"Lore-friendly" or not Jobs

[Kage]

Berrod.

 

Berrod please.

 

You're not Lee or Gai. Thanks.

[Zyrusticae]

Lee or Gai would actually be excellent examples of how opening a chakra could work.

 

Except for the crippling near-death (or actual dying) when you're finished part. Hmm, on second thought, maybe not so great? It seems like opening a chakra in FFXIV is considered a permanent change to your very being, rather than something to do temporarily for a sudden boost of power.

 

Either way, it's something just about anyone can do, provided they know the right places to fight.

[Berrod Armstrong]

Lee or Gai would actually be excellent examples of how opening a chakra could work.

 

Except for the crippling near-death (or actual dying) when you're finished part. Hmm, on second thought, maybe not so great? It seems like opening a chakra in FFXIV is considered a permanent change to your very being, rather than something to do temporarily for a sudden boost of power.

 

Either way, it's something just about anyone can do, provided they know the right places to fight.

That's right! Every chakra that he opens permanently alters what he's capable of.

[Kage]

Could one learn and train under another Monk on how to open the chakras?

[Berrod Armstrong]

Could one learn and train under another Monk on how to open the chakras?

Yessir!

[ArmachiA]

Berrod, your excitement in this thread is adorable. Just sayin.

[Berrod Armstrong]

Berrod, your excitement in this thread is adorable. Just sayin.

LOL, you made me read all my posts again and I'm here like what the hell is wrong with that guy. I really enjoy discussing job lore ESPECIALLY MONKS AAAAAAAHHHH because it opens up a whole other side of the game. 

 

I mean, it's fun to roleplay citizen number 3 selling boiled potatoes at the side of the road, or soldier #5, but it's ALSO fun to roleplay that guy with a soul crystal who's just doing his best to learn the arts that have been passed down with it. 

 

I see people saying, "HARUMPH, YOU SHOULDN'T ROLEPLAY THIS AND THAT BECAUSE HEM HEM HRMGH." And I'm like...it's a game! Sure there are certain rules and guidelines surrounding a lot of the things, but there is no reason for something perfectly playable to be taboo. Take the concept, challenge yourself with it, work with it, and turn it into something that you and the people who can roleplay with you will enjoy. It's all about fun in the end.

[Leanne]

Berrod, your excitement in this thread is adorable. Just sayin.

LOL, you made me read all my posts again and I'm here like what the hell is wrong with that guy. I really enjoy discussing job lore ESPECIALLY MONKS AAAAAAAHHHH because it opens up a whole other side of the game. 

 

I mean, it's fun to roleplay citizen number 3 selling boiled potatoes at the side of the road, or soldier #5, but it's ALSO fun to roleplay that guy with a soul crystal who's just doing his best to learn the arts that have been passed down with it. 

 

I see people saying, "HARUMPH, YOU SHOULDN'T ROLEPLAY THIS AND THAT BECAUSE HEM HEM HRMGH." And I'm like...it's a game! Sure there are certain rules and guidelines surrounding a lot of the things, but there is no reason for something perfectly playable to be taboo. Take the concept, challenge yourself with it, work with it, and turn it into something that you and the people who can roleplay with you will enjoy. It's all about fun in the end.

 

100% Agreed! I love to show the Bard part of Leanne when RP allows me to! It is refreshing, and open new venues also to those who decide to pry into Leanne's knowledge.

 

That, and her teacher is a moogle. Nuff said.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

That, and her teacher is a moogle. Nuff said.

 

Moogles are adorable. Nobody can possibly argue with that. It is fact.

 

But Tonberries are way cuter. Debatable fact.

[ArmachiA]

I agree. I kind of have a reputation on being super rigid with lore, but really I'm not. I really, really think it's way more fun to wrap your character around the lore, weaving it within the lore, to make it fit, then it is to barrel through the lore and breaking it, especially when 95% of the time the character concept will work with a little lore research and maneuvering, and you'll look super cool knowing your character is perfectly lore compliant.

 

This is a fantastical game. There is lore for mostly everything people want to do. It's Final Fantasy after all, things get crazy as hell. Some of the lore of this game is crazier than any special snowflake character you can think up. I really really like the lore they give us in this game and would love if they just gave us more (*cough*The Twelve*Cough*)

 

On Jobs, I don't see anything wrong with playing a Job, if that's what you want. Armi is an Archer who happens to sing, but I certainly don't care if people RP they have magical songs. As long as it's lore compliant who am I to complain?*

 

*THis isn't to say I won't have an opinion, but my opinion literally means nothing if it's perfectly in line with lore.

[Kage]

Armi you have a reputation for your poor Armi who seems to get hurt in more ways then one a lot. *sagenod*

 

I think it's totally interesting to try to weave the lore around and challenge people to go for the jobs that seem "restricted" because... seriously? If they can make a great story for it... I want to be in there. Please. Let know that delicious story.

[Hiro]

I've noticed a good chunk of FFXIV's roleplayer base (and not ALL) take lore quite heavily into account. More often than not I see people use the argument, "Lore is to be followed not ignored" or, "Why Roleplay in a universe if all you're going to do is ignore the lore presented thereof". There have been times I often feel that its almost out of hand compared to most games and communities I've been a part of over the years. That said, I lean quite heavily to lore myself keeping fully in mind that the game wasn't created to be Roleplayer friendly, that it was a project initially meant to follow the spirit of the Final Fantasy Franchise despite being an MMO. Thus I quite happily glance over the more restrictive things or, work out ways around them like many have pointed out in this thread simply by avoiding use of job titles or even class titles, etc.

 

In my mind there is no wrong way to Roleplay. Everything has a place in the world of Roleplay, and while I may not appreciate or even want to acknowledge the existence of something brought into the world by another mind, I've no right to deny another Roleplayer anything. For me this includes use of jobs, the use of classes, importing non-existent or undefined elements, really anything that anyone else may bring into the game. No one can ruin my Roleplay or immersion but me, not even Narutoske Uzuhyuugalolsharingan desperately trying to tell me he's a Shinigami unless I really let it bother me. I'm not required to consider every encounter and ever Roleplay "canon" to my characters existence and it's very difficult to do so, however some do which is fine.

 

All of the jobs, including Ninja I imagine have the inherent issue that, the lore presented in them is information really only privy to the Player Character in their role as the Warrior of Light and Champion of Eorzea. Almost all of the classes involve the Player learning new things that aren't even predominantly known about. Most cases we're interacting with hard to find specialists who have spent their lives uncovering the information we're considering lore. Even the Paladin Storyline, which is probably the least restrictive of the Jobs that I can think of, still puts a heavy restriction on it's open Roleplay applications, especially with regard to Sultansworn. This I feel puts a restriction on what lore actually is, just because we know of it intricately from an OOC perspective does not mean we should really understand it from an IC perspective, further what do we get to consider IC worthy knowledge? FFXIV is especially complex for these types of questions.

[ArmachiA]

Armi you have a reputation for your poor Armi who seems to get hurt in more ways then one a lot. *sagenod*

 

SHE SURE GETS STABBED A LOT.

 

At least sharp objects are lore compliant :bouncy:

[Kage]

Armi you have a reputation for your poor Armi who seems to get hurt in more ways then one a lot. *sagenod*

 

SHE SURE GETS STABBED A LOT.

 

At least sharp objects are lore compliant :bouncy:

... they should be. You would rather her be stabbed by spoons? D:

[Dat Oni]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

 

You do realize that out of all the members of the Scions/Crystal Braves, Minfillia and your character are the only ones with the Echo?

 

Statements like these make me question whether or not some of you have even played the Main Scenario in its entirety (Or rather, 2.0-2.3).

[Yssen]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

 

You do realize that out of all the members of the Scions/Crystal Braves, Minfillia and your character are the only ones with the Echo?

 

Statements like these make me question whether or not some of you have even played the Main Scenario in its entirety (Or rather, 2.0-2.3).

 

That is not so. The other NPC adventurers also possess the Echo, as do some of the Scions, and ALL of the Archons. That is why they are Archons. Minfillia says so when you are first introduced to them. It is further stated in the quest text for some of the side quests that start in the waking sands. That is also why there are other adventurers wreathed in light in some of the cut scenes with Hydealyn, they are other Echo users.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

 

You do realize that out of all the members of the Scions/Crystal Braves, Minfillia and your character are the only ones with the Echo?

 

Statements like these make me question whether or not some of you have even played the Main Scenario in its entirety (Or rather, 2.0-2.3).

 

No....there are others as well. All the important Scions have the Echo, but not those with the Echo are Scions. There was an Echo-awakening that happened in 1.0, but it would be impossible to round up them all. (No more easy than trying to round up every single English-speaking person in the world)

 

I can pull from two very easy sources for this. You -the character- before you join the Scions. 

 

In 1.0, there were many cutscenes with the Echo before you even know that Minfilia existed, let alone the Circle of Knowing/Scions. 

 

In 2.0, it would reason that there are other adventurers out there that have the Echo that are unaware of it. (Since SE seems to have gone away from using the Echo as a plot point beyond simply resisting being tempered and a flashback here and there)

[Zyrusticae]

Getting back on the subject of Warriors of Light (yes, I know we said those were our final words, but hear me out), I must acquiesce.

 

Can we agree on this?

 

Warriors of Light must

A. Have the Echo, and

B. Must be fighting against the Darkness in some way, be it directly in combat, or indirectly through support of those in combat or philosophically or any other number of methods of 'war'.

 

Someone who merely possesses the Echo but otherwise lives a normal life (ala the aforementioned priest) would not be referred to as a Warrior of Light, but someone like Minfilia who directly opposes the forces of Darkness would qualify (by Hydaelyn's own standards), though she does not fight on the front lines and isn't referred to by this title directly.

 

As such, I would assume (dangerous word, I know) that most player characters with the Echo would be Warriors of Light by default. There are a few (emphasis on a few) players who would prefer to play NPC-type characters who may possess the Echo but otherwise live normal lives, but they are largely the exception that proves the rule.

 

I am now actually waffling on whether or not T'rahnu herself would actually qualify as a Warrior of Light, as she does not directly oppose the forces of Darkness, but rather happens upon them by mere circumstance. It may be that I would have to refer to her as a Warrior of Light* with an asterisk (same as I would for Minfilia).

 

Either way, I'll continue to use Warrior of Light as shorthand for someone with the Echo, as it's simply how I've been using it for quite some time now.

 

References:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/114311-Explaining-the-Term-Warriors-of-Light

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/194454-Semantics-The-Echo-vs.-Warriors-of-Light?p=2460329&viewfull=1#post2460329 (yes, I asked on the official forums)

[Kage]

I argued that earlier this weekend.

 

In the 2.0 story line end the Ascian only appears to Minfillis and you the PC while you are at waking sands with others from 1.0 group but only those two see because of Echo

[Yssen]

I argued that earlier this weekend.

 

In the 2.0 story line end the Ascian only appears to Minfillis and you the PC while you are at waking sands with others from 1.0 group but only those two see because of Echo

I think that is two unrelated bits. He does one thing because of the Echo, and chooses to only reveal himself to you and Minifilia.

[ArmachiA]

I can't agree that the Warriors of Light have the Echo, because theres no proof that the people who Loiusoix sent forward in time all had the Echo. We can't assume every. single. person. on the battlefield had it. There's just no proof and, following the logical path, it doesn't seem like it's true.

 

The lore of the game seems to tack on the title of Warrior of Light to the Adventurer in the MSQ at the end of the quest, but that's not what the original term was for.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

I can't agree that the Warriors of Light have the Echo, because theres no proof that the people who Loiusoix sent forward in time all had the Echo. We can't assume every. single. person. on the battlefield had it. There's just no proof and, following the logical path, it doesn't seem like it's true.

 

The lore of the game seems to tack on the title of Warrior of Light to the Adventurer in the MSQ at the end of the quest, but that's not what the original term was for.

This.

 

I argued that earlier this weekend.

 

In the 2.0 story line end the Ascian only appears to Minfillis and you the PC while you are at waking sands with others from 1.0 group but only those two see because of Echo

I think that is two unrelated bits. He does one thing because of the Echo, and chooses to only reveal himself to you and Minifilia.

Also this.

[Zyrusticae]

I think part of the confusion is that all the non-blessed NPCs were already fleeing from the area as soon as Bahamut started attacking. Moreover, there's no evidence that any non-blessed characters were teleported from the area. Most notably, as the Admiral's story tells it, only members of the Foreign Levy disappeared from the field (and by extension, her mind).

 

I will defer to Anonymoose's explanation of the turn of events here, as he's far more familiar with the lore than most players (and may even be on par with the actual writers & translators). All those who were teleported forward through time were assumed to be PCs, who are all assumed to have the Echo, and thus make up all of the Warriors of Light who came from the past. Any NPC adventurer said to have the Echo/be a Warrior of Light is a stand-in for another PC (since they can't have actual PCs in their place, of course) to help give the player some perspective on events.

[Kage]

I argued that earlier this weekend.

 

In the 2.0 story line end the Ascian only appears to Minfillis and you the PC while you are at waking sands with others from 1.0 group but only those two see because of Echo

I think that is two unrelated bits. He does one thing because of the Echo, and chooses to only reveal himself to you and Minifilia.

Explain thanks.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

I argued that earlier this weekend.

 

In the 2.0 story line end the Ascian only appears to Minfillis and you the PC while you are at waking sands with others from 1.0 group but only those two see because of Echo

I think that is two unrelated bits. He does one thing because of the Echo, and chooses to only reveal himself to you and Minifilia.

Explain thanks.

 

Go to an inn room. Main scenerio Quests, Seventh Astral Era.

 

The Gifted, Custscene #2.

 

 

The Echo is a gift, but it is also a skill. Some are better at using it than others. The White Ascian is particularly harder to see because you need to have a better understanding and control of the Echo than for Lahabrea.