the surface, are not always connected, clans formed and sometimes wouldn't know of others who may have lived relatively close, geographically. These pockets of clans would compete for scarce resources since I imagine even food would be hard to cultivate underground. Due to the lack of lore as to where the Duskwights actually live, I sort of just made Oskar come from distant set of caverns to the North West.

 

 

Family:

Family was based around boys. Women were expected to basically take the roles of mothers as soon as they were able to produce children. A woman was honored by the number of boys she was able to bare, since they would become the next generation of warriors and conquerors for the clan. The only way for a woman to have land given to her was a reward for having three sons. One son would yield her an ewe, two something greater, and so on. The husbands would often be on campaigns so that women had to actually raise the boys to be the fighters their clan required them to be. So if a squad of male warriors came upon a village of women and children... it wouldn't be as easy as it may seem to take them down, since most women's martial/weapon prowess would be equal to that of men. They were simply spared the violence of war, and were required to pass along their skills to young boys who would use them for bloodshed. 

 

Wives were often taken from other clans by conquest. This served as a natural prevention to "bottle neck effect" - aka same genes being passed around. The people of a clan typically referred to each other as brothers and sisters, and taking a wife from one's own clan was almost incestuous. Taking one from a conquest was considered "earning" the right to be married, and proving yourself capable, proving that your genes should be passed on basically. The weaker men, or less trained, would die in battle before taking a bride from the warring clan, and thus they would not have passed on their traits.

 

 

 

 

Government:

Top warrior led the clan in it's external affairs, mostly war. Elders (aka warriors who survived long enough to grow old, a rarity) guided the people internally. The war-leader was respected for his skill (think Khal Drogo) and the elders for their experience. Typically the war-leader would seek advice from the elders. The elders in turn sought advice from the Oracle, and a number of other "odd" sources. Think of reading entrails, for example. Superstition and omens were a big part of decision making.

 

 

Ring-Giver:

The ring-giver is generally known through out the clan-lands from which Oskar hails, though I imagine he may have been known in other parts as well. The story goes that a great warrior was once born who united the clans for the first time through sheer force and willpower. There are several legends, but most agree that he was a man of great stature and weapon prowess. Some myths say he could breathe fire and do other similarly "impossible" feats using the old magic. Naturally many thought he would be reborn and a man who reunites the clans once more would prove himself to be the reincarnation of the ring-giver. The name ring-giver stems from rings, or rather large wrist braces which the Ring-Giver would gift to his warriors. They were both plunder and rewards for the warrior's commitment to him, as well as marks of certain ownership and loyalty to him. It was said that he was so strong that he could mold the plate of precious metal around a man's wrist.

 

Some say that numerous parties have visited Duskwights for the first time during the Ring-Giver's reign. One secret society has/had ancient records of this. They went by the name of Stormguard.

 

Moloch:

Another common element of folklore is the black wind which goes by several names. In Oskar's clan it's known as Moloch. It's considered both natural and a supernatural, a dark wind that blows through certain caverns which captures those who get caught in it. It is said to leave men's bodies and take with it their soul and mind. It feeds on those it comes across, and sometimes it seems to have a rational mind, as if it were a creature, not merely a wind. It was at once a hazard to all clans when it grew to almost reach the villages of clans. The clans believe that the world would end when it is consumed by Moloch, the black wind.  

Hymns:

Language was considered sacred from where Oskar hailed. Writing was not considered essential, because society was formed around oral history and hymns. This stems from the somewhat magical effects caverns have on speech, the way words bend when spoken in caves, echoes, and so on. 

 

A long time ego it's said that Duskwights used to have their own form of magic stemming from hymns. Hymns are magical and religious in a sense. Warriors would often sing hymns for their fallen enemies so that their souls would not stay to be taken by Moloch but instead go to the Living Stone. In the distant past they could open "sun-holes" with hymns, or tell stories of past warriors which would give courage and strength to those who listened and recited, as if borrowing it from the past. Spoken words are believed to be living things, and writing was almost like corpses of words, fallen and dead on the page. 

 

 

 

 

Religion:

Many older Duskwights, most of whom are now passed on, worshiped the Living Stone. Once the outside world began to trade with certain, more "cooked" clans who were open to interaction with non-Duskwights, the belief of the Twelve began to spread across the clan-lands. It united certain clans, and divided others who maintained their belief in the Living Stone. A war broke out between the factions, and the side who favored the Twelve won. From then on, worship of the Twelve spread more rapidly and only a few elders were not converted. Oskar's grandfather for example, was thought by his mother to be a bad example for the boy in his youth, because he still spoke of the Living Stone.

 

 

Living Stone:

 

A stone pulsing with a white glow, seeming to have veins of energy going through it. It reacts to touch, and if one listens closely, it may just speak to them. A hum that resonates from it is said to be a combination of all voices of Duskwight that came before. It's said to grow through out all clan lands, and before the Twelve, it unified all Duskwight, even those whose caverns were separated geographically, because the stone grew through out the underground.

 

The way the legend goes is that the dead were thrown into a deep chasm that ran through the clan-lands, across all clans. The bottom of the chasm became nothing but bone pressed into bone, so deep that pressure melded them together into a white stone. The souls of the dead lived in the stone, and the stone was in a sense living with their spirits. It would be rare to find, having "grown" out of the chasm in certain places. One may speak into it, and perhaps hear answers only the ancestors know.

 

 

 

 

The Oracle: 

Oskar's clan lands would have one Oracle, a woman who could walk in dreams as if they were reality. In them she could manipulate the future, or even the past. She could influence people, see their dreams, walk in them. This was a special ability honed through out a lifetime. An Oracle would see a child in her dreams, who would be the next Oracle, and that child's family would give her up for training. Girls with no training would soon get lost in their own dream and never wake.

 

The Oracle is a rarity, one in all clans. When one passes, another takes her place. The Oracle lives in one location, a neutral space between clans, and a place many visit for her for advice or in order to know the outcome of a battle, for example. She picks carefully who to advise, who is worth her knowledge. All clans giver her tribute so that she may favor them.

 

Rights of Passage:

I suppose the first right of passage for a young Duskwight happens before their birth. A mother-to-be must recite a hymn while swallowing a hot coal. If done absolutely correctly, and with a certain faith in the hymn, the coal would not harm her. Should she not be harmed, it's said to be a good omen and she is likely to bear a son. If she struggles, a daughter. If however something goes wrong and she cannot swallow the burning coal, it is a bad omen and many would think she will not carry the child to term.

 

119 Hymns - Instead of learning writing or any formal education, children learn the hymns. I forgot the exact number I may have mentioned before, but it's something around 120 hymns that they must memorize. Some are epic tales, others are short rhymes. There used to be many more hymns, but they were lost. It's said that in the past, the hymns had a lot more magical ability than they do now. It's said that their effectiveness had faded since the advent of the worship of the Twelve instead of the Living Stone. Many worry that the souls of the dead do not return properly to the Living Stone and are thus captured by Moloch, hinting at the coming end of times.

 

The Ousting - When boys reach early teens, they are sent off to the wastes. It is a barren subterranean plain with little food or shelter. They must live and survive there for a number of years before returning home. It is only after they survive that they are given their last name. They do not earn their family name at birth, since they have done nothing to be born. The Ousting is when they prove themselves worthy of their family, and clan.

 

Whatever happens there is not governed by any law, and thus many team up to survive, others may kill to do so. Think "Hunger Games" meets "Lord of the Flies", and you get The Ousting.

[Kyatai]

Very cool, Oskar... Great work up and society!

[Twinflame]

How many clans are we talking about here, Oskar? You keep mentioning "all" the clans, but I'm gonna guess you probably mean all the clans in an area. It's cool how much you've worked up you culture. It is, however, a lot of liberties to take for more than a handful of clans in an isolated part of that North West area.

[Smiling River]

I had an exact number escapes me, but somewhere in the teens, like 12 maybe? And yes by "all" mean the clans form the caverns my character is from.

 

It is a lot of liberties, I agree. However when SE gives next to nothing about a homeland of a race, an big part of what makes a character in my opinion, I view it almost as a personal obligation to fill in the blanks with compelling lore that others can either buy into, or simply ignore. This is all fiction anyway, north-west is vague, my ideas have no merit outside of what people assign to them. This is merely the world I've crafted from which my character has emerged. Hope SE gives you guys something more than last time around.

 

Have a good one :thumbsup:

[Mtoto Wamoto]

I had an exact number escapes me, but somewhere in the teens, like 12 maybe? And yes by "all" mean the clans form the caverns my character is from.

 

It is a lot of liberties, I agree. However when SE gives next to nothing about a homeland of a race, an big part of what makes a character in my opinion, I view it almost as a personal obligation to fill in the blanks with compelling lore that others can either buy into, or simply ignore. This is all fiction anyway, north-west is vague, my ideas have no merit outside of what people assign to them. This is merely the world I've crafted from which my character has emerged. Hope SE gives you guys something more than last time around.

 

Have a good one :thumbsup:

 

OH MY GOD YOU'RE BACK! :thumbsup:

[Twinflame]

I had an exact number escapes me, but somewhere in the teens, like 12 maybe? And yes by "all" mean the clans form the caverns my character is from.

 

It is a lot of liberties, I agree. However when SE gives next to nothing about a homeland of a race, an big part of what makes a character in my opinion, I view it almost as a personal obligation to fill in the blanks with compelling lore that others can either buy into, or simply ignore. This is all fiction anyway, north-west is vague, my ideas have no merit outside of what people assign to them. This is merely the world I've crafted from which my character has emerged. Hope SE gives you guys something more than last time around.

 

Have a good one :thumbsup:

 

That's not so bad, then. I just needed to confirm that all Duskwight didn't mean all Duskwight. I like the setup you've got, and I can only begin to imagine how it's inspired your -- and apparently Eva's -- characters. Considering that every time a man in the tribe wanted to have kids he'd have to go out on a violent trip to grab himself a wife first, the population of those northern clans probably stayed pretty low. Of course that's just me guessing at every Duskwight couple having two or three kids, but also killing two or three from a neighboring clan in the taking of the wife beforehand, which would keep things more or less at equilibrium.

 

So what we end up with is this handful of clans in the Northwest, removed not only from the overland but from massive swaths of the rest of the Duskwight population. In their separate subterranean world, unknown to the rest of Eorzea, they developed an entire culture full of religion, art, political nuance, and this served as the backdrop for generation after generation of great tales that live on in the hymns they sing, but hymns only heard in that same world. Because Linkshells don't work, there is a very definite boundary between this world and that one, and you cannot bring this world with you when you go there. It's a foreign and alien place inside of Eorzea, secluded and secret, but ancient and dynamic.

 

Honestly, I find it beautiful.  

 

So, Oskar! This leaves the question: are you back? Or did you just come by to tell us a story?

[Kari Illderthane]

That was very enlightening thank you Oskar!

 

As your Yssen's statement about Duskwight's having a reaver culture I agree. For Kari's clan supplies were limited and they was at war with their splintered clan small raids were conducted to try and get food and other supplies. It would normally involve two teams one to distract whilst the others found another way and stole what they could carry before scurrying a way back to whence they came. (note they did this to the surface world also, but Kari wasn't so much involved in the raiding side of things)

 

Another thing I forgot to mention was a twist on the Spartan culture where instead of being taken away from their family it was just children who were orphans and these were chosen for the following reasons.

 

1.They did not get that family sort of care so it stopped them getting "soft"

 

2. They did not have as much to lose.

 

3. They would be missed less if something were to happen to them.

 

4. it would give them a chance to get revenge on those who took away from them. (If anything did)

 

I personally feel a lot of the Duskwight culture is about meaning and maybe historical importance (sadly which doesn't get covered by the lore.) Apart from liking it in the dark I don't really see a a reason why one would stay down below ground. Apart from family/friends and traditions which would probably have some kind of meaning towards them. We still need that separation which will define us as a surface world Duskwight Elezen from a Wildwood Elezen, we are both above ground now but what does make its different to them remember we chose to stay behind in the caves.

 

Which then leads to the reason why are more Duskwight coming above ground. In Kari's case it was flee or be captured or most likely be even killed. Now this can relate to the link pearls it would give a Duskwight a chance to talk about their culture without the misunderstanding of the other races, it gives them that second chance to be among their kin. Like Kari others may not be able to get back to their clan lands so having that interaction with one of their own could make the Duskwight feel like they can relate.

 

We also use the link pearls because there is no other way its all we have. Although we could use a Moogle to deliver the message but what is there to stop it from reading then talking to the other races about what we do? We use the link pearls because it is our only choice above the surface world. As travelling all around the world to find someone is not really a valid option.

 

Well those are just my theories behind things Also loving this discussion!

[Eisen]

Wow, really interesting thread. I'm looking at this from the other side of the fence so to speak as I'll be making a WW Elezen. I'm not a racist IRL (just to clarify!) and although I knew that there was a degree of bad blood between the DW and the WW I hadn't really thought about what that meant for day to day role play. 

 

I understand the need to role play in the world as it is and not treat your character as an island on their own. I had planned to be fairly open and accepting of other races in general as Eisen's life was saved by a Hyur when he was younger. Now I'm thinking that it might be an interesting idea to play with the duality of being quite open with other races but with an ingrained dislike of DW Elezen. Anyway, I don't want to side track too much!

 

My worry of playing out the relationship between the DW and the WW would be that it might reflect on me as the player, leaving people with a potentially negative opinion of me if they weren't aware of the lore surrounding the Elezen or viewed it differently. It might also end up in the strange situation where I actively want to role play with DW characters but they don't want to RP with me because of my characters views. So in a way my character gets what he wants but I don't!

[Kari Illderthane]

My worry of playing out the relationship between the DW and the WW would be that it might reflect on me as the player, leaving people with a potentially negative opinion of me if they weren't aware of the lore surrounding the Elezen or viewed it differently. It might also end up in the strange situation where I actively want to role play with DW characters but they don't want to RP with me because of my characters views. So in a way my character gets what he wants but I don't!

 

Just whisper them saying it's what your character is like and not yourself as a person In truth though people shouldn't be taking any insult to characters as personal attacks. But yes a bit ooc communication goes a long way :3