Racial RP: How do YOU do it?

[Warren Castille]

Following Lance's advice, I wanted to make a new thread to pursue this conversation.

 

It's not about cleaving to the traditional lore. It's about missing the fact that you're playing a humanoid cat like race.

 

It's more than fine that people had to RP before there was sufficient lore, though the name lore wasn't outright stated, female naming conventions were easy to figure out in 1.0, the name Rakka Kuhn was chosen long before the naming conventions were released, and I arrived at that name after running around the 1.0 world taking notes of the Keeper of the Moon Miqo'te female names and combining those observable patterns with an old tabletop character name. If anyone doubts me on this one, here's the old lodestone link, and a snapshot of the oldest achievement, long before the naming conventions were released:

 

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com/rc/character/top?cicuid=12277162

 

 

 

But names are not even what I'm talking about and in fact many of my favorite Miqo'te RPers have characters that are non-traditional with non-traditional names. Even though there is not a single Miqo'te NPC that doesn't have a traditional name in some form I couldn't possibly hold it against 1.0 players like myself for getting attached to a name and not wanting to change it.

 

What I'm on about with "Hyur in cat ears and a tail" is that for the vast majority of Miqo'te RPers you could retcon their character into a Hyur and absolutely nothing would be different other than them no longer having ears and a tail. This holds true for a lot of long time veterans around here who are otherwise great roleplayers.

 

It's things like never emoting the expressiveness of these aforementioned ears, or the tail, failing to ever use the sensitive nose to emote picking up scents, ignoring the Keeper diurnal tendency entirely, and (although it's fine to have a non-traditional Miqo'te) outright ignoring the lore because many find it distasteful - at least have the character acknowledge that lore with an IC rejection, don't pretend it doesn't exist at all or be outright hostile to those who acknowledge Keeper promiscuity or the political correctness nightmare that is Seeker harems.

 

Most Miqo'te RPers are just Hyur in catboy/girl cosplay. And let's not spend any more time than we need too talking about the fetish crowd that permeates Miqo'te. I used to doubt how widespread some claimed it to be, but considering how often I run into Miqo'te who are just a vehicle for fetish, I had to rescind that view.

 

I'm just hoping beyond hope that AuRa have normal sexual mores and don't have a culture so unsettling that people choose to outright ignore it as they did en mass with Miqo'te, or this will happen all over again.

 

In the meantime, I'll take the possibility of character creation restrictions severely limiting the creation of AuRa alts as an unexpected boon.

 

Regarding specifically the feline traits you mention (movement of ears, expressiveness of tail, emoting the nose) I don't think it's entirely fair to say that failure to do so is somehow playing a hyur with ears and a tail. As a person, I am entirely able to control my facial expressions: If something funny happens at an inappropriate time, I don't always bust out laughing. If I hear something in the distance, I don't immediately turn my head and look to see what it is. If someone at work comes into my 'cube and farts, I don't necessarily have to express outwardly that I've smelled anything.

 

It's also a bit uneven to enforce the diurnal/nocturnal cycle given the flux of the world clock. Who's got the right time, anyway? If your Keeper miqo is in GMT-5 and you're talking to a Seeker and he's GMT+8, what time is it? If you're randomly meeting someone in a bar and there's no windows? Do you consign yourself to playing your character drowsy and off-kilter half of the time because you don't know what time it is in the world around you?

 

Now, there is some (alright, a lot) of merit to what you're saying, but we could probably take that same scrutiny to a lot of people. Lalafell who, besides naming conventions, are just fat children. Roes who are just giant Russians people. Elezen who are just French snobby tall people. Trust me, I'm as tired of the "flamingly stereotypical yaoi-fantasy mancat" as you are, but it's easier to just ignore those people. You're never going to be able to stem the tide of folks you don't agree with, all you can do is limit your exposure to them.

 

And if anyone here is expecting the Au Ra population to be anything other than 90-10 in favor of off-canon history and background, I urge you to reconsider your hope in your fellow man.

 

Edit:

A comment about rarely seeing ears, tails, and scent in RP exactly means that I expect people to use it ALL THE TIME or they're not doing Miqo'te RP right. /s

 

Seriously this misconception about my meaning had me double checking my posts to make sure I didn't completely mess up my phrasing.

 

This is what I mean:

 

Although Rakka'li's face sat placid as a frozen lake, the sharp backward tilt of his ears made it clear how furious he was. Several seconds passed before his ears relaxed and he managed a slow, respectful nod.

 

Stuff like this. I don't mean emoting all the time that a Miqo'te's tail moved, or that their ears are well, cat ears, I'm on about how these tools of expression go severely underused in general.

[Dravus]

I think that it's important to take a character's race into account when portraying them. Even if a Miqo'te isn't associated with a tribal lifestyle they're still a Miqo'te and so they're never going to be exactly like a Hyur. 

On the other hand compared to certain other MMO's the playable races in this setting don't have a whole lot of established lore to draw from. A lot of it is fairly vague or hidden in obscure places.

[Kellach Woods]

Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

 

Leads to so much bad territory.

[Warren Castille]

On one hand, it's logical. Miqo'te should be using their ears and tails and whatnot. On the other hand, it could be considered redundant writing if you acknowledge that our characters are familiar with the other races. It's very definitely a detail that could be left off in casual conversation - How often do you take specific notice of your pet's tail? Their ears? Unless they're behaving strangely, do you even really notice that stuff at all?

 

I've always been more of a dialogue writer myself, so I always overlook that stuff in my writing. I don't think it makes it bad, or worse or lesser somehow, though.

[Dravus]

Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

 

Leads to so much bad territory.

 

It depends on the approach. I mean, I won't lie - it would be refreshing to see more Miqo'te acting like Miqo'te. Even the subtle stuff like twitching ears or struggling to grasp the full extent of Eorzean culture can make a huge difference in terms of a character's impact.

 

On the other hand for some races it'd be great to see less stereotypical behaviour. Almost every Highlander I meet is some sort of brute and I don't think I've ever met one who hasn't pushed the height and muscle slider up to max and made much of their role-play about how much of a sex symbol their character supposedly is.

 

In the end it's a matter of balance. A varied community is much more interesting than one where everybody is doing the same thing. Though on the other hand that also means that it isn't necessarily good for the bulk of role-players to be operating outside of the realm of plausibility.

[Clover]

To each their own, of course. I personally feel that ignoring the lore is a complete waste of opportunities to create something fun, and I'd love for my Seeker to meet other tribal miqo'tes from different tribes (is there any other real tribe out there?). I'm also ready and eager to follow the Au Ra lore, whatever it is.

 

I must add that, while it's good that everyone RPs their own thing, I personally will prefer to RP with a majority of people who follow the lore. If the majority of characters I met ignored the lore completely, this one would simply cease to exist, as it would no longer be the norm. I'd rather avoid that. (For good or for bad, I don't engage in casual RP with strangers, so I haven't actually had this problem so far).

[Kellach Woods]

On the other hand for some races it'd be great to see less stereotypical behaviour. Almost every Highlander I meet is some sort of brute and I don't think I've ever met one who hasn't pushed the height and muscle slider up to max and made much of their role-play about how much of a sex symbol their character supposedly is.

 

I did that on a midlander, except maybe not the height slider.

 

Results are hot.

 

That being said, acknowledging that miqo'tes have tails and cat ears every so often feels like such a minor gripe that I'd honestly call it superficial. This isn't straight writing - we can see they have such attributes. Why can't we trust our eyes?

 

In so far as the lore is concerned, as soon as they release actual lore about not!Eorzea I'll follow it and adapt if necessary. Kell is an outsider, I'm not going to apologize for having literally no lore to fall back on.

[A'vlan of Sharlayan]

Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

 

Leads to so much bad territory.

 

Mhm! Kinda reminds me of RPing on many WoW servers - lots of "if you're not using a cookie-cutter personality you're bad" which, in all truth, sucked.

 

Still, yeah, being emotive and all that is great, but I was never really too bothered when Miqo'te didn't emphasise their Miqo'te-ness all the time. In fact, I didn't really notice it at all until it was mentioned. Perhaps it's time to pay more attention!

[Kinono]

On one hand, it's logical. Miqo'te should be using their ears and tails and whatnot. On the other hand, it could be considered redundant writing if you acknowledge that our characters are familiar with the other races. It's very definitely a detail that could be left off in casual conversation - How often do you take specific notice of your pet's tail? Their ears? Unless they're behaving strangely, do you even really notice that stuff at all?

 

I've always been more of a dialogue writer myself, so I always overlook that stuff in my writing. I don't think it makes it bad, or worse or lesser somehow, though.

 

As sad as I am to admit it, there are times where I'm much lazier in RP than others, and times where I'm just more inspired. I don't RP a miqo'te currently, but even as just a short, fat kid, there are times when I'm much more explicit with Kino's mannerisms in /em than others, so it's definitely not something I'd begrudge a miqo'te player for leaving out. I imagine it'd get tiring re-iterating and re-establishing "yes, I am a miqo'te" all the time, and, to be honest, there's a chance it'd be just as tiring to read.

[SilverWolfIMHP]

I'm tossing in my two Gils here.  Why well it's kind of connected to why I chose to turn my Fortune teller from a Miqo'te to a Lalafell.  But first...

 

Long long time ago in a RP far far away... NO NOT THAT ONE!  Way back when I used to Rp in the AOL chatrooms.  Yeah that how old I am AOL was cool at one time back when DSL was the fast new thing and you still had the dial up sounds.  

 

Where was I?  Oh yeah well there were some RP chat rooms where there was the CAT GIRL.  Cute playful humans with ears and tail.  Me being more RPer then CyberRPer I turn the tables.  I made a Male Cat man.  I also RPed him more of a beast then human.  Wild, hunted and ate raw meat, growled and normal grunted instead of talked.  

 

Sound familiar?  I also RPed a Khajiit on the Elder Scrolls Online Beta I was in.  Again I went with a natural born hunter a stalking predator.

 

So back on topic I first was going to make a Miqto'te because I played a Human/Beast before.  Ears twitch claws tapping on tables, feeling claustrophobic in cities you name it.  Then I thought how to play the Fortune teller who took the time and focus to become a master of Divination.  Things didn't fit.

 

Maybe if I made him OLD letting age guide him along the path to that level of focus.  Didn't quite work either so I change his race to Lalafell.  Will I play a Miqto'te Heck yea!  Not as a fortune teller but as a hunter, a predator, survivor living on whit, skill, and cunning. 

 

Now here is a real question involved with this topic.  How much Beast is in a Miqto'te?  The Art of them they are more or less Human with cat ears and tail, where a Khajiit are bi-ped felines.  How savage could a Miqto'to life be?  There bound to be trade with non-Miqto'te they have weapons and training enough to go toe to toe with the Guardians.  Equipment made by Miqto'te is on par with what you can get elsewhere.  They are even moving into other culture's cities.  

 

Speaking about WOW Kellach I played a Peon Orc.  With the whole "Me not that kind of ORC!" line.

[Warren Castille]

cat stuff

 

There's nothing specifically precluding you from having a bestial, feral miqo'te but there's not much support for it, either. Miqo'te are still considered a race of "man" and they do not have pads or claws, just fingers and toes. Could you play a savage miqo'te who has never seen civilization before? Probably, but there's a fairly large language barrier in the way. Raw meat is another question mark; There's nothing to say you couldn't digest it but the implied dietary habits of the races of man are stock across Eorzea - we cook our food.

 

You could play a miqo'te that way, but it would be just as plausible as someone playing a lala, roe, elezen or hyur that way.

[A'vlan of Sharlayan]

Now here is a real question involved with this topic.  How much Beast is in a Miqto'te?  The Art of them they are more or less Human with cat ears and tail, where a Khajiit are bi-ped felines.  How savage could a Miqto'to life be?  There bound to be trade with non-Miqto'te they have weapons and training enough to go toe to toe with the Guardians.  Equipment made by Miqto'te is on par with what you can get elsewhere.  They are even moving into other culture's cities.  

 

Personally, I imagine they're somewhere inbetween - and it seems to vary from tribe to tribe. They're descended from hunter tribes that crossed the frozen sea long ago, after all, and they still have their many tribes, so they haven't exactly left that lifestyle. Yet, there's plenty of clearly intellectual ones, and they don't seem lacking in intelligence in general.

 

Then again, I'm probably biased, being that I RP a Scholarly type more than anything else. I figure you could play a Miqo'te as savage as you liked - nothing wrong with some individuality.

[Clover]

I'm a bit confused. I thought this thread was about the miqo'te lore, not so much about miqo'tes seldom or often mentioning their tails and ears. At least my post was about the lore itself. A characters' body language is a matter of personal choice, I think, and not everyone is equally descriptive in their writing, so this point shouldn't really be a problem (?). That or I've completely misunderstood it.

[Warren Castille]

I was aiming for more or less discussion over the "Most miqo are hyur in cosplay" commentary. I don't think it's fair to slap that on because folks don't emote smelling or waggling their ears.

[Bopdoot]

It's nice if people put time into adhering to lore, but as long as someone doesn't make a character (regardless of race) strictly to be an ERP magnet, I really have no complaints lol..

 

As for Highlanders maxing out sliders, I made Amelia shorter!..... lol but I did max muscles because of her chosen main class (GLA/PAL) and her personality. Lord knows she'd probably faint if someone called her a sex symbol, assuming she even know what they were talking about .

[Dravus]

I'm a bit confused. I thought this thread was about the miqo'te lore, not so much about miqo'tes seldom or often mentioning their tails and ears. At least my post was about the lore itself. A characters' body language is a matter of personal choice, I think, and not everyone is equally descriptive in their writing, so this point shouldn't really be a problem (?). That or I've completely misunderstood it.

 

I think it's about pretty much both those things at this point.

[Ritual]

I played a couple of Miqo'te when I first started playing the game, I remember adding in mentions of the tail and their fangs etc, but it felt so redundant, I feel you should only RP actions that give your character well, character, if yo are going to add these elements into your character don't add them in all the time, make it a quirk of your character. When they're stressed make their ears twitch or their tail sway faster etc, don't just mention these things all the time to reiterate your character is a Miqo'te because I can see that. 

 

I play an Elezen now, he's not a tall snobby person, he has traits of Schizoid PD and is a hunter/carpenter type, if you got to know him however, you'll notice he uses his keen eyesight to analyse characters outfits and demeanour so he can paint a picture of them in his mind. These can just be given to a Hyur, but the issue is there really isn't any major difference between Hyur/Elezen at all, except maybe that I was told Wildwoods discriminate against Duskwights and everyone I've seen RP completely ignores this, I know it's not nice to go around discriminating against a player base and I'm not saying we should, but why should we care about the minor details of emoting things about your races when 1. We can clearly see you are said race and 2. It's so easy to handwave away all the lore background to your character by saying, "My family was different." that there is no longer a reason for the Miqo'te to act tribal or the Elezen or any of the races to act a certain way?

 

Not to mention people have varying ways of RP so again there's no point in caring to an extent unless it's severely negatively affecting you.

[Kahnopy]

Essentially, you pile a lot of different cultures together in a given place, eventually one will rise as the “main” culture, migrating individuals are then given a choice: either they fold, and get assimilated into it, or they stand and they become part of the struggling minorities.

 

In the process of assimilation, identities may lose some of their flavour, behaviours may mutate to adopt the common mores of the place they live in. I believe this is where most Miqo'te are, because you don't really see a lot of successful “city-tribes”. Indeed, if they wish to stay traditionnal, they mostly keep to themselves, and generally far from the cities.

 

So yes, take this phenomenon and add the fact that the lore on Miqo'te culture is a tad slim, and you will get what we observe now. Some Miqo'te will give out the impression of being cat-like Hyurs.

 

“Is it fine?” Yes it is.

 

“Why do you play a Miqo'te instead of a Hyur then?” Ah, that's where the answers will vary.

 

Mine is that because Miqo'te is an old race whose lifestyle is going under some brutal changes, mostly because of the Calamity, the notion of struggle is never too far from them. I like the movement that brings to a character. I like the prospect of playing a character who has to dig out the ways he received to change them, whether or not it is by necessity. Yes, old ways might not be as viable anymore, trades and encounters might inspire individuals to move out, and those very ones might meet trouble adapting to a new lifestyle.

 

Now what is important is that adapting is a process, for some even life-long. That journey is interesting to play out. So while it is fair to have some Miqo'te individuals with a “refined” or “civilized” behaviour, I find it most appropriate to have them stand in an awkward place with the society, with unexpected quirks, strange and old ways of speaking — isn't that conveniant for me? — or just generally different views.

 

Little things that will make them stand out from the Hyurs, the Lalafells, the Elezens and the Roegadyns. Those bring flavour, but should not by no means be enforced.

[Enteris]

On one hand, it's logical. Miqo'te should be using their ears and tails and whatnot. On the other hand, it could be considered redundant writing if you acknowledge that our characters are familiar with the other races. It's very definitely a detail that could be left off in casual conversation - How often do you take specific notice of your pet's tail? Their ears? Unless they're behaving strangely, do you even really notice that stuff at all?

 

I've always been more of a dialogue writer myself, so I always overlook that stuff in my writing. I don't think it makes it bad, or worse or lesser somehow, though.

 

As sad as I am to admit it, there are times where I'm much lazier in RP than others, and times where I'm just more inspired. I don't RP a miqo'te currently, but even as just a short, fat kid, there are times when I'm much more explicit with Kino's mannerisms in /em than others, so it's definitely not something I'd begrudge a miqo'te player for leaving out. I imagine it'd get tiring re-iterating and re-establishing "yes, I am a miqo'te" all the time, and, to be honest, there's a chance it'd be just as tiring to read.

 

So many things to respond to... where to begin?

 

Well first, tossing this in for relevance: http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=7880

 

But as was stated above, I believe it would get tiring on both ends to read and type that the ears and tail twitch as the miqo'te grins, their fangs showing slightly before ............ It's an unneeded redundancy. By all means, throw it in if/when you can, but don't feel obligated to do so.

 

I think it's a bad move to call someone out on their RP style and capability for not adding in subtle movements of ears and tails. It shows, to me, that you are more focused on superficial things rather than the actual RP/story/events going on. As was stated above, you can see that the character is a miqo'te. And unless the player says otherwise, I'm pretty sure people won't mind you assuming that they are actually ICly a miqo'te... complete with ear and tail movements.

 

On the topic of smelling... what exactly do you expect someone to do? Meta game and say your character didn't wipe correctly so they smell of feces? Meta game and say that your character must've taken three steps through a field of lilacs? I mean, short of there being an actual reason to state that something smells... this can really fall under that "assume it's happening" category. 

 

As to the miqo'te whoring bit... it's hard to deny when there is in-game evidence of such behavior (can't remember what thread the screenshots were in). Or, at least, those miqo'te hovering all over La Noscea sure do make it seem like a fairly common thing in lore with how very playful they are... and it does often seem to be miqo'te moreso than any other race. 

 

That being said, I agree that it would be refreshing to see more tribal affiliated miqo'te, or at least those that do ICly make mention of their relation to a tribe. And that's coming from a player with a seeker miqo'te that has pretty much been handed the reins of a brothel. And a player with a keeper miqo'te that is very much rooted in his "traditional" ways to the best of my understanding and ability with our very limited lore.

 

As to the time of day deal... I've run into very few miqo'te (that aren't mew mew neko neko =^.^= chan kawaii types) that actually don't make mention of this. The large majority of them have made known some sort of preference as to their respective celestial being... so I can't really comment on that particular deal to any extent. Unless, of course your issue is the whole in-game clock vs real life clock and who is right... it'd be hard to get any RP done for ANY race if we were to make our characters go to bed at a "realistic" (read: when the sun goes down for the majority of the races) time. We'd have maybe forty minutes tops of RP before our characters would yawn and pretty much immediately nod off...

[Seriphyn]

^ That's construing player demographics and RPer habits for lore...which has some RP utility admittedly, but not something I'd preach as canon.

 

At any rate, I find myself thinking both Warren's post and the quoted post in the OP are both pretty valid, and enjoyed reading both. Thing is, it's such an egregious fan service race I have to give anyone playing a "neko race" the benefit of the doubt. Male cats TEND TO (but not universally) be some uber Kirito-kun anime badass. Female cats have a greater chance of not being irritating and are closer to the lore. Then there was that thread where Miqo'te players who said they like playing Miqo'te is "because they like cats IRL".

 

The most amusing things about these Miqo'te discussions is when people legitimately and unironically try to defend Seeker culture. Embrace it! Embrace all the lore, even if it's shitty!

[Dravus]

What's wrong with Seeker culture?

[Warren Castille]

What's wrong with Seeker culture?

 

To take a guess:

 

SE handed players lore that outright said "These guys in specific get ALL the tail they want, and yes, you can play as one."

 

They made Sex God a playable race.

[Bopdoot]

I think OP was more concerned with the ignorance of lore rather than emoting tail swishing lol..though everyone seems to he fixated on the latter to invalidate OPs argument.

 

Let's take a gander at the wiki so I can, as a new player, understand miqote. 

 

1. Miqote have a lesser presence than other races. (Reality, miqote are the majority on Balmung.  At least based on a pie chart I found.  It's not reasonable to force people not to play a race because there's already a lot on the server,but it's food for thought.)

 

2. Shyness / solitary lifestyles. (Reality, it almost seems like miqote are the most outgoing race I've seen so far in RP.  Should EVERY miqote be brooding and live like a lone wolf? No, but as an RPer, you should at least present a reason why your character deviates from a racial norm.)

 

3. Seeker devotion to Ayzema. (Reality, I have not witnessed enough RP with miqote to know of their culture reflects their religion but I think it absolutely should. FFXIV is not really a world of atheists lol..)

 

4. Keeper devotion to Menphina. Conflict with Gridania forest folk. (Reality,same answer as #3.)

 

5. RP of day/night cycles. (The game has an in-engine clock with passing time. Are you a bad RPer if you ignore it? Probably not, but I think it could improve immersion no matter what race you're playing.)

 

Tl;Dr this is just my perspective. Sorry for any weird typos I'm at work and I did this on my phone . 

[Dravus]

What's wrong with Seeker culture?

 

To take a guess:

 

SE handed players lore that outright said "These guys in specific get ALL the tail they want, and yes, you can play as one."

 

They made Sex God a playable race.

 

Oh, well I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. It's balanced out by the Keepers of the Moon being much more matriarchal. There's definitely many more Nunh than would seemingly be realistic (and many of them aren't even a tribe anymore which sort of makes the title redundant...) but it's usually easy to tell which are role-played for the sake of portraying an interesting character and which are just blatant ERP bait.

[Aduu Avagnar]

I reference Nako's tail and ears when appropriate, if someone mentions his name, or he hears something of interest, his ears twitch, etc.

 

If you find him in the right mood and ask the right questions, he will talk about his family group, etc, but he isn't really one to spill his life story out or talk about himself. He is ultimately, a private person when it comes to his personal life.