ULDAH MSQ - If you RP in Ul'dah you should finish MSQ

[Kage]

So um... yeah

 

Spoilers.

 

If you RP lots in ul'dah, I dare say you should really look into finishing the Main story quests as soon as you can. @_@

[Roen]

So um... yeah

 

Spoilers.

 

If you RP lots in ul'dah, I dare say you should really look into finishing the Main story quests as soon as you can. @_@

 

GAAAAAAH.

 

I need to go home and see this story happen...!!!

 

(no spoilers please, I don't know what it is yet)

 

(but I was teased earlier)

[Roswyn]

.........

 

Hmmmm.....

 

*scared*

 

:cactuar:

[Marisa]

If you RP in Ishgard you should finish the MSQ. 

 

*loregasm*

 

I love how it involves investigating heretics, because it's the one MSQ plot that Ryoko might actually be involved in.

[Seriphyn]

LONG LIVE UL'DAH!

 

Seriously though, good day to be Ul'dahn.

[Nero]

It's unfortunate that Nanamo ul Namo's plans are private, so from an RP aspect there's actually not much to go on unless a PC contrives a "oh they had a spy with an ear pressed against her door really tightly" which would be an incredible asspull. If it were public knowledge then as an RP element it would have completely flipped the tables in a few storylines, my own being one of them.

[Siha]

It's unfortunate that Nanamo ul Namo's plans are private, so from an RP aspect there's actually not much to go on unless a PC contrives a "oh they had a spy with an ear pressed against her door really tightly" which would be an incredible asspull. If it were public knowledge then as an RP element it would have completely flipped the tables in a few storylines, my own being one of them.

 

 

^ That. Just all of that.

 

 

 

No one should ICly know about this, I mean it was pretty much just between the three leaders present and if someone asspulls it's going to be...meeeeeh in my books.

 

[Coatleque]

 

 

I don't know what you are talking about yet because I haven't gotten there. But once again I ask, where were her Sultansworn in all of this? It seems like they are non-existent after you finish the Ul'dah MSQ path. I am not complaining here, mind you. It just sounds very odd.

 

 

[Delilah Scythewood]

...Dragon fucker. I'm still getting over the immature little giggles.

[Roswyn]

MUST....NOT CLICK.....SPOILERS TAGS...

 

HNNNNGGGHHHH

[Delilah Scythewood]

MUST....NOT CLICK.....SPOILERS TAGS...

 

HNNNNGGGHHHH

DONT DO IT

[LiveVoltage]

I am actually kinda happy the Sultana is about to relinquish her right to being a monarch in order to establish a democracy and abolish the merchant overlord class. I know that I OOCly and ICly despised them with every ounce of my being so if it ever comes down to where the merchant lord's refuse to relinquish their power because they are greedy monetarists even when the sultana gives hers up to create a democracy, I can guarantee ill be hunting some merchant lords because of it three months or so from now.     ._.

 

On a side note. I am actually kinda happy they did something with Ishgard. We got alot of important and juicy lore pieces from the developers. This of course though means that my original theory of the big baddy for the 3.0 series wont be Nidhogg but may be the lake Dragon, for the life of me whose name I cannot remember, died fighting Garleans and caused the world Aether to explode or something. Theoretically, this means we may also have to contend with two foes for 3.0, Nidhogg and that Demigod lake dragon.

 

We could also near the end of 3.0 seeing the resurgence of Garlean efforts to conquer Eorzea so theoretically 4.0 and forward will probably be seeing alot of fighting against the Garleans. Thats only if the current emperor solidified his seat of power within the empire by then.

 

On a separate note though, I wasn't all that surprised that the Merchant Lords were conspiring with the Garleans. They probably had a backdoor deal going on where when Eorzea was conquered, the merchant lords would probably be made regional lord's over Eorzea.

 

Thats not the only reason it didn't surprise me. By the time we got this to be confirmed story cannon this update, the developers had already painted this picture of them being extremely, self-centered, selfish, petty and very greedy tyrants so it made sense they would side with Garlemald because of their advanced technology and far larger numbers in their army's.

 

I dont think all the merchant lords are evil or support the Garleans. I would like to make an example that the Rahuban (or what the muscle heads name is) formed a military based on solely protecting Ul'dah from her enemy's. Likewise, there was the other Lalafell merchant lord, for the life of me his name escapes but he isn't lolorito but he was mentioned in 2.2 or 2.3, also didnt show extreme signs of being corrupt or greedy like most of the merchant overlords, so I see a pattern of Good (Rahubahn) Neutral (Lalafell merchent overlord I cant remember) and Evil (lolorito) but most tend to fall in the Neutral or Evil zone.

 

[Coatleque]

 

Again, I haven't gotten that far, but I have a strong feeling this will not actually happen even though it was left as a cliffhanger. And here is why:

 

 

 

If the Sultana abolishes her own power and dissolves the monarchy, the Sultansworn Order has no reason to exist. They will have to re-write the entire Paladin questline from that perspective. For my part I will hold out hope that Papashan and Raubahn are working in the background to cause a major power shift.

 

Democracy would be the -worst- possible choice for Ul'dah at this moment, considering the government is already corrupt. It will basically become another Ala'Mhigo where the Garleans just walk right in with barely a struggle.

 

 

[LiveVoltage]

 

Again, I haven't gotten that far, but I have a strong feeling this will not actually happen even though it was left as a cliffhanger.  And here is why:

 

 

 

If the Sultana abolishes her own power and dissolves the monarchy, the Sultansworn Order has no reason to exist.  They will have to re-write the entire Paladin questline from that perspective.  For my part I will hold out hope that Papashan and Raubahn are working in the background to cause a major power shift.

 

Democracy would be the -worst- possible choice for Ul'dah at this moment, considering the government is already corrupt.  It will basically become another Ala'Mhigo where the Garleans just walk right in with barely a struggle.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats not the reason why the Ala'mhigans lost to the Garleans. They lost because they suffered an internal rebellion, in which the Garlean's took advantage of and conquered them while they were fighting amongst each other.

 

If I recall it correctly, Ala'mhigo was a monarchy ruled by the Noble classes.

 

If they make a Democracy, it would only serve to probably change the current system and solidify the unity of the masses, because money will no longer rule the voice of the people but publicly elected and represented individuals who when they put into power, will help right the wrongs the merchant class has inflicted on the lower class of society. Really, the fall of Ala'mhigo is fresh on their mind's still, so they aren't or wont re-create the same scenario of what happened then, especially with Primal's, Garleans and everything in between lurking about.

 

On the other hand, it COULD happen again of what happened in Ala'mhigo and we could see the political landscape of Eorzea change considerably. But bad ending's arent really SE's thing... i think?

 

[Erik Mynhier]

 

 

I don't know what you are talking about yet because I haven't gotten there. But once again I ask, where were her Sultansworn in all of this? It seems like they are non-existent after you finish the Ul'dah MSQ path. I am not complaining here, mind you. It just sounds very odd.

 

 

 

 

In the unemployment line. T_T

 

[Coatleque]

If they make a Democracy, it would only serve to probably change the current system and solidify the unity of the masses, because money will no longer rule the voice of the people but publicly elected and represented individuals who when they put into power, will help right the wrongs the merchant class has inflicted on the lower class of society.

 

 

 

 

You are assuming the 'merchant class' will go quietly into the sunset and let your view of Democracy take over.

 

What more than likely will happen is there will be no Democracy. The state will still be ruled by a governing Syndicate of merchants, but with no royalist opposition. Not true Democracy, but a Republic.

 

Either way, I still don't think it will happen. Eorzea is too primitive for it to work. With such a threat as the Empire on their boarders, strong central leadership is required to make split decisions and Democracy is the slowest and weakest form of government out there.

 

 

[Seriphyn]

Er, the merchantclass are not just going to evaporate because the Syndicate gets dissolved and a republic is formed (incidentally, interesting to note that Eorzeans have a concept of a 'republic' to begin with). If they form some parliament, senate, or a more creative name, it will most definitely be split between representatives of merchants and representatives of the commoners. Ul'dahn intrigue will continue. The Brass Blades, by virtue of the fact they've been around for years and years, will continue to be the police of Ul'dah. The Immortal Flames will remain as the Grand Company and answer to whatever parliament is formed. The Sultansworn either get dissolved (doubtful), remain as some elite force and retaining the name for historical purposes or...

 

 

 

TheSyndicate/Adeledji pull off a treasonous act that permits the Sultana to dissolve the Syndicate without backlash, and still goes ahead with creating democracy anyway with her as a constitutional monarch. That would go against her own words about stepping down completely (or rather, just not designating a successor), but nothing goes according to plan in the FFXIV universe. As such, the Sultansworn stick around for the "last Sultana of Ul'dah", which might as well be for the rest of our RL lives.

 

 

 

Square Enix areexcellent writers, and Ul'dah becoming a republic will not come without instability and intrigue. Ul'dah will continue to be a merchant nation with questionable elements. If anything, democracy might just exacerbate it. Also I agree with Coat that a universal democracy may be a bit anachronistic for Eorzea's level of politico-social development. It will not match the Sultana's pure vision.

 

 

 

 

Interesting to notethat FFXIV's Middle Eastern/Ottoman flavoured state is the one pioneering democracy and "Anyone can become anyone"   

 

[Erik Mynhier]

.... Yes Your Grace.... because nothing stops the poorest from being exploited by the rich like a republic-style democracy..... /sarcasm

[Delilah Scythewood]

 

.... Yes Your Grace.... because nothing stops the poorest from being exploited by the rich like a republic-style democracy..... /sarcasm

 

 

 Yup. All of ^^^^^ right here.

[Aldotsk]

Someone summarize for me? Because I am really far behind the story anyways so I'd appreciate it if someone spoiler tag or PM what the discussion was about .

[Sounsyy]

 

.... Yes Your Grace.... because nothing stops the poorest from being exploited by the rich like a republic-style democracy..... /sarcasm

 

 

 

 

This, exactly.

 

Even if the Sultana abolishes the Syndicate and the Crown, she effectively points the gun at herself and removes the Syndicate's only check/balance. She strips herself of all of her power but the Syndicate will remain strong, not because they're the Syndicate, but because of why they're on the Syndicate. The Syndicate members are tycoons of business, infrastructure, military, and politics. You may strip the Syndicate of their official ruling power, but they are still the leaders of their sectors and businesses.

 

Lolorito controls Ul'dah's trade. Teledji Adeledji owns the Brass Blades, Ul'dah's police. Dewlala is Ul'dah's foremost religious leader. Fyrgeiss (who seems like a pretty nice guy honestly) and the Amajina & Sons Mineral Concern has monopolized the mining of all raw resources including Ceruleum production. Hildibrand Sr will still go around suplexing anyone he wants!

 

Unless you remove each of the Syndicate members from being the heads of their respective money pits, the Sultana has done nothing to remove their influence/control on Ul'dah.

 

 

 

 

 

I don't know what you are talking about yet because I haven't gotten there. But once again I ask, where were her Sultansworn in all of this?

 

 

 

 

Honestly... if I was the Sultana, I wouldn't have any Sultansworn in my private chambers either. Especially after EXTRA SPOILERY turns out to be a MUCH SPOILER 4 SPOILER TAG starts with an 'S' and ends with a 'pie' sound. Nothing is safe! Nothing is sacred!

 

[Verad]

 

This, exactly.

 

Even if the Sultana abolishes the Syndicate and the Crown, she effectively points the gun at herself and removes the Syndicate's only check/balance. She strips herself of all of her power but the Syndicate will remain strong, not because they're the Syndicate, but because of why they're on the Syndicate. The Syndicate members are tycoons of business, infrastructure, military, and politics. You may strip the Syndicate of their official ruling power, but they are still the leaders of their sectors and businesses.

 

Lolorito controls Ul'dah's trade. Teledji Adeledji owns the Brass Blades, Ul'dah's police. Dewlala is Ul'dah's foremost religious leader. Fyrgeiss (who seems like a pretty nice guy honestly) and the Amajina & Sons Mineral Concern has monopolized the mining of all raw resources including Ceruleum production. Hildibrand Sr will still go around suplexing anyone he wants!

 

Unless you remove each of the Syndicate members from being the heads of their respective money pits, the Sultana has done nothing to remove their influence/control on Ul'dah.

 

 

 

 

There is of course the unlikely possibility that she has the foresight to either nationalize their businesses and redistribute their wealth or at least break apart the monopolies that give them their influence before removing their legal authority. Dare to dream.

 

[Aya]

 

This, exactly.

 

Even if the Sultana abolishes the Syndicate and the Crown, she effectively points the gun at herself and removes the Syndicate's only check/balance. She strips herself of all of her power but the Syndicate will remain strong, not because they're the Syndicate, but because of why they're on the Syndicate. The Syndicate members are tycoons of business, infrastructure, military, and politics. You may strip the Syndicate of their official ruling power, but they are still the leaders of their sectors and businesses.

 

Lolorito controls Ul'dah's trade. Teledji Adeledji owns the Brass Blades, Ul'dah's police. Dewlala is Ul'dah's foremost religious leader. Fyrgeiss (who seems like a pretty nice guy honestly) and the Amajina & Sons Mineral Concern has monopolized the mining of all raw resources including Ceruleum production. Hildibrand Sr will still go around suplexing anyone he wants!

 

Unless you remove each of the Syndicate members from being the heads of their respective money pits, the Sultana has done nothing to remove their influence/control on Ul'dah.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is of course the unlikely possibility that she has the foresight to either nationalize their businesses and redistribute their wealth or at least break apart the monopolies that give them their influence before removing their legal authority. Dare to dream.

 

 

 

 

 

This actually assumes that she has the political and military clout to win the civil war that would result from an attempt to seize Syndicate property (and given her apparent intention to step away from power, while the Syndicate has no such intention, it is not difficult to see who the winner of that civil war would be).  Its hard to see any result of her abdicating other than Syndicate control of Ul'dah.

 

[ProvaDiServo]

Someone summarize for me? Because I am really far behind the story anyways so I'd appreciate it if someone spoiler tag or PM what the discussion was about .

 

Wouldn't mind this myself, please!

[Verad]

 

This actually assumes that she has the political and military clout to win the civil war that would result from an attempt to seize Syndicate property (and given her apparent intention to step away from power, while the Syndicate has no such intention, it is not difficult to see who the winner of that civil war would be).  Its hard to see any result of her abdicating other than Syndicate control of Ul'dah.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, and I will gleefully hold onto that assumption until she is shown to lose or the writers are shown to have not thought this through.