On playing characters with mental illnesses

[Ignacius]

There's a general rule in RP that unfortunately isn't something that's very formulaic.  It goes, "Anything can work, but if it doesn't, knock it off."

 

This applies to just about everything.  I played a character once in WoW who was, to say the least, somewhat mentally imbalanced.  If I had to put a tag to it, it would be paranoid schizophrenia.  He constantly referenced things that weren't there, threats that couldn't possibly exist, and conspiracies that seemed plucked out of novels.  However, the way I played him, it worked.  People enjoyed RPing with me and went along with it, even though I doubt highly it was medically accurate.

 

Also, I have played quite a few sociopaths (people who can't understand human emotion outside their own) in my time.  These are people who, in the bounds of video game logic, aren't strange, but in real life they'd be the scariest things walking the face of the planet.  However, since they work in the game, they work.

 

On the other hand, I did play a recalcitrant recluse of a mage in a free-form thread.  He was blind and very dependent on his brother.  He often came off as afraid and somewhat pathetic on his own, despite his ability, and he was constantly nervous without his brother.  I played that rather convincingly as an anxiety disorder, but it very quickly got irritating.  Not to people who had the disorder (I played the anxiety correctly), but because in the concept of the RP we were doing, it got aggravating for the other players very quickly.

 

I think we sometimes forget that one of the first rules of RP is that if you're going to do something, make it work, and if it isn't working, stop.  The point of RP is to have fun, both the person playing the character and the people playing their own who interact with them.  Very rarely will someone put the brakes on to scold you for your poor portrayal of real-life symptoms if your character is entertaining and fun to play off of. However, they'll definitely do it if you're being an ass in public, even if being an ass in public might be an occasional symptom of a mental disorder your character has.

 

In the end, let's try to keep things in perspective, here.  The first question you have to ask when playing a character isn't "is this offensive" or "is this right" but "does this work."  Remember that we're writing characters here, just like authors.  They have to work first, because no one wants to read something that's medically accurate but has nothing happen.

[Zyrusticae]

Man, you guys are great. I really appreciate the support. I'm... uh, well, I'm still a bit anxious, and kind of had to force myself to even look at the thread, but it certainly lightens the load to read some of these comments.

 

I don't think anyone is meaning to imply you're being disingenuous, I think there's just some confusion because you've tried to push for social anxiety to be labeled "cute," or that it's "not that bad" and just a personality quirk, which is a baffling concept to anyone with a deep and personal understanding of social anxiety. It easily leads someone to believe that you don't have a clear understanding of what social anxiety is, or that the only kind you acknowledge and know of is incredibly mild.

 

The realities of social anxiety are:

 

- Difficulty forming and keeping relationships with other people

- Difficulty leaving the house or running errands (and this includes to do important things, like buy groceries when you have no food, going to a medical appointment, filling the nearly empty gas tank in your car, etc.)

- Difficulty making phone calls (once again for potentially important things, like refilling a prescription that's run out, calling your workplace to tell them you're sick today, etc.)

- Difficulty even leaving your room/getting out of bed if you live with other people

- Difficulty finding and keeping a job, or difficulty attending school and keeping your grades up

- Panic attacks (which feel like you're literally dying)

- Shortness of breath, increased heart rate, sweating, dizziness,

- Acid reflux, stomach pain, nausea, vomiting, digestive problems

- Insomnia, sore muscles, headaches, exhaustion, problems with your teeth from reflux or grinding

- Long term effects of stress like stomach ulcers, skin problems, aging more quickly, weight loss/gain etc.

- Potential to spiral into depression, including self-harm and suicide

- Potential to develop a dependency on drugs or alcohol or other addictions to cope

- Money spent on therapy and medications

- Side effects from those medications, as well as the fact that starting a new antidepressant typically worsens anxiety until your body adjusts

- Potential to get addicted to medications prescribed for your anxiety (i.e. Xanax)

 

Looking at the realities many people with social anxiety face (and that was only to name a few of the more objective/common ones), it can sound absolutely ludicrous to expect people to find it to be a cute and endearing condition, or one that's easy to brush aside or cope with, so I believe some of us are under the impression you don't really understand what social anxiety is and that you've simply made a shy character rather than a character legitimately afflicted with social anxiety.

 

As far as the theory that social anxiety is "a part of your personality," I can promise you, it's not. You know it's not you when it happens. It feels wrong and foreign, probably not much different than how a transgender person knows they were born the wrong sex. You just know it's wrong, it's not you. Plenty of people afflicted with social anxiety are actually outgoing or extroverted, our anxiety just squanders that part of us and it's painful not being able to express who you know you really are.

 

 

I think a large part of it is simply because I tend to use that sort of mindset as a coping mechanism, as trying to grapple with the actual enormity of the problem becomes paralyzing in the exact way that AmarchiA is talking about it. Even now, I'm distracting myself from it all by... posting crap on the internet, heh. But I can see that it isn't exactly the best way to deal with it, and from the perspective of outside observers it certainly looks like I am downplaying the disorder as something mild when it is not such in many cases.

 

I will certainly refrain from doing such in the future, and will defer to actual personality traits wherever possible unless I decide I actually want to make it a point to explore such disorders in RP (something that I will likely only do with folks I can trust to handle it).

 

I should note that I am still profoundly fascinated by heavily "damaged" characters - characters that are so ill or disabled that they are heavily dependent on others for assistance. It hits all of my sympathy buttons. Gives me "feels", so to speak. I know that, in many ways, these characters are tragic, sad, often lonely, and that is a large part of what makes them so appealing to me.

 

But I also understand now that not everyone feels that way about such characters, and furthermore, some things are just too tragic or serious to make light of, especially in our escapism and entertainment. I also probably should not conflate such feelings with anything to do with the word "cute", heh. Sympathetic, maybe. Sad, yes. I think my choice of words may have been really poor to begin with. I hope to improve on that.

 

To add, one of the WORST things about the disorder is constantly worrying about if it will kick in when you do something new or... anything at all. Again, I'm not shy, but if I get invited to a party, or invited to a movie, or an amusement park (Which I LOVE AMUSEMENT PARKS) I have to spend the next few days deciding whether or not I can even go or if my disorder is going to come up and make everything embarrassing and awful. You can't spring something on me that day. "Want to go to a movie in an hour?" is not possible with me, unless your my mom, you have to give me 24 hours notice generally. I hate that because I'm pretty spontaneous, before I had the disorder (It started when I was 25) I would just go do whatever I wanted, no problem.

 

I like traveling. I also know if I travel the first time in a hotel I'll have a panic attack. I went to New York City and Las Vegas last year, both times the first night my brain was telling me to go home even though I WANTED TO BE THERE. Traveling is hard. I have to make sure it's something I really want to do before I decide to go because I know what it means. It means a panic attack.

 

It's beneath the surface all the time. And you worry about it all the time. And it's awful - the disorder becomes being afraid of the disorder. It took me 5-6 years to control it on the level I do now. I went from having 3-4 panic attacks a week to having 1-2 a year. But it is not an easy road and I can slip at any time.

 

And I know that. And it's terrifying.

 

Wow, I had no idea it could kick in that late in someone's life. That sounds incredibly rough. I can scarcely imagine what it's like to be relatively normal one day and suddenly be experiencing crippling anxiety the next.

 

You have all of my sympathy. It's good that you're improving, and I'm certainly hoping to improve myself, such that maybe I'll finally, one day, be able to buckle up and find work that wasn't granted to me by sheer nepotism. I hope you can get over those humps as well. It's damn rough out there even without the disorder holding you back.

 

[ShoggMommy]

As the family member of a paranoid-schizophrenic with bipolar, the existence of that video disgusts me on a level I'm not sure I can put into words.

 

I want to contribute to this thread, as I have experience roleplaying mentally ill characters and would like to share it, but it's going to take me a bit to get over the anger that video has caused. ;

 

 

I'm sorry Nanut, it's one reason why I didn't post it. It made me angry so I know it would upset others

 

Allgivenover: Yep it was about that site that you mentioned. That's why I didn't go into much details.

[ShoggMommy]

On another note, I keep seeing people emphasizing shyness =/= social anxiety disorder. I'm sure folks are just trying to make sure people are on the same page on this, but I keep getting this implication that people feel I am being disingenuous on my claims of possessing such a disorder.

 

I don't think anyone is meaning to imply you're being disingenuous, I think there's just some confusion because you've tried to push for social anxiety to be labeled "cute," or that it's "not that bad" and just a personality quirk, which is a baffling concept to anyone with a deep and personal understanding of social anxiety. It easily leads someone to believe that you don't have a clear understanding of what social anxiety is, or that the only kind you acknowledge and know of is incredibly mild.

 

Zyru, I'm sorry if my post seemed to imply that you are disingenuous, I don't think you are. It's more of frustrations that I see ingame or on another site that will remain unnamed. It's very frustrating.

 

Faye and ArmachiA: Those things are scary. Anxiety can make you feel so helpless and it sucks. It isn't 'you', as you say it's very hard to describe and hard to deal with. Thank you for both posting the info you have.

[ArmachiA]

Wow, I had no idea it could kick in that late in someone's life. That sounds incredibly rough. I can scarcely imagine what it's like to be relatively normal one day and suddenly be experiencing crippling anxiety the next.

 

You have all of my sympathy. It's good that you're improving, and I'm certainly hoping to improve myself, such that maybe I'll finally, one day, be able to buckle up and find work that wasn't granted to me by sheer nepotism. I hope you can get over those humps as well. It's damn rough out there even without the disorder holding you back.

 

 

Trust me, it was pretty surprising to me too . My family and friends had no idea what was wrong with me, but from 24-25 I slowly went from no anxiety at all to panic ridden all the time. When I went to see a psychiatrist he wasn't THAT surprised and knew what it was immediately. I have other mental illnesses as well, so that's probably why it wasn't surprising to him. Panic disorder was never one of them till later in life.

 

However, I consider it a blessing. I know what it's like before panic disorder, so I can kind of try to work my way back there. I feel really bad for people who have had it since they were young and have a harder time at what kind of normalcy they're fighting for.

[Nako Vesh]

T'rahnu, I'm sorry you've lost sleep over the topic. It might help to keep things in perspective: that this is just a thread that holds many different subjective opinions, but isn't necessarily one of scientific fact. At the end of the day, one person's opinions aren't any more or less valuable than your own, because... opinions aren't facts, unless we want to start throwing empirically reviewed postgraduate research up in here.

 

What? But there's piles upon piles of scientific data surrounding mental illness. People have stated facts numerous times in this thread that have been gathered through scientific means. But I agree that there are a lot of opinions here, too. Opinions are not sacred, no matter what modern culture might lead us to believe. Opinions are pretty worthless, and that includes my own.

 

---

 

To address the rest of the thread: I had to back out of it last night so I could remain a big girl about it. Then when I was able to get to my computer the next day and saw mention of "moe culture," I about flipped my desk over. People have taken advantage of me over the years due to my illnesses, because of my timidness, passivity, and inability defend myself, so the language and demeanor used in this thread hit too close to home. Pushing the idea that someone's illness could be attractive, absolutely disgusted me because of this. But now it seems some learning has finally started happening in this thread.

 

Zyrusticae, I never meant to imply you didn't have mental illnesses of your own. That's the last thing I would want to do to a suffering person. Like others have said, I was absolutely baffled that while confessing mental illness of your own, you seemed to be so insensitive to them. I was trying to portray that your perceived positive light on social anxiety was actually something negative swathed in fuzzy cultural tropes. You seem to have learned now, and that's good.

[Maril]

If you took someone like me and put me in Eorzea, I'd (probably) be dead tomorrow. I have a version of autism with sensory issues (Neurological stuff), which has spawned panic disorder (Early onset, really severe) and periodic stress & depression. I've been through intensive theraphy (living right next to a facility) for five years to get where I am and whilst I am now not plagued by moodswings and my panic attacks have dropped from 3-4/week to 1-2 per 3-4 months, it's still pretty bad and it's fucking up every part of my life on a regular basis. It's not cute or quirky. (Note, not trying to woe-is-me, I just want to illustrate how severe stuff like this can be.)

I would not ever like to see anyone try to look at is as a cute little character quirk, or something that can resolved in two weeks of plot. There's also a fair share of times where it seems like something people can turn on/off for their characters whenever convenient. If your character would survive in Eorzea with a mental illness (I'm not saying impossible, but there's a lot more violence and things that wants to eat you. Being disturbed mentally would no doubt screw with your ability to survive) then it would compromise a lot of the good experiences as well. If you rp as a character that has panic disorder, that means enrolling a panic attack when it's not relevant or convinient, like at a regular bar night or maybe when your character is having the time of their life. Stuff like this always looms in the background.

 

People can do what they want with their characters, but romanticizing and making these things seem like something you shouldn't take serious you may end harming someone that suffers from this irl. My own sister refers to my autism as "Assburgers", something she's learnt off popculture and the internet - where rude/intolerable behavior is justified with aspergers syndrome. That's not fun for me. I don't strive to be a rude person irl, but sometimes I end up saying things with no filter. I don't think about it until I see peoples reactions, and there's absolutely nothing fun about it. I also did not mean to have a panic attack in that bus on the way home, leading to me passing out and an ambulance getting called - but it did.

So do your homework really thoroughly and think it through before you make it a thing.

 

Smaller bursts of mental disruption, like in response to tragic events, can be much more workable and easier to manage - and get over with the RP. Nailah's went paranoid/scaredypantsy for a brief amount of time following three attempts on her life, leading to her putting up traps inside Kindred's house that'd go off if there were any nightly invaders (fortunately no one else was caught in them either!) and she voluntarily walked about with a bodyguard for a while.

[Ritual]

Mental illness: A condition that seriously affects your behaviour, thoughts and way of life, examples include anxiety disorders, depression, aspergers. 

 

Playing one of these can come of as cute, but in reality it's quite the opposite, they are serious issues people need help with. Personality quirks and disorders however aren't considered mental illnessess, if anyone wishes to play a character with any kind of disorder you must read up on it, a lot of issues are completely misunderstood in society. Schizophrenia is still seen by some as having multiple personalities which isn't the case at all, I play a character with SPD (Schizoid Personality Disorder) and another person resembling someone with ASPD (Anti-Social Personality Disorder) and I've done quite a bit of research on the two disorders before I even really made the characters. 

 

I wouldn't go around saying "I have Social anxiety." when all I get from your character is shy Introvert, it's quite a bit more than that, I'm not pointing at anyone it's just an example, but I do hope if anyone decides to RP someone with any disorder, mental or physical, please research a lot about the disorder, if you decide to go with it don't pick and choose certain symptoms, don't go with ASPD and make them just a manipulative, lying, womanizer but feel guilty for things have all the emotions under the sun and all round a nice guy, that's two VERY different things and can come of as offensive to some of the more sensitive people out there. Just my thoughts on the subject.

 

Also does Eorzea even have any classifications for disorders? It seems unlikely to me that they have psychiatrists etc, so it would seem strange if someone confided in me that they were schizophrenic when that term probably doesn't exist in this universe though I'm unsure.

[Zyrusticae]

If you took someone like me and put me in Eorzea, I'd (probably) be dead tomorrow. I have a version of autism with sensory issues (Neurological stuff), which has spawned panic disorder (Early onset, really severe) and periodic stress & depression. I've been through intensive theraphy (living right next to a facility) for five years to get where I am and whilst I am now not plagued by moodswings and my panic attacks have dropped from 3-4/week to 1-2 per 3-4 months, it's still pretty bad and it's fucking up every part of my life on a regular basis. It's not cute or quirky. (Note, not trying to woe-is-me, I just want to illustrate how severe stuff like this can be.)

I would not ever like to see anyone try to look at is as a cute little character quirk, or something that can resolved in two weeks of plot. There's also a fair share of times where it seems like something people can turn on/off for their characters whenever convenient. If your character would survive in Eorzea with a mental illness (I'm not saying impossible, but there's a lot more violence and things that wants to eat you. Being disturbed mentally would no doubt screw with your ability to survive) then it would compromise a lot of the good experiences as well. If you rp as a character that has panic disorder, that means enrolling a panic attack when it's not relevant or convinient, like at a regular bar night or maybe when your character is having the time of their life. Stuff like this always looms in the background.

 

I feel like this is a really important point. Realistically, in a universe like Eorzea, how well would someone with a crippling mental disability be able to survive in such a world? Someone who is a particularly disabled individual would absolutely require assistance from others just to survive, unless they were just that good at compensating in other ways.

 

I mean, I could see someone with severe SAD living a life as a hermit if they had the survival skills to manage on their own. But if they lived in a city like Ul'dah, life would be quite difficult, especially with how crowded it can be in the city. And, indeed, it's not something that just 'goes away' or gets 'cured', even with modern medicine and science (though, to be fair, we don't know exactly how much is possible with aether and magic, I would argue that, if such a thing were possible, we'd have seen examples of it already), and it's never just conveniently on or off.

 

Still, a lot of this does depend on the severity whatever it is they're dealing with, and indeed, a number of individuals would be able to survive merely as dependents of other, less disabled individuals. All the same, a lot of folks would certainly be struggling, and many more would probably be dying off, likely before they could even bear children. Eorzea's a rough place to live even for those of perfectly sound minds and bodies, after all.

 

Also does Eorzea even have any classifications for disorders? It seems unlikely to me that they have psychiatrists etc, so it would seem strange if someone confided in me that they were schizophrenic when that term probably doesn't exist in this universe though I'm unsure.

 

Well, most likely psychology is not really a field that exists in Eorzea as of yet. I certainly would never have a character use such terms ICly, especially as a number of terms are named after the people who discovered them, and as such would make absolutely no sense in a fictional universe unless there was some kind of absurd cosmic coincidence. On the other hand, if such equivalents existed and psychology was an active field in Eorzea, it's not as if they'd write out lore describing what Eorzean equivalents of RL psychiatric diagnoses would actually be. I guess it'd be in the hands of the community at that point. I mean, if it existed. Which it doesn't. Heh.

[Erik Mynhier]

Played well its no more/lease insulting then playing someone with "aether cancer/sickness" or blind, or what have you.

[Sailor July]

I don't see how playing a character with a mental illness / illness / handicap is insulting? Unless it's done in a gimmicky way to poke fun or the player isn't showing what it's really like. I have had a few blind characters, and I don't believe anyone has ever been offended in other MMOs, though I think the FFXIV community is a bit more strict. I've also played characters with mental illnesses, as well and the same applies.

Role-playing is an art. You're a writer. Playing a character. There have been TV series', movies and books that have these kinds of characters but (again - unless it's gimmicky or stereotypical / completely misinformed) and rarely do you hear about people getting all offended.

[Kellach Woods]

Hell, I LARPed a disfigured mute purely for munchkin cheesing and it was the most fun and one of the best characters I ever played.

 

Y'know why nobody complained? 'cause there wasn't a goddamn mute/disfigured person in the entire vicinity of the game. Damn sure they would have, and they'd be within their rights to do so, if they were.

 

I'm still learning about my own personality disorder, and at best you'll hear me snark about how not all obsessive disorders are compulsive ya dinguses.

 

And nobody knows jack shit about hyper-vigilant narcissism so yeah.

 

Someone would portray those like they're making fun of those? You damn right I would be complaining. Media gets personality disorders wrong so often that a lot of us are numb to it. You don't hear about people being offended because most people who would be don't exactly have a channel to actually get their thoughts out in public. At best it's limited to personal blogs who, let's be real here, won't matter none.

[Saefinn]

Playing the characters is by no means insulting, just how you play them. Just find it's a good policy to know your subject matter before tackling it. Else you could end up completely getting the wrong end of the stick, come off as patronising, insulting or just find you are misrepresenting something in general. I think when it comes to mental illness, it's easy to get wrong because there's a lot of misrepresentation and stigma and without first doing a some research (be it personal experience or looking it up), you run into the risk of doing it.

 

But to go to the analogy of TV writers, generally good writers will know their subject, though arguably, they don't always. *cough* *cough* CSI.

 

However, I am reminded of this sketch.

 

[video=youtube]

 

Of course, research is the safest way of getting things right. You'll of course play the way you choose, I of course would ask that you do not misrepresent things too grossly, chances are, if what you're doing is bothering me, I'll RP my way out or politely telling you. I don't bother about pissing and moaning, ain't my style.

[Naunet]

As the family member of a paranoid-schizophrenic with bipolar, the existence of that video disgusts me on a level I'm not sure I can put into words.

 

I want to contribute to this thread, as I have experience roleplaying mentally ill characters and would like to share it, but it's going to take me a bit to get over the anger that video has caused. ;

 

 

I'm sorry Nanut, it's one reason why I didn't post it. It made me angry so I know it would upset others

 

It's alright. I think I'm better now. It's an extremely personal and traumatic topic for me, probably to the point where I don't think I could actually RP with someone who was RPing a character with that particular illness. There's just too much hurt there. >_<

 

Regarding mental illness in general, I will agree with what appears to be the general consensus - that it crosses the line into insulting only when it is portrayed in an ignorant way, when it's just played for laughs, when it OOCly demeans real sufferers of these illnesses. But if you approach it from a respectful angle with the full intent of portraying it as honestly as possible, then I don't really have any issue; the same could be said for pretty much any theme in roleplay.

 

As for my personal experience roleplaying with such topics, it's not something I've gone out of my way to portray, but sometimes things just happen with a character. One of my TERA characters suffers from fully activated PTSD and situational depression that could develop into major, following a series of extremely traumatic events over the course of a year. I don't go around stating explicitly that these are things my character is dealing with, but they come out in how I roleplay her. I did my research - and pulled from my personal experiences - to develop what I hope is not just an accurate but honest portrayal of these issues. The other side is, they're not the core of my character. She doesn't exist purely as a vehicle for PTSD and depression; they are facets that developed but are like an overlay, or fractures in her psyche. 

 

I think that's another important thing to keep in mind when dipping one's toes into these topics in roleplay - don't let them define your character. People in real life aren't defined by their problems, and neither should that be so for your roleplay character.

[Shofie]

I think if you're going to do this, try to be respectful about it and definitely do a lot of research beforehand. 

 

I'm also not a fan of people who decide to rp a disability only to more or less completely ignore that they have said disability, but this is down to a case-by-case sort of basis. Again, there's a right and a wrong way to handle it, or more accurately, a respectful and disrespectful way to handle it.

[Dravus]

I assume that when people claim to be 'offended' it's less about kicking and screaming about injustices and more about letting out a sigh and shaking their head as yet another role-player decides to embrace the common tropes surrounding a particular physical or mental disability instead of actually taking the time to do some research and approach it with dignity.

 

This applies to things like sexuality as well. I always cringe when it's implied that if a character is bisexual then they want to sleep with anyone or anything. That's...not how it works. Nor is it a 'phase' or 'fake sexuality'.

 

I feel that if it's obvious that someone isn't doing sufficient research when embracing something with the potential to be controversial then they shouldn't really complain if and when someone else takes an issue with it. Provided the feedback remains constructive I see no issue with such an approach.