Looking to brawl in The Quicksand!

[Coatleque]

Pretty much this. ...I recall witnessing a date turned into walk-up murder once. couple people at a table, stranger walked up and snapped someone's neck, and the person died. THE ENTIRE QUICKSAND ASSEMBLED and we must have had about 60 people RPing all at once. It wasn't even possible to read the chatlog.

 

Being the person who's date was murdered across the table from her, I can say that this event was quite fun. What people need to realize is that both the murderer and victim had this planned ahead of time. He would die, she would be caught.

 

I would -love- to see an all out brawl happen. All I'm saying is, do your best to mitigate drama and powergaming ahead of time.

[Gegenji]

All I'm saying is, do your best to mitigate drama and powergaming ahead of time.

 

And be prepared for it during, even with the preparation beforehand.

[Warren Castille]

My favorite out for this sort of thing: If your character gets hauled off in chains by the Brass Blades, remember that it is completely believable to just bribe yourself free off-screen later. The biggest issue that causes these things to potentially spiral off into OOC frustration is the lack of consequence; No one gets seriously hurt, no one gets in trouble, there's no fallout. Ul'dah gives people such an easy way out of trouble through bribery that I'm surprised more people don't just rely on that.

 

Remember that Sultansworn, if they are present, have little jurisdiction law-wisem to arrest anybody. They'd likely resort to calling in Blades to do the actual enforcement, and it allows there to be a tense line between those who wish to do good and those who do good, but will waive that for sufficient gil. Good guys remain good, bad guys remain bad (and free!) and those caught up in the mix get to go their separate ways.

 

tl;dr get arrested, bribe dirty cops

[Branson Thorne]

I think that is where some confusion is being held.

Allow me to state what I ACTUALLY WANT TO HAPPEN!

(bolded for effect)

 

 

#1. Get into a verbal argument.

 

#2. Throw a few punches, knock a few people around.

 

#3. Get jumped on by law types/ other patrons

 

#4. As long as they don't expect me to go quietly, I will eventually go with them under the case of being arrested.

 

#5. Probably not log in for a day or 2 or A'mon (rp being arrested) and emerge a few days later, out early on account of a bribe, wearing an eye patch from my injuries.

 

@ Berrod, although I do understand what you are saying, if I have to conform to what others want for their RP setting, they should equally have to settle for the way that I occasionally want do something. Makes sense, yes?

 

 

TLDR. If there are any guards out there that are bored of nothing happening, let me know, I'm your guy!

 

Me personally, I'd love to knock around a few people while getting my ass handed to me by drunken patrons/city guards!

 

You sound like the type of guy that'd be great to bring along to a bachelor party.

 

What are you doing in July?

 

Attending a bachelor party that's about to be awesome!

[Warren Castille]

The only other piece of advice I can give is that not every roleplayer in the game hangs out here. While your intentions sound perfectly acceptable to me, it's possible that others see the fight start and jump in. As Kage mentioned sometimes these things take on a life of their own, and you effectively lose "control" of the fight as soon as it starts.

 

I'm not meaning to sound discouraging! I just don't want you to bite off more than you can chew if you start a full-scale riot.

[Desu Nee]

The only other piece of advice I can give is that not every roleplayer in the game hangs out here. While your intentions sound perfectly acceptable to me, it's possible that others see the fight start and jump in. As Kage mentioned sometimes these things take on a life of their own, and you effectively lose "control" of the fight as soon as it starts.

 

I'm not meaning to sound discouraging! I just don't want you to bite off more than you can chew if you start a full-scale riot.

[Branson Thorne]

The only other piece of advice I can give is that not every roleplayer in the game hangs out here. While your intentions sound perfectly acceptable to me, it's possible that others see the fight start and jump in. As Kage mentioned sometimes these things take on a life of their own, and you effectively lose "control" of the fight as soon as it starts.

 

I'm not meaning to sound discouraging! I just don't want you to bite off more than you can chew if you start a full-scale riot.

 

Yes true, that's currently why I'm still kinda on the fence on how to go about this. It just sucks to see 50+ people sitting in a tavern %15 of them are reading books or sipping tea, while all these heavy weight badasses sit there bored out of their minds because theres not a thing going on for them.

 

If there was a way to maintain some sort of structure, I would be doing this in an instant, willing to RP the whole 9yrds, injuries arrest, everything!

[Kinono]

 

[Desu Nee]

 

[Branson Thorne]

Let's try to keep this on topic, please:)

[Aya]

Alright, my original post was more tongue-in-cheek, but seeing where this has gone since then I do have some more serious points to add!

 

Firstly, the idea that people are opposed to a bar brawl being immersion breaking is ridiculous.  The Quick Sand is not a low-end dive bar, its a high end business and center of activity.  The place is bustling busily, and serves a wide range of clientele from the lowly starting adventurer to the highest end of professionals in Ul'dah.  Nothing in the entire setting appears cheap and inexpensive, Momodi takes her business seriously that much is obvious.

 

The last thing she would want is to have the business of the day interrupted by a brawl, broken glasses, drinks, bottles, and a wanton interruption of her steady gil-making activities.  Adding to the confusion in the moment will come the tab for replacement of everything broken, for cleaning up the mess, and the added hassle when the Blades come by to find out what happened.  This isn't a pirate or cowboy bar (where I am sure fights are still not desired, but just far more difficult to avoid without a legion of armed and armored guards in proximity), and if you think that's immersion breaking you're simply wrong.

 

From my own in-character perspective, who gets to clean up after the thugs when they're done?  Who is at risk when the violence escalates? Yeah, my character!  So, you can be sure that she does her best to prevent the outbreak of violence and often tries to intervene early to get those involved to step outside (then its the Brass Blades' problems, not her own).  Some people really don't appreciate that, to the point of being jerks, but guess what, you're dealing with my immersion too!

 

Lastly from an OOC perspective I do not appreciate bar-fights because so often they result in wanton disregard for consequences and other people.  I do realize that having a half dozen individuals interfere in your attempted RP is a huge annoyance, but for those of us that RP staff, regulars, and law-enforcement on the premises, we either expect to be respected when we become involved, or else we have to roll our eyes at an immersion breaking mess in the midst of the area that we have to ignore.  There really is no good solution for this, and because of how crowded it is you're probably going to have some amount of trouble with it.

 

Now, it sounds to me like you have the right OOC mindset for it, and would play along reasonably!  That means it could make for a fun scene that I'd enjoy OOCly! (even if Aya were quite very unhappy about it ICly!) If you really want to go through with it, I'd suggest sometime a little later in the evening (after 11 est) when the place is usually pretty quiet.  Just be ready to pay the consequences including a hefty tab from Momodi for all damages (plus whatever suitable amount she thinks she can get away with extracting from your hide with the help of her bribed Brass Blade friends). 

 

Lastly, to Askier:

The Quick Sand is as fun as you let it be.  It is vastly better for a conversation or meeting than an action scene, but not all serious RP is action.

[Kinono]

Firstly, the idea that people are opposed to a bar brawl being immersion breaking is ridiculous.  The Quick Sand is not a low-end dive bar, its a high end business and center of activity.  The place is bustling busily, and serves a wide range of clientele from the lowly starting adventurer to the highest end of professionals in Ul'dah.  Nothing in the entire setting appears cheap and inexpensive, Momodi takes her business seriously that much is obvious.

 

The last thing she would want is to have the business of the day interrupted by a brawl, broken glasses, drinks, bottles, and a wanton interruption of her steady gil-making activities.  Adding to the confusion in the moment will come the tab for replacement of everything broken, for cleaning up the mess, and the added hassle when the Blades come by to find out what happened.  This isn't a pirate or cowboy bar (where I am sure fights are still not desired, but just far more difficult to avoid without a legion of armed and armored guards in proximity), and if you think that's immersion breaking you're simply wrong.

 

I dunno about others, but my impression from multiple cutscenes in the game, as well as instanced battles that take place within this very establishment, seem to imply that, while not necessarily "common," fights are expected. The very opening cutscene involves two men roughing up another man right in front of Momodi and she just shrugs it off cavalierly.

[Branson Thorne]

I've seen a fight break out at a church (for real) so I'm sure that in regards to it being a high place of business, a fight still would not be uncommon.

[Aya]

Uncommon and undesired are two entirely different adjectives.

[Kinono]

Uncommon and undesired are two entirely different adjectives.

 

They are indeed!

[Telluride]

When it comes down to it, the source of contention is that people want different things in their RP hub.

 

I'm personally thankful that Balmung even has one that is so popular - as much as some may scoff at "Tavern RP", it serves a purpose of allowing down time, and a chance to observe other RPers in the community, and get a sense of who does what in a "natural" environment. Not every game I've tried to RP in developed a really good hub, and the community seems to dry up much, much faster in the absence of one. So, don't knock the Quicksand for being "boring" just because not everything there is a slugfest.

 

After all, some people want this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...and some people want this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...but it's tough for those to happen at the same time. A good rumble pretty much takes up ALL the playing space and the environment.

 

It may also be worth pointing out that, despite my earlier comments, one could possibly have this work - as many people hang out outside the actual Quicksand as within it, so you could very well have an awesome knock-down, drag out scene while still allowing people a space to go to for their less hostile environment, by taking a couple of dozen steps away and inside.

 

I have a personal bias, I admit, because of the number of times I've seen people start up brawls in other MMOs in such ways as to be little more than god-mode trolling, and who flat-out refuse to acknowledge that if they are taking up public, well-used playing space, and not being mindful of the greater RP community, then they are rightly labeled as @$$hats by that community. I say to the OP, if this is not you, sir, then please disregard any implied criticism.

 

A little excitement and change-around IS good! I could not be TOO critical of the way people use the public RP space, else I'd be a hypocrite for the very thing I have been doing this week - delivering singing telegrams everywhere. Others in this thread have made some very excellent points. So, I can only really say at this point to be public-minded when using public space.

[Kage]

I'm just cautioning having it in a very... public space and knowing who is involved.

 

As someone who has seen the confrontation rp go from 5 people to 30... it really wasn't the most enjoyable experience. It got to a point where so many people and the chaos involved with so many made me ready to say "yeah go ahead and push that knife/axe into him Im just done."

[LiveVoltage]

Yes, finally I have the chance to tackle someone and cuff them and drag them off to the Brass Blades for a reward.

 

Hey, its your RP. You do what you want to do. However, if you want it to be private and not cause a huge riot such as brawling in the midst of forty people then take it to party chat. Nobody can interfere there.

[Aya]

I have a personal bias, I admit, because of the number of times I've seen people start up brawls in other MMOs in such ways as to be little more than god-mode trolling, and who flat-out refuse to acknowledge that if they are taking up public, well-used playing space, and not being mindful of the greater RP community, then they are rightly labeled as @$$hats by that community. I say to the OP, if this is not you, sir, then please disregard any implied criticism.

Exactly this!  And I think from reading the OP's posts he's not expecting this sort of thing, but hopefully he can understand where some of the OOC friction he's seeing originates.  Barfights for me typically begin as an unwelcome interruption to normal tavern RP, take a loooong time to wind to some point where usually things end up in kind of a muddled mess. It has not exactly made for thrilling and powerful RP.  Not to say that it couldn't!

 

I guess I'd be a lot more inclined to just gasp, shout, and hide if these things tended to be explosive and short

 

Honestly, the best "barfight" that I've seen was the quick and realistic reaction to someone getting hit over the head with a full bottle of wine.  The target (I think entirely unsuspecting that this was going to happen) fell out cold (*thunk*).

 

However, just to make my point, said assaulter not only continues to come by the QS regularly, but has conducted further assaults in the QS itself!  Its like there just are no consequences at all, and that is the sort of thing that really bugs me.  You attempt to murder someone enough times in the QS, and you're probably barred from the place.

[Branson Thorne]

Oh I totally see where everyone is coming from, would just be nice to find something exciting to pull others in without it turning into a chaotic clusterf***

[Kage]

Oh I totally see where everyone is coming from, would just be nice to find something exciting to pull others in without it turning into a chaotic clusterf***

Yeah... that's why I'd say know who you're doing it with. If dedicated to quicksand, party chat?

 

There's also that small bar at the airship landing

 

Can totally do that there too. Potential for more people without the likelihood of it turning into a chaotic clusterfuck from too many people.

[Ha'uruh Nunh]

My alt got his pocket picked at the Quicksand just the other day. The thief asked me OOCly beforehand if it was okay and I was intrigued, so I rolled with it.

 

Of course, it was in full view of a lurking Free Paladin and both the Paladin and my apt knew the thiefs name and face from the Grindstone, where she regularly competes. So while she got a away with the theft basically scot-free, she had to miss the Grindstone that week to bribe the Blades after the crime was reported.

 

Fine, right? IC consequences for IC crimes. The problem was a newbie RPer that jumped in trying to protect the thief that not only made the situation worse, but followed said Paladin to the Grindstone reaming him out the whole way. Public RP conflicts can definitely lead to unexpected consequences. Was still fun though.

[Melkire]

First off, obligatory "Flames are not law enforcement but we will still break up your brawls if need be" statement.

 

Second, do not start a brawl in such a populated and well-patrolled area as the Quicksand unless you are willing to accept any IC consequences that come your way short of dictated-character-maiming-or-death.

 

Third, be mindful of what level of authority any particular governmental branch has. I'm not sure how it would work in Limsa or Gridania (though I have ideas), but in Ul'dah any Flame, Sultansworn, or Brass Blade can break up your fight, and technically speaking any of those three can have you temporarily incarcerated, but barring a threat to the Sultanate, only Blades can hold you for more than a short stay, and only Blades can levy criminal charges at you... and thankfully, as previously mentioned, you can bribe your way out of consequences if you get taken in by the Blades.

 

Fourth, be prepared to be drowned out by chat spam, regardless of whether those people decide to get involved or not.

 

 

 

I think that about covers everything that's already been said better by others. Whoops. :blush:

[Caspar]

I've been somewhat amused by the potential of an idea such as this.

 

As a Wuxia fan, the 'fight in a teahouse' scenario is something I always relish, much like the famous Qiu Chuji vs the Seven Freaks of Jiangnan in Legend of the Condor Heroes. Something like that with jumping on tables and railings and whatnot. It's enough to make me feel regretful I've already somewhat developed my character beyond picking needless fights in public places where others could be injured by her. That being said, it's not out of the question if someone else was the aggressor. Even if she had to spend a night in jail, hypothetically, I could probably allow it.

[Warren Castille]

Imagine, if you will, a band of like-minded individuals. They come from all stripes and walks of life but believe in one thing: Violence is cathartic. This band of individuals, because they cannot be truly called friends, travel from one watering hole to the next. Someone will look at someone funny. Someone will say the wrong thing. And these men and women will be the powder keg to those sparks, breaking into fights at the drop of a hat. Today, the Quicksand. Tomorrow, Ophelia's Teahouse. Eventually, everywhere.

 

TAKE BACK THE BARFIGHT. THROW A CHAIR.

 

__

Disclaimer: Please don't actually rough up Ophelia's.