Healing

[Garalona]

With Garalona, her background is that she was a traditional chirugeon first and then moved on to studying conjuring after she got out of prison for forging her medical credentials (whoops). The way she figured it, once you get the elements to listen to you; there's no worry of little details like licenses and actually having attended college.

 

Even so, magic isn't her first art, and she prefers not to use it unless someone is actively in danger of dying. At an event like the Grindstone she'd probably just usual traditional methods to patch someone up and then slap them with a touch of Regeneration so they're at full strength by the time the next bout is up.

 

To her, magical healing is a lot of effort and energy, and besides that Elementals freak her out. ALL magic does, actually, white magic just happens to be "safest" in her books, comparatively speaking. She'll gladly do an old fashioned surgery, getting herself covered in blood and taking twice as long, just so it means she doesn't have to deal with all that.

 

I personally really like coming up with characters who have different views on healing and how easy it is/how often it should be done. If someone were to ask her why she can't just cast Cure over them and call it a day, she'd kick them in the shins, tell them to remember that ache, and walk away. She's already done it once before.

 

Well, Cure's not White Magic anyway.    It's Conjury!  

 

Your character's viewpoint is amusing when juxtaposed with my own character's viewpoint - she sees things like "surgery" (or whatever crazy way it's spelled in the game) as barbaric.  Why would you cut someone when you can mend what's wrong without effectively stabbing them?

 

Perhaps the two will meet one day.  

 

Potato, popoto.

 

I look forward to that happening, too.

[LiadansWhisper]

 

 

 

Potato, popoto.

 

I look forward to that happening, too.

 

It really isn't.  ._.  It's a huuuuuuge distinction.  White Magic is forbidden and hard to access.  Conjury is so easy to pick up that almost anyone can do so, unless they're completely unable to interact with magic (like a native Garlean, for instance).

[No Longer Exists]

As Liadan and I share a Free Company and my character, Doc Oak is also a chirurgeon among other medical and alchemical practices geared toward the art of well being; I think it might be wonderful to RP these three (and anyone else interested) having this debate.

 

As far as GS goes, the trouble with selling Healing in RP whether it's holistic or magical is that it takes time away from the GS itself and many players seem disinterested in taking the time to RP being bandaged up and rubbed down in salves. With an event that has a time constraint (not that it's IN the GS to stop at any time, but that it takes hours to complete), it's difficult to really push for RPing out holistic forms of healing without limiting the other players involved.

 

As for conjury, there've been some discussions about its use as a practical balm for minor nuisances. I vaguely remember a reference to some lore about conjury being conditional on the whim of the elementals as to whether it would work on someone or not. Some healers, Oak included, use alternative forms such as Equivalent Exchange as a means to RP bypass that lore quandary. Oak pulls energy from other things, even himself, to heal when he has to use conjury in order to limit the strain of it and in return, he plants flora and fauna or helps rebalance a region's natural resources to make up for the usage. I find it fun to RP that conscientious awareness of the delicate balance of powerful things. Unless an emergency (or the GS), Oak uses medical knowledge and alchemical or herbal remedies to treat injuries.

 

And finally, a shameless plug. Doc Oak is the chief medical officer of the Red Wings FC and I would loooooooove to grow the medical/scientific division more. If anyone's interested in RPing a medical professional or scientific professional character in a militiarized (but not rigidly so) FC; send me a PM.

 

-Hatter

[LiadansWhisper]

As Liadan and I share a Free Company and my character, Doc Oak is also a chirurgeon among other medical and alchemical practices geared toward the art of well being; I think it might be wonderful to RP these three (and anyone else interested) having this debate.

 

While we're in the same FC, Liadan is not currently active in the Red Wings.  So if you show up to Gridania...

 

As for conjury, there've been some discussions about its use as a practical balm for minor nuisances. I vaguely remember a reference to some lore about conjury being conditional on the whim of the elementals as to whether it would work on someone or not.

 

As I said in an earlier post, while the Elementals can say, "Hey, don't heal that asshat!," that doesn't mean that the "asshat" cannot be healed via Conjury.  What it means is that if you do so, you'll piss off the Elementals.  The only limits on what you can really do with Conjury are the strength of the aether around you and your own skill.  If the Elementals were actively policing the use of Conjury, I somehow doubt that the Garlean conscripts would be able to use it against those within the Shroud/against the Shroud itself.  Yet, the Garlean conscript Conjurers are still able to do so.

[Garalona]

 

 

 

Potato, popoto.

 

I look forward to that happening, too.

 

It really isn't.  ._.  It's a huuuuuuge distinction.  White Magic is forbidden and hard to access.  Conjury is so easy to pick up that almost anyone can do so, unless they're completely unable to interact with magic (like a native Garlean, for instance).

 

Oof, my mistake, was still thinking in blanket Final Fantasy terms.

[Sounsyy]

As I said in an earlier post, while the Elementals can say, "Hey, don't heal that asshat!," that doesn't mean that the "asshat" cannot be healed via Conjury.  What it means is that if you do so, you'll piss off the Elementals.  The only limits on what you can really do with Conjury are the strength of the aether around you and your own skill.  If the Elementals were actively policing the use of Conjury, I somehow doubt that the Garlean conscripts would be able to use it against those within the Shroud/against the Shroud itself.  Yet, the Garlean conscript Conjurers are still able to do so.

 

Pretty much this. The elementals can dictate to conjurers of the Fane who they think should be healed or not healed (talk to Quarrymill npcs) but ultimately, the conjurer can still heal them. There's a story about a conjurer who was banished from Gridania for healing a wounded Ixal, for instance.

 

Also, lore from the scholasticae in Ishgard says that they too teach their students in Conjury and Thaumaturgy. Despite Ishgard's symbiotic relationship with Gridania, I highly doubt the Ishgardian conjurers pay similar homage to the elementals, even though they are well aware of their existence.

 

Interestingly, Arcanima and tome-summoning is considered heretical. Though select students at the scholasticae are being allowed to research its applications.

[Arik]

As others have said, it really depends on the situation and who I'm RPing with.

 

If the wounds are relatively minor, I'm fine saying that the magic quickly expedites the healing process-- probably closing cuts, lightning bruises, etc etc and allowing my character to swiftly bounce back.

 

However, when it comes to more serious wounds which could prove fatal in less fantastic settings-- like getting run with a sword Aerith Gainsborough style-- death is still possible and I very much prefer the healing process to take some time. Healing can very well stabilize a character's health and thus be the make-it-or-break-it factor between my character dying or otherwise being stabilized to live another day, but the healing would not -entirely- resolve the wound.

 

I've upset many a healer in the past who wanted their abilities to be 100% successful but I chose to retain some amount of said wounds regardless. Luckily, my usual pocket conjurer these days shares these opinions as my own and often even employs traditional, non-magic first aid on a regular basis.

[LiadansWhisper]

As others have said, it really depends on the situation and who I'm RPing with.

 

If the wounds are relatively minor, I'm fine saying that the magic quickly expedites the healing process-- probably closing cuts, lightning bruises, etc etc and allowing my character to swiftly bounce back.

 

However, when it comes to more serious wounds which could prove fatal in less fantastic settings-- like getting run with a sword Aerith Gainsborough style-- death is still possible and I very much prefer the healing process to take some time. Healing can very well stabilize a character's health and thus be the make-it-or-break-it factor between my character dying or otherwise being stabilized to live another day, but the healing would not -entirely- resolve the wound.

 

I've upset many a healer in the past who wanted their abilities to be 100% successful but I chose to retain some amount of said wounds regardless. Luckily, my usual pocket conjurer these days shares these opinions as my own and often even employs traditional, non-magic first aid on a regular basis.

 

It's generally always going to be the choice of the victim, as it were, as to how the healing will impact them. I really don't agree with those who believe they should be able to fully control how their healing affects others. It should be a mutual, negotiated outcome, because we're telling a story TOGETHER.

[Branson Thorne]

I view healing more as a "I've helped them to recover quicker" kind of thing, but all the limitations of healing would still be there.

 

If I were to ever have a broken bone while IC,and even if it was healed, I would still RP the recovery for at least the next few days. I couldn't see myself going for a month rping around a broken arm. Which is where I think magic comes in.

[Aris]

As someone who is looking to RP as a healer, I should generally ask them OOC what they want the outcome to be then?

 

Edit: Sorry Warren, asking questions on your thread.

[Branson Thorne]

As someone who is looking to RP as a healer, I should generally ask them OOC what they want the outcome to be then?

 

That would probably be best:thumbsup:

[Aris]

As someone who is looking to RP as a healer, I should generally ask them OOC what they want the outcome to be then?

 

That would probably be best:thumbsup:

 

Thank you, sorry for silly question :blush:

[Zetchryn]

As someone who RPs a healer, I first ask what they want the end result to be. I also take into account two things: How recent the wound is, and how severe it is.

 

In my opinion, if a healer can get at a wound almost immediately, then they can repair most of the damage quickly as long as it's not too severe. Hence the idea, for example, of how the heck a tank in a dungeon isn't falling over dead by the end. The more time you wait to heal the wound, the harder it will be for a full recovery.

 

However, healers are not miracle workers. If, for example, someone suffers a grave injury, a healer might only be able to stabilize the man's condition, perhaps get them back on their feet. Think Raise for this, which applies a debuff on the target. You just took a very nasty hit, we couldn't fix everything, but you'll live.

 

As severity and time since the injury occurred increase, the ability to heal decreases. I've RPed someone finding my healer much to late for her to do anything magically, at which point she just starts sewing them up physically and helping them with the pain..

 

 

 

On this note is also the subject of scars. Every player is different, and I ultimately allow others to decide whether or not something scars, but once again, the older the wound and the more severe the injury, the more likely I think something would scar.

[Michaux]

On this note is also the subject of scars. Every player is different, and I ultimately allow others to decide whether or not something scars, but once again, the older the wound and the more severe the injury, the more likely I think something would scar.

 

This might be slightly off-topic, but I've been thinking about the issue of scars. My character has almost none, in spite of the fact that she's lived an intermittently dangerous life since reaching adulthood. I like the idea of healing magic as an aid to physical healing, but not as a perfect quick fix. As such, you'd expect someone who has been wounded to have scars, even if they were tended to by a healer. But I was wondering if a healer might be able to work on her own injuries over time, applying healing spells not merely at the beginning, but throughout her whole recovery process, so as to minimize or eliminate scarring. Plausible?

[Warren Castille]

On this note is also the subject of scars. Every player is different, and I ultimately allow others to decide whether or not something scars, but once again, the older the wound and the more severe the injury, the more likely I think something would scar.

 

This might be slightly off-topic, but I've been thinking about the issue of scars. My character has almost none, in spite of the fact that she's lived an intermittently dangerous life since reaching adulthood. I like the idea of healing magic as an aid to physical healing, but not as a perfect quick fix. As such, you'd expect someone who has been wounded to have scars, even if they were tended to by a healer. But I was wondering if a healer might be able to work on her own injuries over time, applying healing spells not merely at the beginning, but throughout her whole recovery process, so as to minimize or eliminate scarring. Plausible?

 

Absolutely. We can't define if healing is accelerated regenerative processes or simply rebuilding flesh as if it was never wounded. It's literally magic.

[Jana]

I've read on two players' wikis now that my character has scarred them at times I hadn't really considered it, so I think that'll generally be best left to the players of the characters being healed, rather than the healers!

[LiadansWhisper]

As someone who RPs a healer, I first ask what they want the end result to be. I also take into account two things: How recent the wound is, and how severe it is.

 

In my opinion, if a healer can get at a wound almost immediately, then they can repair most of the damage quickly as long as it's not too severe. Hence the idea, for example, of how the heck a tank in a dungeon isn't falling over dead by the end. The more time you wait to heal the wound, the harder it will be for a full recovery.

 

However, healers are not miracle workers. If, for example, someone suffers a grave injury, a healer might only be able to stabilize the man's condition, perhaps get them back on their feet. Think Raise for this, which applies a debuff on the target. You just took a very nasty hit, we couldn't fix everything, but you'll live.

 

As severity and time since the injury occurred increase, the ability to heal decreases. I've RPed someone finding my healer much to late for her to do anything magically, at which point she just starts sewing them up physically and helping them with the pain..

 

 

 

On this note is also the subject of scars. Every player is different, and I ultimately allow others to decide whether or not something scars, but once again, the older the wound and the more severe the injury, the more likely I think something would scar.

 

I'm curious as to why you think healers aren't miracle workers?  They can raise people from the edge of death (people who have all the appearance of being dead) back to life, among other amazing things.

[Aysun]

As someone who RPs a healer, I first ask what they want the end result to be. I also take into account two things: How recent the wound is, and how severe it is.

 

In my opinion, if a healer can get at a wound almost immediately, then they can repair most of the damage quickly as long as it's not too severe. Hence the idea, for example, of how the heck a tank in a dungeon isn't falling over dead by the end. The more time you wait to heal the wound, the harder it will be for a full recovery.

 

However, healers are not miracle workers. If, for example, someone suffers a grave injury, a healer might only be able to stabilize the man's condition, perhaps get them back on their feet. Think Raise for this, which applies a debuff on the target. You just took a very nasty hit, we couldn't fix everything, but you'll live.

 

As severity and time since the injury occurred increase, the ability to heal decreases. I've RPed someone finding my healer much to late for her to do anything magically, at which point she just starts sewing them up physically and helping them with the pain..

 

 

 

On this note is also the subject of scars. Every player is different, and I ultimately allow others to decide whether or not something scars, but once again, the older the wound and the more severe the injury, the more likely I think something would scar.

 

I'm curious as to why you think healers aren't miracle workers?  They can raise people from the edge of death (people who have all the appearance of being dead) back to life, among other amazing things.

My reasoning for healers not being miracle workers would be the mourning people right outside the Stillglade Fane..

[LiadansWhisper]

 

 

My reasoning for healers not being miracle workers would be the mourning people right outside the Stillglade Fane..

 

All that means is that they chose not to heal whoever died.  "The Will of the Forest" is bandied about a lot, but the truth is, the only limits to a conjurer's ability to heal someone are their own skill and the strength of the ambient aether.  The Elementals aren't preventing you from doing it, and I wouldn't put it past certain self-centered Hearers (who, remember, have absolutely no innate reason we are aware of to be good-of-heart) to simply say the Elementals don't want someone to be healed when the Elementals don't actually care.  The Elementals are unlikely to know, since as far as we know, they don't understand mortal speech.

 

Are there limits on what healers do?  Sure.  That doesn't mean they aren't miracle workers, though, for all intents and purposes.

[Aysun]

 

 

My reasoning for healers not being miracle workers would be the mourning people right outside the Stillglade Fane..

 

All that means is that they chose not to heal whoever died.  "The Will of the Forest" is bandied about a lot, but the truth is, the only limits to a conjurer's ability to heal someone are their own skill and the strength of the ambient aether.  The Elementals aren't preventing you from doing it, and I wouldn't put it past certain self-centered Hearers (who, remember, have absolutely no innate reason we are aware of to be good-of-heart) to simply say the Elementals don't want someone to be healed when the Elementals don't actually care.  The Elementals are unlikely to know, since as far as we know, they don't understand mortal speech.

 

Are there limits on what healers do?  Sure.  That doesn't mean they aren't miracle workers, though, for all intents and purposes.

If we really want to get into semantics we could also talk about what is considered a miracle in a world of magic.

 

For the record, I mean this seriously! I wonder what Eorzeans would consider a miracle if powerful healing magic was easy/common/etc.

[Zetchryn]

All I meant by the term 'they're not miracle workers' is the fact that healers have a limit to their powers. I cannot take a severed arm and reattach it to you. I cannot LITERALLY bring you back from the dead. And if you're taking sustained fire, eventually my powers will fail and you will die.

 

 

 

Magic is miraculous, yes, but it is not endless. To go to truly devastating levels of "I can heal anything I want to" requires White Mage, which is a whole different can of worms.

[Miko Shiroi]

Personally, I treat healing/being healed as a time-consuming and difficult process. For example, I play my main character, K'heyo, as a healer who draws his restorative powers from a close bond with the Elementals. Whenever K'heyo heals someone, he must not only recite chants (beseeching the Elementals' help), but the exertion on his body is pretty great. Depending on the severity of the wounds he's healing, it's likely that he'll pass out/fall asleep for a long time after finishing the healing. Even then, the person who was healed would still likely feel a bit sore for some time after.

 

When it comes to being the one who's healed... well, I guess that really depends on how the 'healer' wants to play it out. If they have some sort of special character trait (like K'heyo), then it's really up to them, I feel. If not, I'll likely have my character make a gradual recovery just to make it feel more "realistic." If the wound is big enough, sure there'll be a scar or two left behind!

[Kellach Woods]

Different reactions to different events.

 

Light-hearted I'll pop back up, might be dazed if it's a big hit or rule of funny.

 

THE MOST SERIOUS OF RPs - Scarring if it makes sense, accelerated assisted mending, etc.

[Illae]

After playing healers in several games, I take into account several things.  Firstly, any serious injury is not going to be healed immediately without some repercussion to either the healer or the patient.  It can vary from exhaustion on the part of the healer, which for large amounts of injuries can quickly incapacitate an unwary healer,  to ravenous appetite and taking things easy for the patient.  

 I also take into account the scene and the person being healed's roleplay.  After all, a debilitating injury that is part of a storyline and needs a certain cure should not be healed with a regular application of magic, where as a wound just got for the sake of flavour can be healed quickly and with a little more effort, not leave a scar.

 

It comes down to communication between the person being healed and the healer.  Most healers I know are very careful to give the patient exactly what they want.. most of the time.

 

I have only ever put someone in a medically induced  coma once however, as that is taking their character out of play and no fun, but that was cleared with the PoPatient first.

[LiadansWhisper]

After playing healers in several games, I take into account several things.  Firstly, any serious injury is not going to be healed immediately without some repercussion to either the healer or the patient.  It can vary from exhaustion on the part of the healer, which for large amounts of injuries can quickly incapacitate an unwary healer,  to ravenous appetite and taking things easy for the patient.

 

I can understand exhaustion from the sheer effort of concentration required to repeatedly channel the various schools of magic in the case of healing a large group, and I can understand simple exhaustion not unlike that of a triage surgeon who is quickly patching people up and moving along.  But I'm not entirely sure how this could incapacitate a healer "quickly," unless they were doing something very, very wrong.