Gun Control: How deadly are they in Eorzea?

[Telluride]

That's how I'd play it anyways, but to each their own. My character isn't badass enough to dodge a bullet. Or even catch a bullet. Survive a bullet - sure! Unless, you know, mortal wound.

 

Sounsyy would just go into the lore details on how the gun being fired isn't being properly utilized according to the gun-play style mentioned in passing on a minion's flavor text, and then the bullet would just cease to exist.

 

Let's add to the lore quandary:

 

Limit breaks with Firesand weapons. How will that work?

[Warren Castille]

That's how I'd play it anyways, but to each their own. My character isn't badass enough to dodge a bullet. Or even catch a bullet. Survive a bullet - sure! Unless, you know, mortal wound.

 

Sounsyy would just go into the lore details on how the gun being fired isn't being properly utilized according to the gun-play style mentioned in passing on a minion's flavor text, and then the bullet would just cease to exist.

 

Let's add to the lore quandary:

 

Limit breaks with Firesand weapons. How will that work?

 

I think that one's fairly obvious.

[Sounsyy]

That's how I'd play it anyways, but to each their own. My character isn't badass enough to dodge a bullet. Or even catch a bullet. Survive a bullet - sure! Unless, you know, mortal wound.

 

Sounsyy would just go into the lore details on how the gun being fired isn't being properly utilized according to the gun-play style mentioned in passing on a minion's flavor text, and then the bullet would just cease to exist.

 

Let's add to the lore quandary:

 

Limit breaks with Firesand weapons. How will that work?

 

I think that one's fairly obvious.

 

LOL I still think instead of the bunny rabbit if a Ninja botched their ninjitsu they should just automatically Mijin Gakure... but that's just me.

 

/poofs Chacha out of existence using obscure dungeon chat bubble text.

(I joke... but when Tam-Tara HM first came out I wouldn't leave until I had translated all the Eorzean words written in blood on the walls.)

[Telluride]

That's how I'd play it anyways, but to each their own. My character isn't badass enough to dodge a bullet. Or even catch a bullet. Survive a bullet - sure! Unless, you know, mortal wound.

 

Sounsyy would just go into the lore details on how the gun being fired isn't being properly utilized according to the gun-play style mentioned in passing on a minion's flavor text, and then the bullet would just cease to exist.

 

Let's add to the lore quandary:

 

Limit breaks with Firesand weapons. How will that work?

 

I think that one's fairly obvious.

 

Also relevant:

 

[video=youtube]

[Dat Oni]

This is a game where people can kill a giant robot by punching it to death, 

 

FFXIV: the real UFC.

 

And punching appears to be more effective than the bullets the Maelstrom and Yellow Jackets use.

 

nvXSHLPB1aM

 

Merlwyb is a badass up until the giant robot made of steel shows up. Then she can't do fuck all. 

 

Why is this, you ask? Simple. That thing is the boss. YOU have to fight it. So they pull a slight ounce of realism out of their asses and say that flintlock pistols don't work well on heavily armored targets in this universe. Yes, you then proceed to punch it to death, but it works, and suspension of disbelief kicks in, because it's the Boss, and you need to be able to kill it using your current skillset.

 

In other words, this game is realistic when it needs to be. But the same can be said about just about every other game with fantastic settings or elements. Take the FPS genre, for instance. How do you cure a million gunshots that leave you on the verge of death, seeing blood in your vision?

 

STAND BEHIND COVER AND TAKE A FEW BREATHS. Pain, pain, go away, come again another day! Poof, the bullets never happened.

 

Then for some reason your NPC buddy dies to a headshot to cause emotional turmoil. Realistic when it needs to be, just like our game.

[Telluride]

 

In other words, this game is realistic when it needs to be. But the same can be said about just about every other game with fantastic settings or elements. Take the FPS genre, for instance. How do you cure a million gunshots that leave you on the verge of death, seeing blood in your vision?

 

STAND BEHIND COVER AND TAKE A FEW BREATHS. Pain, pain, go away, come again another day! Poof, the bullets never happened.

 

Then for some reason your NPC buddy dies to a headshot to cause emotional turmoil. Realistic when it needs to be, just like our game.

 

Yet another case in point:

 

 

There's no armor like plot armor... until your writer wants cheap heat.

[Melkire]

Take the FPS genre, for instance. How do you cure a million gunshots that leave you on the verge of death, seeing blood in your vision?

 

STAND BEHIND COVER AND TAKE A FEW BREATHS. Pain, pain, go away, come again another day! Poof, the bullets never happened.

 

Oi, oi, to be fair, this is a curse of the modern FPS genre.

 

As a fanatic of the old-school and arena shooters, I can testify to the fact that many a game that does not adhere to CoD's health-regen model are at least somewhat less fantastical, what with medkits and other various health pickups that amounted to bandages and adrenaline and what-not.

[TheLastCandle]

This is why Left 4 Dead/L4D2 remains the greatest modern FPS of all. IMO.

 

I can see it now. Machinist barges in, shoots down everyone, raids the cabinets. "PILLS HERE" comes over /shout.

[Dat Oni]

This is why Left 4 Dead/L4D2 remains the greatest modern FPS of all. IMO.

 

I can see it now. Machinist barges in, shoots down everyone, raids the cabinets. "PILLS HERE" comes over /shout.

 

*Imagines Merri shouting "Grabbin Pills!"*

[Aeylis Bloodbinder]

I'm just wondering how the firearms will be with machinist, because the way it looks, it seems more gadgety then anything.  Which (although OOCly I'm all over that) ICly I wouldn't implement that type of new technology to my character's story...she's more, use a musket like the pirates do.

[Zyrusticae]

Pretty sure there will be bog-standard musket-style looking guns available for Machinist like any other class or job has regular-looking weapons sub-50.

 

You can ignore/handwave the turret and gadget thing as not being IC for your particular character. That's what I'm doing, anyway.

[Kinono]

You can ignore/handwave the turret and gadget thing as not being IC for your particular character. That's what I'm doing, anyway.

 

Yep. There's a big difference, I think, between being able to us/simply owning a gun and being an engineer capable of building a flying turret. I'd be all for meeting a character that does do that, but in my particular case, simply owning/carrying the gun would be all I'd aspire to for now.

[Lost River]

My character Ophelia will be having all the things with Machinist; turret, weird gun and all. Why? Because even before the machinist was announced, she was a Magitek engineer. So, yup. It totes her 10/10.

[K'nahli]

For that matter, we Eorzeans aren't smart enough to figure out how to fight the primals outside of their own tiny little defensive havens. I mean, HOW are these primals destroying everything when they do not come out of their lairs?

 

Level 35-44 Spoiler:

 

 

We only spent the best part of a year solving Ishgardian affairs out, clearing out an entire fort of a dravanian horde(only to be intervened and halted even further by an ascian being a jerk), chasing after three crystals - two of which we were told were the incorrect crystal - only to hear Alphinaud harp on about how Garuda was tearing up the countryside when in reality she wasn't doing anything but hanging out by some rocks, kindly waiting for us to come deal with her instead of causing any real mischief.

 

 

 

[Hiro]

I had a big rant over the firearms technology in an old thread...

 

From the designs I've seen and knowledge of firearms history and technological advancements...

 

Garleans follow the fantasy basis of Magitek, mechanics with fudged workings that are McGuffined simply by saying: Magic does it. It makes it difficult to gauge however I'd place them at: Late Percussion Cap styled weaponry.

 

Personally picturing their weaponry with mechanisms similar to a late era revolver: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Army_Model_1860

 

With the same type of ammunition utilizing some form of advanced paper cartridge (alchemical magitek thing) or an early form of metallic cartridge.

 

The weapons present elsewhere fall between flintlock, percussion, and early "needle" guns, as the bolt action rifles shown are reminiscent of such weaponry, which would also support the theory of Eorzeans have the advancement into Paper Cartridge ammunition though that would be considered high end. Given the whole theme of Machinist and how they look I'd wager they're individuals on the cusp of modern weaponry or engineering their own versions of "magitek" which would effectively the transition into metal cartridge ammunition.

 

Also, a misconception that black powder weaponry isn't comparable to modern firearms in all aspects, in terms of stopping power and accuracy, Percussion Dueling Pistols were accurate for their use and were as powerful as an M1911 Colt, their penetrating power is really up to the type of ammunition used at that point. Just because your armor stops it does not mean your body can handle that sort of impact force. That said, as mentioned above, dodging bullets isn't something any considers practical in reality, it's why armoring over vital points and maintaining cover is a thing rather than standing, dodging, and deflecting. Given how Final Fantasy XIV has handled it... its definitely something up to preference.

 

Having had the luxury of speaking with Koji during Fanfest Vegas for a while I did manage to get that they didn't really consider how Eorzea's, especially Garlean Magitek Technology, really lines up with our (Real Life's) modern history. We more or less chose things that worked with our image rather than trying to force together a chain of technological advancements. It's best to view it as: Garleans developed Magitek to it's point because they can't use magic, everyone else had free reign of magic and as such advancement of these sorts of technology is quite lacking though due to exposure to Garlean magitek and Cid as well as the necessity to counter act or at least understand their core mechanics has pushed advancement forward in a hurry.

[Askier]

Askier had dibs on mechanist before all of you. /stare

 

But now Jin'li gets it cause reasons.

 

But seriously, in the words of my drill instructor "Don't Nuke it."

 

Hehe. Askier. Nuke. Hehe.

 

Seriously though we could debate this endlessly and never get everyone on the same page and that's okay. I've been rping Jin'li and Askier using firearms since the start and I've combat rped with a whole viriety of people who fought that in different ways. Some people say armor strong enough to take a few hits, which is fair. Others say they take cover and others take the bullet and keep going cause a bullet causes a cleaner (relative) hole. 

 

Point is if you want to us it, treat it as any other fight but if they get in close the weapon become basically useless. And I'm sorry, I don't car who you are, even a gun blade, which would massively back heavy and unbalanced for com ate cause of the fireing mechanisms anyway, cannot swing or shoot accuaratly while avoiding attacks. Most fair thing you can do is simply.make your character unskilled in melee or, just use gun as a club cause in melee you don't have time to aim.

 

And if you are worried, do what I do. Limit your ammo. Six shots for my.gun blades and they have to reload and if you have ever reloaded a revolving cylinder, its kinda awkward and slow. And if its a black power fire arm. Ha! Good luck getting the patch, powder ball and ram rod all in before they get close enough to gut you.

 

Certainly.guns our powerful but they have limitations that if you p play correctly can make them.fair. Unless you BS a machine gun. . . And just don't do that.

[Sounsyy]

For that matter, we Eorzeans aren't smart enough to figure out how to fight the primals outside of their own tiny little defensive havens. I mean, HOW are these primals destroying everything when they do not come out of their lairs?

 

Level 35-44 Spoiler:

 

 

We only spent the best part of a year solving Ishgardian affairs out, clearing out an entire fort of a dravanian horde(only to be intervened and halted even further by an ascian being a jerk), chasing after three crystals - two of which we were told were the incorrect crystal - only to hear Alphinaud harp on about how Garuda was tearing up the countryside when in reality she wasn't doing anything but hanging out by some rocks, kindly waiting for us to come deal with her instead of causing any real mischief.

 

 

 

 

Yeah... at least in 1.0 you got to see Primals tearing up shit as opposed to being told they're tearing up shit.

 

 

[Zyrusticae]

OMG IFRIT'S INTRO IS SO BADASS

 

WHY DIDN'T WE GET ANYTHING LIKE THAT IN ARR

 

ARRRRGH

 

*ahem*

 

I don't really blame them too much for it tho, knowing that they had to rush the hell out of development to get the game out the door before too long. They simply didn't have the time to create polished cutscenes like they did for 1.0 (though, unfortunately, the cutscenes ended up being the most polished part of 1.0....).

 

Edit: Read this comment and lol'd:

Not necessarily. I doubt there will be dragoons (jump command, not just spears) mimics, and blue magic. It would be nice, though. By nice I mean the coolest thing that could happen.

2/3 ain't bad, eh?

[Aduu Avagnar]

RE: Muskets

 

The average for the British army during the napoleonic wars at least was 3-4 shots a minute with a brown bess musket. And that was for a trained soldier, recruits were usually as slow as 2. With Rifling (i.e. a baker rifle), it was even slower, a rate of 2 shots a minute being the high end.

[Makyn Loneseeker]

RE: Muskets

 

The average for the British army during the napoleonic wars at least was 3-4 shots a minute with a brown bess musket. And that was for a trained soldier, recruits were usually as slow as 2. With Rifling (i.e. a baker rifle), it was even slower, a rate of 2 shots a minute being the high end.

I agree.

 

With the Baker rifle, it depended on how well the Rifleman shooting it could do. Since a lot of the men using the Baker were Greenjackets and Kings German Legion, and not normal infantry, they could get up to 3 shots a minute, pretty rarely more. 

 

Yeah, though, someone just starting out with a musket could probably take more than a few minutes trying to figure out how to reload it.