Despite the scandal

[ArmachiA]

How the hell does non-consensual ERP happen?

 

Block, report.

 

Done.

 

wtf m8

 

LET ME TELL YOU A STORY. It's not like real ERP but...

 

So Ellion way back in FFXI roleplayed basically the same character, just a little younger and a little more naive. Ellion was pretty new to the Roleplaying scene and wanted to make a good impression, so he roleplayed often and hardly ever left character. He asked a lot of questions about how to rp properly and was really trying to make himself "worthy" in the eyes of the more veteran RPers in the ls.

 

In walks one of my more Veteran RPers - who was playing someone with a split personality. During one of our RP sessions in the warehouse in Bastok, her other personality suddenly decides to take over and jump Ellion, trying to strip him to have sex with him without his consent.

 

The rest of us were about 10 yards away and had no idea this was going on, but Ellion was highly, highly uncomfortable and didn't give her consent. He tried to tell her he wasn't comfortable, but she told him he would have to roll to see if he pushed her off. Thinking this was just what super serious roleplayers did, he rolled and... rolled a 7. She rolled in the high 80's. She starts stripping him of his pants DESPITE his confused protests OOC. It was about the third roll (Not kidding: He rolled three 7s in a row) that someone was finally in range and alerted me to what was going on (I wasn't his girlfriend at the time, just his guild leader) and we put a stop to it.

 

He had no idea he was allowed to say no OOCly. And TO THIS DAY he has a lot of issues about more sexual RP because of it. He said he felt oddly violated.

 

Now-a-days we make fun of it (THe NB has a "NEVER ROLL A 7 OR YOU LOSE YOUR PANTS" rule) but he was really uncomfortable for awhile.

[Khorijin Orben]

The thing is that consensual ERP shouldn't be demonized by a roleplay community uncomfortable to broach the subject. Humans as a race are very sexually driven creatures. It's how we've managed to not die out yet. If you choose write in how your character feels about sex, sexuality, and all the different details that go with it? Your choice. If you choose to not delve into those details about your character? Also your choice. No one should have to feel uncomfortable and it's perfectly fine to go with either routine, and even into the spectrum in between those two options.

 

I have no problem with two consenting adults ERPing. I have no problems with people playing miqo'te dragoons. At the end of the day, it's roleplay. People do what they find to be fun and enjoyable and if you disagree? Don't roleplay with them.

[Hammersmith]

How the hell does non-consensual ERP happen?

 

Block, report.

 

Done.

 

wtf m8

 

 

LET ME TELL YOU A STORY. It's not like real ERP but...

 

So Ellion way back in FFXI roleplayed basically the same character, just a little younger and a little more naive. Ellion was pretty new to the Roleplaying scene and wanted to make a good impression, so he roleplayed often and hardly ever left character. He asked a lot of questions about how to rp properly and was really trying to make himself "worthy" in the eyes of the more veteran RPers in the ls.

 

In walks one of my more Veteran RPers - who was playing someone with a split personality. During one of our RP sessions in the warehouse in Bastok, her other personality suddenly decides to take over and jump Ellion, trying to strip him to have sex with him without his consent.

 

The rest of us were about 10 yards away and had no idea this was going on, but Ellion was highly, highly uncomfortable and didn't give her consent. He tried to tell her he wasn't comfortable, but she told him he would have to roll to see if he pushed her off. Thinking this was just what super serious roleplayers did, he rolled and... rolled a 7. She rolled in the high 80's. She starts stripping him of his pants DESPITE his confused protests OOC. It was about the third roll (Not kidding: He rolled three 7s in a row) that someone was finally in range and alerted me to what was going on (I wasn't his girlfriend at the time, just his guild leader) and we put a stop to it.

 

He had no idea he was allowed to say no OOCly. And TO THIS DAY he has a lot of issues about more sexual RP because of it. He said he felt oddly violated.

 

Now-a-days we make fun of it (THe NB has a "NEVER ROLL A 7 OR YOU LOSE YOUR PANTS" rule) but he was really uncomfortable for awhile.

 

 

 

This is a really good example of pressure applied as a weapon.  And to be sure, in these kinds of communities, you have a LOT of people who have trouble saying no, don't understand how things work, and don't want to ruin what frail social ties they have/don't have the confidence to say no to someone with higher standing.

 

Don't abuse that. Don't Be That Guy/Gal.

[Hyrist]

I think it's clear that most people here are adults who have experienced or heard of the horror stories surrounding ERP.

 

But that inherently does not make ERP bad, and open communication and talks like these are actually very health for the community. 

 

If someone wishes to explore the avenues of Erotic Roleplay, they should not feel shamed to do so, ESPECIALLY if they're new to the field. They need to confident enough to speak up if they feel uncomfortable or pinned, and public shaming of the the practice can make some people clam up about it. And that's the kind of environment in which predators thrive. They will give that avenue a vent and a comfort and then clamp down on it, and twist it to their desires regardless of the consent of the victim.

 

All silence and evasive discussion does is empower those creeps who would take advantage of misinformation, isolation, and the lack of comfortable avenues of communication.

 

The fundamental three Cs of role-playing are just, if not more important in ERP as it is in RP. Consent, Communication, Cooperation. 

 

I'd actually urge people not to feel so awkward about the subject. If it's something two consenting adults wish to do, then that should be ok by everyone. We want to keep that avenue of communication open for if and when such interactions go sour, so that emotional cornering and extortion can be nipped in the bud before it develops into a full on emotionally abusive relationship. Even through online means, it can do terrible things to a persons confidence and psyche.

[Wymsical]

Well, people seem to have covered all the important bases by now. The comfort of you and your roleplay partner really is the most important factor here; I'll write whichever but some people get way too upset with either choice. The guys who get upset when they realize IC romance doesn't mean OOC, the girls who outright stopped writing with my male characters when they figured out I'm not a guy OOC... and the people with either preference scoffing at people on the opposite side. 

 

I think my strangest experience yet was a guild OOC chat where a bunch of female members nearly got me kicked from the guild for admitting I ERP sometimes... and then immediately went back to making incredibly lewd jokes and stories about their male characters.

 

People can be judgmental jerks when it comes to anything regarding sex, no matter what their view is.

[K'nahli]

I have no problem with RP'ers who happen to ERP but I admit that I just get annoyed whenever I see an actual ERP'er; probably largely do to the fact that almost every, single one of them just happen to be miqo'te - and while I know I should just ignore it, I can't help but feel my main's race is just the victim of some debaucherous image and I already despise the stigma that miqo'te are, for whatever reason, often slapped with. Even the terms "Catgirls" and "Catbois" have started grating on my nerves a little lately.

 

I like looking at roleplayers and seeing what their comments are or just to see if anyone is an RP'er in general, though whenever I see a miqo'te in hempen underwear or whatever I just find myself hoping in vain that it's not another one. I've seen SO many in the Quicksand lately and it just throws me for some reason. Especially when you're just there, enjoying the scene in the Quicksand(OOCly in my case) and then you notice there are two people targeting each other next to you and doing... twelve knows what.. 

 

 

I don't know. I guess it's just that I love this game and the sweet and innocent(outside of the story) nature it almost perpetually carries along with it. Seeing people turning it into a porn experience for themselves just turns me off.... especially when there's at least one character out there who doesn't look too, f*cking unlike mine.

 

 

Maybe I'm just being a judgemental prude about this particular topic though. I just hold a few things "sacred" and it annoys me to see people sully it into something else. There's actually a game set to come out in the future that a friend and I intend to play and it's one of the most innocent things imaginable, but due to the fact it allows you to create your own worlds/towns/levels and such, didn't the developers find themselves receiving and answering this question that was listed along with another 20 or so submitted by fans of the upcoming production....

 

"Is it permissible for users to create their own hentai games?"

 

 

I have no fear or dislike for sex but jesus... why must it be brought into absolutely everything by these people?  *headdesks*     

[Edvyn]

 

I have no fear or dislike for sex but jesus... why must it be brought into absolutely everything by these people?  *headdesks*     

people forever seek what they will never have :thumbsup:

[allgivenover]

I have no problem with RP'ers who happen to ERP but I admit that I just get annoyed whenever I see an actual ERP'er; probably largely do to the fact that almost every, single one of them just happen to be miqo'te - and while I know I should just ignore it, I can't help but feel my main's race is just the victim of some debaucherous image and I already despise the stigma that miqo'te are, for whatever reason, often slapped with. Even the terms "Catgirls" and "Catbois" have started grating on my nerves a little lately.

 

The thing is that Miqo'te are by nature promiscuous and portrayed to be so by the game, with many, many Seekers being proud prostitutes or eager to slip in bed with your character. Keepers are more subtle but the lore states clearly that the idea of only having one lover is abhorrent to them. Promiscuity is lore when it comes to Miqo'te.

 

This combined with them being.. well, they're cat-people. Cat girls/boys is one of the most popular kinks around, you're going to get that crowd along with the basic idea of cat-people.

 

Personally, I had Rakka'li get around a LOT in roleplay (to the point of being so sick of it that I wrote a reason for him to be emotionally distraught over the idea of casual sex so that I could avoid it easily), because that's what I firmly believed he'd be inclined to do as a "typical Keeper male" in this mindset, and I can assure you that there's plenty of non-Miqo'te who ERP, plenty.

 

I chose a Keeper male way back when we first got the lore because they were stated to be heavily matriarchal, and sound reasoning lead us to believe that promiscuity would be their tendency (it was a long time before we got proof, but mine, Rakka'sae's, and Myxie's conclusions hit the nail on the head) so I wanted to see what people would do with this very strange, very unusual culture. If not for that combination of assumed promiscuity and matriarchal tendencies I would've been a Duskwight.

 

 

 

Unfortunately, there's only so much weird that 99% of roleplayers can accept. Even those that advertised being traditional keepers that engaged in promiscuity ended up in the majority just slipping back into real life typical sexual mores (or worse, using the culture as a cover for lesbian/futa fetishization). After a year and a half I gave up entirely.

 

So yes, there's plenty of poor ERPs who use Miqo'te as a vehicle for their sexcapades, but there were a few of us who were honestly interested in exploring that weirdness in RP and seeing what others would do with it, or how it would react with others (the answer is they fucking ignored it, spoilers).

 

Seeker sexual mores are a hot button issue around here, but I sometimes wonder if they had better luck exploring that weirdness than I did with Keepers.

[Hyrist]

 

I don't know. I guess it's just that I love this game and the sweet and innocent(outside of the story) nature it almost perpetually carries along with it.

 

Um... 

 

I don't want to burst your bubble ,but 'sweet and innocent' doesn't really translate into my impression of FFXIV.

 

Sexual innuendo and jokes are laden everywhere. Even in its history.

 

 

In 1.0 The Miner's Guild was a brothel, their dancers have moved to the open street in ARR. 

 

Gold Bazaar has two prostitutes propositioning you as you enter into the area from the south. And a poor unfortunate soul who contracted 'crotch rot' from then warns you of them just behind.

 

In Limsa, it is heavily implied in the course of the Arcanist quest line that your companion was repeatedly raped under the conscription of the story's primary antagonist, the trauma of which prevented her from maintaining her composure upon discovering him.

 

On the outside lower rafters of the Drowning Wench, there is a poor unfortunate Roe who's getting mugged by a pair of women threatening to cut his 'wick and toss it to the brine'

 

It is heavily implied that the all-female Crew of the "Missing Member" (I'll let that sink in a moment.) Take Men for their own pleasure and little else.

 

Costa De Sol has a Fate in which you escort a 'Courtesan' to her Client.

 

And I could on, these are the most obvious examples. Only place I've really had difficulty finding such overtones was in Gridania proper, even then, one of the Company of Hero's there admits to the Player Character that he had spent his early days whoring and had a weakness for women.

 

 

 

 

In terms of Final Fantasy games, FFXIV is quite lewd. I really can't agree with the innocence idea of it. Implications of things far darker or more lewed all over the place. If anything I'd call the tone it maintains is idealistic - searching for all the specks of light amidst all the darkness, with the Player character at the forefront.

[Wymsical]

Yeah, XIV is anything but sweet and innocent. The horror of what's going on in Sastasha, the Ala Mhigo storyline in the MSQ, the postmoogle quest about the Keepers, positively ENDLESS comments from NPCs including a reference about the temperature of a... err, deceased prostitute's tender bits and I could go on and on if I spent enough time hunting it down in the world. To say nothing of all non-sexual references to various horrific or grim scenarios that keep appearing throughout the game. It's everywhere.

 

And honestly, I like that they don't keep the art style of the game as a limiter on how lewd or grim they can be. But that's a personal appreciation of mine.

[Darien Cadell]

Not to mention the "Moegramm Had A Little Lamb" quest in Lower La Noscea. I had been all oh, teehee when Momodi was talking about escapades with menfolk or whatever, but then this quest gets all giddy about the constant implications of "attachment" to sheep. Yyyyep. It's right out there in the open. Never experienced that in another MMO, nope. And that has nothing to do with players whatsoever.

 

I had always been of the mind that yes, miqo'te are culturally promiscuous, in different ways across the two clans, yes, but not at all of the monogamy set whatsoever. It wasn't until my miqo'te character's family (that had conflict not unlike the postmoogle quest) imploded that her mindset on that changed. Even then, she wouldn't expect other miqo'te to suddenly have a different culture simply because she's had ample reason to reject her own.

 

But while there are some people who are exploring the culture, other people are going to be shallow or short-sighted and only interested in jubblies. C'est la vie.

[Faye]

And... what was that one NPC's name.... Longhaft? Longshaft? The one with all the lolzy obvious innuendos and his platoon of (all female) soldiers constantly competing for his.... ahem... affections? The NPC's in the Golden Saucer gossiping about Godbert's statue being anatomically correct or Senor Sabotender touching a girl's butt? The "Puff Puff" back in the Dragon Quest event? Even though these examples were all played for laughs, there's no shortage of sexual motifs in this game.

[Dravus]

Mm. The game's pretty mature in that regard. Even WoW, which was rated as suitable for a lower age group has its fair share of suggestive jokes and themes. 

 

As with most things, however, it's all about there being a time and a place for it. Plus I don't think a lot of people realise that innuendo and crude jokes can come off as very creepy when they come from another player rather than a NPC.

 

I have a pretty dirty mind myself so I don't really care if people start spewing all sorts of suggestive stuff but I'll admit there's times when I'm either not in the mood or they just come off as desperate.

[Kellach Woods]

And... what was that one NPC's name.... Longhaft? Longshaft? The one with all the lolzy obvious innuendos and his platoon of (all female) soldiers constantly competing for his.... ahem... affections? The NPC's in the Golden Saucer gossiping about Godbert's statue being anatomically correct or Senor Sabotender touching a girl's butt? The "Puff Puff" back in the Dragon Quest event? Even though these examples were all played for laughs, there's no shortage of sexual motifs in this game.

 

HUNBERCT LONGHAFT and his well-oiled lever.

 

The "Puff-Puff" is DQ tradition at this point and I wouldn't really count it as part of FFXIV. Word for word they reused the same gag as in DQ8 (where it's shown that what's being rubbed in your face isn't exactly breasts) which was fine considering the game's rating but snurbles would certainly feel... hairy.

 

Still, I wholeheartedly agree, be they implied and dark or barely overt and comedic, there's no shortage of it in-game.

[111]

I have no problem with RP'ers who happen to ERP but I admit that I just get annoyed whenever I see an actual ERP'er; probably largely do to the fact that almost every, single one of them just happen to be miqo'te - and while I know I should just ignore it, I can't help but feel my main's race is just the victim of some debaucherous image and I already despise the stigma that miqo'te are, for whatever reason, often slapped with. Even the terms "Catgirls" and "Catbois" have started grating on my nerves a little lately.

 

I like looking at roleplayers and seeing what their comments are or just to see if anyone is an RP'er in general, though whenever I see a miqo'te in hempen underwear or whatever I just find myself hoping in vain that it's not another one. I've seen SO many in the Quicksand lately and it just throws me for some reason. Especially when you're just there, enjoying the scene in the Quicksand(OOCly in my case) and then you notice there are two people targeting each other next to you and doing... twelve knows what.. 

 

 

I don't know. I guess it's just that I love this game and the sweet and innocent(outside of the story) nature it almost perpetually carries along with it. Seeing people turning it into a porn experience for themselves just turns me off.... especially when there's at least one character out there who doesn't look too, f*cking unlike mine.

 

 

Maybe I'm just being a judgemental prude about this particular topic though. I just hold a few things "sacred" and it annoys me to see people sully it into something else. There's actually a game set to come out in the future that a friend and I intend to play and it's one of the most innocent things imaginable, but due to the fact it allows you to create your own worlds/towns/levels and such, didn't the developers find themselves receiving and answering this question that was listed along with another 20 or so submitted by fans of the upcoming production....

 

"Is it permissible for users to create their own hentai games?"

 

 

I have no fear or dislike for sex but jesus... why must it be brought into absolutely everything by these people?  *headdesks*     

 

Idk. I'm a ERPer.

 

It's not obviously all I do, but I have no issues with RPing sex things if that's where an RP goes.

 

Sex is part of life. I don't RP for sexual satisfaction, but I don't like shaming those that do.

 

I think such words tend to drive people into camps, I think someone can RP seriously and also have intimate things be involved.

[ShoggMommy]

And... what was that one NPC's name.... Longhaft? Longshaft? The one with all the lolzy obvious innuendos and his platoon of (all female) soldiers constantly competing for his.... ahem... affections? The NPC's in the Golden Saucer gossiping about Godbert's statue being anatomically correct or Senor Sabotender touching a girl's butt? The "Puff Puff" back in the Dragon Quest event? Even though these examples were all played for laughs, there's no shortage of sexual motifs in this game.

 

There's even that really early quest in Limsa Lominsa where it's so hinted on the NPC farmer is a sheep... Uh... diddler.

[Kyrio Lamansque]

Going back to the OP, since I'm so very late to the party.

 

First, yes, I'm a ERPer.

 

OOC communication is wonderful. At the very first inklings that there might be relationship and/or sexy flings first seem to be better than a fifty-fifty shot. I'm not afraid to break out a whisper to figure out what's up. And if it's going to be a relationship, to set up ground rules. To detail the no-nos and things that are and are not comfortable. 

 

As far as the game goes.. there's sexual content all over the place. From the flirting around the docks of Limsa and Costa.. to the place north of Drybone.. there are a couple of.. uhm.. Ladies of the Night there to greet you first thing, giving you the ole 'come on'.

[Saefinn]

People seem to think ERP is weird and then stigmatized people for it, but even RP itself is stigmatized, there's a number of people that find it odd or weird and even go to extent of trolling RPers, have you tried explaining RP to a normal person? It's an odd experience. So I would expect RPers to be a little more understanding or tolerant of their peers, after all , if we want people to be tolerant and unt derstanding of us, then we should first be able to do it ourselves.

 

ERP comes in many forms and as long as all parties consent, it's their business and nobody else's. I run plot focused RP, so for me any kind of ERP would need to make sense IC, and people's characters in my group do fall in love, so if they sneak away and do the deed, makes perfect sense.

[ArmachiA]

I think the term "ERPer" is used for people who use RP for sexual gratification. If that isn't you, you aren't an ERPer. You're a roleplayers who ERPs.

 

Though, while I'm not against ERP at all, I have to wonder what character growth is coming from ERP that happens rather often. I understand growth from a character's first time with a partner, a character's first time at all, a character who hasn't seen their partner for awhile due to plots, almost dying, or even making up after a huge fight. I've erped, but I've also faded to black when I felt like it would just be another sex scene with no real growth. The characters know how the other would have sex at that point and it isn't very surprising. ERP can also take a loooot longer than regular RP. So, true question, whats the rational for doing it quite frequently?

 

Again, not judging. I really don't care how often you ERP, it's just a question.

[Verad]

I think the term "ERPer" is used for people who use RP for sexual gratification. If that isn't you, you aren't an ERPer. You're a roleplayers who ERPs.

 

Though, while I'm not against ERP at all, I have to wonder what character growth is coming from ERP that happens rather often. I understand growth from a character's first time with a partner, a character's first time at all, a character who hasn't seen their partner for awhile due to plots, almost dying, or even making up after a huge fight. I've erped, but I've also faded to black when I felt like it would just be another sex scene with no real growth. The characters know how the other would have sex at that point and it isn't very surprising. ERP can also take a loooot longer than regular RP. So, true question, whats the rational for doing it quite frequently?

 

Again, not judging. I really don't care how often you ERP, it's just a question.

 

I think this is something of an unspoken double-standard that's applied to ERP, this notion that it's all right when done for character growth. It's not one we apply with any great frequency to clean roleplay, and there are a number of times where players engage in what are frankly mundanities - chatting at the Quicksand, for example - in ways that don't foster character growth. I can tell you that there is a marked absence of character development when I have Verad selling dubious goods at the QS, and in that case the point isn't to foster his own development but just to provide something fun to which other characters can react, nor do I put much stock in whether they experience any significant growth from interacting with him. Further, there are a number of players who attend the Grindstone regularly, but aren't necessarily going through character development because of it. The RP fight in and of itself is the point.

 

So, then, for some the ERP is the point of the ERP. There is pleasure to be gained from it. Some of it is definitely sexual satisfaction. I don't think people should be shamed for that, although perhaps they should be more upfront about that purpose to find other likeminded people and help those who are uncomfortable with it choose to fade-to-black or avoid entirely. But I certainly don't think it's a problem because it doesn't foster character development or anything. RP doesn't in general.

 

Setting that aside, it's possible for an ERP-heavy storyline to address issues of sex and sexuality quite frankly, but I don't think many people are playing for that sake. If somebody's writing Story of O or adapting Nymphomaniac in Eorzea, I don't know of it.

[Tiergan]

^

 

Sometimes ERP is for narrative purposes/character relationships. Sometimes its just someone getting their rocks off. Sometimes it's something in the middle where folks are getting their rocks off while immersed in their character and that character's overall narrative. People engage in it for a lot of different reasons. I don't think anyone should be ashamed of enjoying what they enjoy so long as you're considerate of everyone around you, everyone involved is on the same page, and no one is causing other people discomfort by pressuring or shoving them into unwanted situations.

 

Most of us likely have a story where we've been severely squicked out by people herding us towards RP that we didn't ask for, sending unprompted whispers with unsolicited lewd requests, or straight up just walking in on some folks doing the dirty in public without any regard to anyone nearby. These are all situations where people were not being considerate of others.

 

It's okay to have fun - but a person's right to have fun extends only up until the point you start making other people feel forced into something uncomfortable, harassed, or afraid. Then you're just being a jerk.

[Hammersmith]

 

We know which one is the better choice here, IC and OOCly.