ex primals groups

[Aleister]

Just curious; why would you go into something blindfolded? I'd understand if you were a progression raider/content was just released but its been out for a while now. I can only guess for excitement? The info is there to help make things easier and seem not so scary so why not use it?

 

Before entering a thing I have not done--or committing to entering a thing--I do research.  This was more an illustration of how far removed I am from even being a part of the EX Primal fights.  :3

 

Also, I tend to learn by doing--and, frankly, the inference that "why aren't you using the videos" equates to some sort of baffling disorder is a bit angering to me.

Ah! My apologies for totally misunderstanding that Steel. Pretty much the same here. I only use the video to grasp a sense of things otherwise I learn by doing as well.

[Steel Wolf]

Ah! My apologies for totally misunderstanding that Steel. Pretty much the same here. I only use the video to grasp a sense of things otherwise I learn by doing as well.

 

Awe, no worries. Re-reading my post, it wasn't terribly clear initially so I can appreciate how you'd be confuzzled.

 

LET'S HUG IT OUT!! *hughughug*

[Aleister]

Awe, no worries.  Re-reading my post, it wasn't terribly clear initially so I can appreciate how you'd be confuzzled.

 

LET'S HUG IT OUT!!  *hughughug*

-hughughughughug!-

 

Now in response to the OP and anyone who reads this post. Since you're having difficulty finding a learning run or people willing to help and such without the whole "OMERGAWD KNOW THE DAMN FIGHT, WILL QUEUE IFFY, ILVL90." crap. Should a LS be created dedicated to helping people learn and get primal extreme runs down? Note, Balmung's Finest might be doing this though I have no idea if they are or aren't.

[Kage]

I'd definitely be up for joining! I'd be on the learning side of things though, but I'd be happy to help others when I get it down.

[xelliexell]

My FC mates and I have gotten into the habit of putting things like "punch and pie" and "Free tea and cookies!" in our PF messages. Strangely enough, we one-shotted Titan HM by recruiting this way, haha. 

 

I'd like to see more messages out there like "Let's have a good time and be patient with one another!" in PF, but perhaps the effort must start with us? All of the "experienced players only / know the fight" messages always seemed ineffectual to me, and I've never joined those parties. I mean, other than setting an item level, there's no way you can actually filter people in based on skill level, anyway. 

 

If all the PF messages seem standoffish, I just start my own and play my DS/chatter at my FC while I wait. It usually doesn't take suuuper long. (Or maybe I just play during peak hours? Or maybe I'm just overly used to waiting because my Main is dps. :sleepy: )

[Aleister]

I'd like to see more messages out there like "Let's have a good time and be patient with one another!" in PF, but perhaps the effort must start with us? All of the "experienced players only / know the fight" messages always seemed a ineffectual to me, and I've never joined those parties. I mean, other than setting an item level, there's no way you can actually filter people in based on skill level, anyway. 

 

<.< I do this towards the end of the week but only cause I'm frustrated with the amount of times I've had to run extremes. People who usually leave these kind of messages tell the party straight up if they die a certain amount of times they're being booted, cold method but eh what can you do?

[TheLastCandle]

I'd like to see more messages out there like "Let's have a good time and be patient with one another!" in PF, but perhaps the effort must start with us? All of the "experienced players only / know the fight" messages always seemed a ineffectual to me, and I've never joined those parties. I mean, other than setting an item level, there's no way you can actually filter people in based on skill level, anyway. 

 

<.< I do this towards the end of the week but only cause I'm frustrated with the amount of times I've had to run extremes. People who usually leave these kind of messages tell the party straight up if they die a certain amount of times they're being booted, cold method but eh what can you do?

 

In the immortal words of Bill S. Preston Esq. and Ted Theodore Logan, "Be excellent to each other?"

[Nebbs]

 

In the immortal words of Bill S. Preston Esq. and Ted Theodore Logan, "Be excellent to each other?"

 

Words. to wipe to.

[SunKittyEm]

I'm an i82 Mornk that likes to think she can belt out deeps. I've never -done- the ex primals, but they should be fun, so why not? Besides... I need something from Titan to get BiS anyway.

[Steel Wolf]

In the immortal words of Bill S. Preston Esq. and Ted Theodore Logan, "Be excellent to each other?"

 

This.

 

The problem with the raiding mentality--or at least, the perception of the raider mentality, which is NOT helped by the "know the fight or f*** off" style messaging--is that people don't actually team up as a team. They're tools. Weapons. Things to use and throw away.

 

Lack of empathy, in other words...and it's what stops folks like myself from queuing in to things.

 

Discussions like these, however...these are VERY soothing for anxious folks like myself. :3

[Kage]

I was introducing a friend last night to Ultima HM with another experienced friend (not ex but same mentality). We were doing pretty good but in the second set of Ifrit charge or plumes I forget, my tank friend died either to stacks or something else. We ended up wiping. 2 of the DPS just left. Then the MT. Then both healers. No one said a word. Just one attempt through DF and after 1 wipe just left.

 

I guess it's better than saying, "Oh this isn't farming party? I'll be leaving now." or "1 wipe right before bombs? Know your shit /leave" but it was just...

[Aleister]

 

In the immortal words of Bill S. Preston Esq. and Ted Theodore Logan, "Be excellent to each other?"

 

Words. to wipe to.

Lmfao pretty much. I laughed hard at this no offense to anyone. >.<

 

 

Yeah our community sucks. I kinda wish we were like the Japanese, I hear they use PF for practice and DF for serious raiding (WEIRD RIGHT?!) And they're super super polite and full of manner in both.

[synaesthetic]

In Party Finder, I've killed Ultima HM and Garuda EX more times with a "learning" group than I ever have with one of those "know the fight, three mistakes and you're kicked" groups.

 

The learning groups tend to stick with it, maybe agree to meet up again with the same roster later, and are pretty tolerant of wiping over and over.

 

The serious-business groups tend to perform well at first, but after one wipe expect people to start dropping and/or being kicked. Your roster doesn't stay stable, so any gains you might have made tend to be lost.

[lia yia]

Thanks to the group that was able to it with me today.

 

I seen a pf  today that  said: will rep if you are the first to die twice.

[TheLastCandle]

In Party Finder, I've killed Ultima HM and Garuda EX more times with a "learning" group than I ever have with one of those "know the fight, three mistakes and you're kicked" groups.

 

The learning groups tend to stick with it, maybe agree to meet up again with the same roster later, and are pretty tolerant of wiping over and over.

 

The serious-business groups tend to perform well at first, but after one wipe expect people to start dropping and/or being kicked. Your roster doesn't stay stable, so any gains you might have made tend to be lost.

 

Not surprised in the slightest.

[Oroban]

I still haven't beaten EX Garuda. I tried once shortly after she was added in, died for 90 minutes, and went on to other things. Now I'm sitting at i87, and her ring would make a nice little bit of loveliness. Not to mention an EX primal weapon for an off-class. And yet I still don't even queue. Dunno why!

[KitKat]

I'm always willing to help with the Primals and such. I'm currently i90 WHM, so I can make the booboos go away. 

 

Khyros doesn't like when I take him places because I make him work, though.

 

Send a tell or something to me and I would be glad to jump into a party (open invitation to everyone).

[lia yia]

I wonder if this "must know fight" for ex primals is one of the reasons the gil spam is getting bad, since there might be those buying gil to get merc services.

[Aleister]

I wonder if this "must know fight" for ex primals is one of the reasons the gil spam is getting bad, since there might be those buying gil to get merc services.

I wouldn't blame it on "must know fight" descriptions in PF. If people were buying gil to buy merc runs it would probably be because the fights are really difficult for them or difficult for every group they go in with in my opinion this is especially the case with Titan Extreme since its extremely difficult despite being a fixed fight.

[Aysun]

In the immortal words of Bill S. Preston Esq. and Ted Theodore Logan, "Be excellent to each other?"

 

How I see it time!:

 

You can still be excellent to each other while seeking a win. I put up party finder groups sometimes that say "mistakes happen, but if you make too many we'll have to ask you to leave." And when people make mistakes, they leave, usually apologizing that they did so, and usually without us even having to ask.

 

The thing is it is excessively frustrating to have someone who has only seen the video once, or never actually been through the whole fight, join in with people who have and know it. You have to go through the learning phase with learning parties. The only way to know the fight well enough to win is to practice, which you should do with others who need to practice, not with those who have done that already and know it and would like to farm or get their win for the week. They've been through the learning already after all, and are strangers to you, you can't expect them to spend time wiping when they've already spent time wiping when they were learning.

 

So yea, there are a lot of mean people out there. You can still do learning parties to learn with randoms or with friends, and you can still do win parties requesting experienced/non-laggers without being a jerk about it!

[Therese]

So I've been lurking around this post because this is definitely relevant to what I'm currently trying to do. :3;

 

So I'm an i90 (just got it yesterday, woo to a successful coil run) and like all of you I've been having a HELL of a time getting groups that are willing to put up with *gasp* LEARNING. This was even more especially frustrating as I picked up the content from scratch and I got bludgeoned, landslided, deadly wheeled, and I'm pretty sure a plane hit me once. Even Mr. Happy's guides do not go over the sheer amount of carnage these fights bring to other people. And they are meant to. And that is fine.

 

But what makes it more frustrating and if anything becomes almost as daunting with these fights is dealing with the PEOPLE that run them. I remember when I would used to brag about people being open, honest, and friendly when doing dungeon runs, FATEs and asking questions about progression.

 

Where the heck did all those people go?

 

Now I know and I understand that these things are hard. I know that people just want to get them done. And it does suck when a person is in the process of learning and they make mistakes: with the run that I am on, Titan EX, one failed DPS pretty much makes the entire run unwinnable... never mind a failed healer or tank. Getting caught in groups with people that consistently causes wipes is frustrating and I don't blame people for not wanting to do them.

 

But at the same time these three strikes you're out rule (which I will agree with synaesthetic about this) is really disruptive to the learning process and if anything maintains a group of people that want to succeed ignorant and the ones that know how to fight together in their own little niches. It's this sort of behavior that I find really disgusting and makes me really disappointed in the members that make high-end PvE their thing.

[synaesthetic]

Currently in XIV due to this being the tail-end of the current content, I don't have a whole lot to do outside of myth capping, Twintania (restricted to certain days and people) and Titan EX. My FC is largely focusing on TT as she's the "final boss" of this particular content tier, but I wouldn't mind doing some Titan EX learning runs with people here who might be interested.

 

If there's enough interest we can form a semi-permanent "non-lockout content learning group" to try and get the extreme primals, etc down and dead without interrupting FC Coil stuff.

[Evie]

I'd be interested in joining such a linkshell if anyone is planning on setting it up.

[lia yia]

Now primals might get to be more of a pain with ready check trolling. This is happening in CT.

[Kage]

Ugh I heard about that. As soon as I get home I'm changing the HUD to try and minimize it as much as possible.

 

I'll gladly join an LS. Would... people want to make it?