"Lore-friendly" or not Jobs

[Leanne]

One thing though, personally, you can RP whatever you want, AS LONG as you have a reasonable story behind it. Leanne is a bard. Not your run of the mill bard, but a bard with a soul gem. To run away from the usual godsbow story, I chose to have a moogle find Leanne midst the shroud, deem her a good candidate for the gem, AND teach her the art, since as far as I'm aware/I remember, it was the moogles who tried to offer the power to Gilbert, only for him to refuse. To me, it is an acceptable story. For other who still insist I shouldn't be a bard, but simply an archer that doubles as a musician, I simply ask unfortunately that if they don't like it, they simply can avoid my RP =X. I don't want to force them to accept my Bard RP, so if they want to interact with me, it is completely their choice. I just wish they respect my choice to RP as the happy go lucky bard with a terrible wanderlust that Leanne is.

[Berrod Armstrong]

Not quite. Echo awakenings happened en-masse in 1.0 (which we're supposed to take as like a prequal now), but not everyone used it to fight primals. The only people that get the WoL disgnation are the 1.0 players that were in the Battle of Carteneau or the players that take the MSQ as their lore. (Or at least the Echo and game-beating parts of it).

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Warriors_of_Light#Final_Fantasy_XIV

Near completion of the main plot, the Scions of the Seventh Dawn and all player characters (i.e. including those created in Realm Reborn) are referred to as Warriors of Light by the leaders of the Grand Companies. The player character is referred to as a Warrior of Light specifically by Hydaelyn.

I will continue to contend that anyone with the Echo is a WoL simply by association with Hydaelyn.

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions. 

 

The Warriors of Light are stated to be the band of Adventurers (i.e. the players) that helped protect the city-states and form the Eorzean Alliance during the events leading up to the Seventh Umbral Era. They took to the field during the Battle on the plains of Mor Dhona and were apparently lost during the unleashing of Bahamut. Their name derives from the fact that whenever people try to remember them, all they can remember is a silhouette surrounded by a blinding light.

 

I think that ^ is the more relevant part of what was linked; everything that came after it seemed to be from a gameplay perspective.

[TheLastCandle]

Enh.. Just for example's sake, my own character is a guy who can wield a few weapons (but no magic) with varying degrees of skill, a former dragoon by virtue of having participated in the war against the Dravanians, and one who employs some of the traditional abilities - i.e. aether-aided Jumping attacks with a barbed lance that's designed to be effective against hardened scales. It's a relatively small part of his character, in the long run. In fact, despite his "job" related background his default weapon is a bastard sword, and frequently uses a longbow.

 

Not much else to add, but in the end, honestly? Do what you want and have fun. I've seen some clever ways of bending the lore to fit a character into one of the more.. exclusive jobs. If someone expresses doubt IC, as long as they're not berating you OOC, just roll with it. The only real advice I'd have, which I believe would be preaching to the choir here on the RPC, would be to play the character more so than the job.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Not quite. Echo awakenings happened en-masse in 1.0 (which we're supposed to take as like a prequal now), but not everyone used it to fight primals. The only people that get the WoL disgnation are the 1.0 players that were in the Battle of Carteneau or the players that take the MSQ as their lore. (Or at least the Echo and game-beating parts of it).

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Warriors_of_Light#Final_Fantasy_XIV

Near completion of the main plot, the Scions of the Seventh Dawn and all player characters (i.e. including those created in Realm Reborn) are referred to as Warriors of Light by the leaders of the Grand Companies. The player character is referred to as a Warrior of Light specifically by Hydaelyn.

I will continue to contend that anyone with the Echo is a WoL simply by association with Hydaelyn.

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions. 

 

The Warriors of Light are stated to be the band of Adventurers (i.e. the players) that helped protect the city-states and form the Eorzean Alliance during the events leading up to the Seventh Umbral Era. They took to the field during the Battle on the plains of Mor Dhona and were apparently lost during the unleashing of Bahamut. Their name derives from the fact that whenever people try to remember them, all they can remember is a silhouette surrounded by a blinding light.

 

I think that ^ is the more relevant part of what was linked; everything that came after it seemed to be from a gameplay perspective.

 

I can add to this. 

 

I played 1.0. got to maybe lv35 on Botany. (Yes, I was /that/ guy who only leveled something to get the goobbue mount and legacy status. It made my laptop burn like fire the entire time). 

 

I have the legacy tattoo, but I wasn't a Warrior of Light by the game's definition. I didn't get any special cutscenes or references to my time in the game. I wasn't able to fight in the server-dying battle. It's more of a contradiction, because I have some of the Warrior of Light things, but not all of them.

[Zyrusticae]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

Not really. The Echo is the Blessing of Light. Ergo anyone with the Echo can be said to be a Warrior of Light...

 

I mean, there's not really anything to discuss here. You can say that it's only those who are seen in memory as blinding silhouettes but I won't agree with that at all. I just see it as another title for anyone blessed by Hydaelyn. Blame Squeenix for that one.

 

Edit: Remember that the Warrior of Light title, in all the games in which it appears, is used specifically for anyone chosen by the crystal(s), the crystal in FFXIV being Hydaelyn Herself. Having the Echo means you were chosen, hence Warrior of Light.

[Berrod Armstrong]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

 

Not really. The Echo is the Blessing of Light. Ergo anyone with the Echo can be said to be a Warrior of Light...

 

I mean, there's not really anything to discuss here. You can say that it's only those who are seen in memory as blinding silhouettes but I won't agree with that at all. I just see it as another title for anyone blessed by Hydaelyn. Blame Squeenix for that one.

The Warriors of Light are stated to be the band of Adventurers (i.e. the players) that helped protect the city-states and form the Eorzean Alliance during the events leading up to the Seventh Umbral Era. They took to the field during the Battle on the plains of Mor Dhona and were apparently lost during the unleashing of Bahamut. Their name derives from the fact that whenever people try to remember them, all they can remember is a silhouette surrounded by a blinding light

 

 

This, and 

 

Not really. The Echo is the Blessing of Light. Ergo anyone with the Echo can be said to be a Warrior of Light...

This.

 

If you put them side by side, the lore's definition of a Warrior of Light (NOT the gameplay's) is completely different from yours. If you wish to see it that way, that's fine, but it's a vastly inaccurate perspective. I can't really blame Square for that. However! Play as you like -- just don't expect ALL players of characters with the echo to accept their character being called a Warrior of Light. 

 

 

WHICH MAKES ME THINK. 

 

DO all warriors of Light possess the echo? Is it at all possible for Joe Echoless the Adventuring Bastard son of Schmitty to have been at Carteneau? Would he have been swept away into the rift along with the others, or incinerated? If he WAS, would he be an echo-less, clueless Warrior of Light? THINGS TO THINK ABOUT. YOUR THOUGHTS?

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Going by that logic means that all player characters are also members of the Scions.

 

Not really. The Echo is the Blessing of Light. Ergo anyone with the Echo can be said to be a Warrior of Light...

 

I mean, there's not really anything to discuss here. You can say that it's only those who are seen in memory as blinding silhouettes but I won't agree with that at all. I just see it as another title for anyone blessed by Hydaelyn. Blame Squeenix for that one.

 

Edit: Remember that the Warrior of Light title, in all the games in which it appears, is used specifically for anyone chosen by the crystal(s), the crystal in FFXIV being Hydaelyn Herself. Having the Echo means you were chosen, hence Warrior of Light.

 

But that....backwards. At least in this game. Warriors of light are more specialized Echo-bearers. 

 

Let me make a comparison with something else.

 

Assume having the Echo is like having a dog. (generic)

 

Being a Warrior of Light is like have a Corgi (or some other particular breed of a dog.)

 

All Corgis are dogs, but all dogs aren't corgis. 

 

...I'm not sure if my point's making it across anymore. But having the Echo isn't the same as being a Warrior of Light. 

 

There could be plenty of people with the Echo that are scared as shit for hearing some voice in their heads telling them to "hear. feal. listen." all the time. It won't make them pick up a weapon and run towards danger.

[Kage]

Is it at all possible for Joe Echoless the Adventuring Bastard son of Schmitty to have been at Carteneau? Would he have been swept away into the rift along with the others, or incinerated? If he WAS, would he be an echo-less, clueless Warrior of Light? THINGS TO THINK ABOUT. YOUR THOUGHTS?

I thought this was a yes.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Is it at all possible for Joe Echoless the Adventuring Bastard son of Schmitty to have been at Carteneau? Would he have been swept away into the rift along with the others, or incinerated? If he WAS, would he be an echo-less, clueless Warrior of Light? THINGS TO THINK ABOUT. YOUR THOUGHTS?

I thought this was a yes.

 

I think this is a yes, but have not seen confirmation.

[Berrod Armstrong]

Is it at all possible for Joe Echoless the Adventuring Bastard son of Schmitty to have been at Carteneau? Would he have been swept away into the rift along with the others, or incinerated? If he WAS, would he be an echo-less, clueless Warrior of Light? THINGS TO THINK ABOUT. YOUR THOUGHTS?

I thought this was a yes.

 

I think this is a yes, but have not seen confirmation.

The possibility blows my mind, I may take this to the lore forums. 

 

my mind is kind of telling me that it's just an inconvenient loophole but now i really wanna find out

[Zyrusticae]

Okay, this is quickly going nowhere.

 

I don't know why you would suddenly say the main story quest cutscenes are "gameplay" and not "lore" (seriously, isn't THAT backwards?), but the game is very clear and unambiguous about this.

 

It's POSSIBLE that there is some nobody who got the Echo but never had the chops to pick up arms to begin with. It's also POSSIBLE that Hydaelyn would never choose such an individual to obtain the Echo in the first place. All we have to go on is what's actually in the game, and what's actually in the game strongly suggests that anyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light by default, including player characters who were not created in 1.0.

 

I don't even know why you are so adamant about Legacy players being special here. They're not. Warrior of Light is not limited to them and them exclusively. This isn't arguable.

[Kage]

To be honest the whole WoL topic quickly went over my head while I was eating lunch and I don't even know what was being argued.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Okay, this is quickly going nowhere.

 

I don't know why you would suddenly say the main story quest cutscenes are "gameplay" and not "lore" (seriously, isn't THAT backwards?), but the game is very clear and unambiguous about this.

 

It's POSSIBLE that there is some nobody who got the Echo but never had the chops to pick up arms to begin with. It's also POSSIBLE that Hydaelyn would never choose such an individual to obtain the Echo in the first place. All we have to go on is what's actually in the game, and what's actually in the game strongly suggests that anyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light by default, including player characters who were not created in 1.0.

 

I don't even know why you are so adamant about Legacy players being special here. They're not. Warrior of Light is not limited to them and them exclusively. This isn't arguable.

 

It is going nowhere. This will be my last post on the matter. We can take it up in PMs or something, if there's anything left to continue on.

 

And I believe we're having a serious case of arguing different topics or something. I'm trying to say that 1.0 players not not special at all. They are all not WoL. Mine certainly wasn't, and that was shown in gameplay.

 

While the game might suggest that most Echo-enabled people become WoL (by either the 1.0 or 2.0 definition), it also suggests that Hydaelin might have just spun a wheel of fortune and said "these are the people I'll pick." Nowhere does the official lore that SE's given us state that all people with the Echo will become WoL. We know that all WoL in the 2.0 sense have the Echo. We know that most, if not all 1.0 WoL have the Echo (but it wasn't a requirement. There could have been some non-adventurers at the battle), but there's nothing to stop some random guy who was fighting in Mor Dhona at the time from also being sent through time and forgotten.

[Berrod Armstrong]

To boil it down and simplify:

 

• Not everyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light.
  
• What the Warrior of Light is in all the other FFXIV games has no bearing on what they are in THIS one.
  
• The lore clearly states that they are a specific group of people who participated in a specific event. 
  
• Nowhere in the cutscenes does it say that everyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light. For example, Minfilia is not a Warrior of Light. The *spoiler* priest in the *spoiler* quest line had it, and he wasn't a Warrior of Light. 
  

I'll conclude on that matter as well, the argument started to explode sideways, which happens, but the first point is the one I want to ring home.

[ArmachiA]

People who do not have the Echo can be a Warrior of Light (From the Carteneau variety), anyone who was on the battlefield and in range of Louisoix's spell was skipped ahead. Remember it was Louisoix who skipped everyone ahead, not Hydaelyn .

 

THere is no actual concrete lore on this however, so it has to stay in the Subjective pile.

[Berrod Armstrong]

People who do not have the Echo can be a Warrior of Light (From the Carteneau variety), anyone who was on the battlefield and in range of Louisoix's spell was skipped ahead. Remember it was Louisoix who skipped everyone ahead, not Hydaelyn .

 

THere is no actual concrete lore on this however, so it has to stay in the Subjective pile.

[Heavy Breathing]

 

 

I must find out

[Kage]

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

 

Right?

[Berrod Armstrong]

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

 

Right?

YAS.

 

Ifrit's thingie is called 'Tempering'. Titan doesn't do anything in that regard, Garuda 'Touches', Leviathan 'Drowns'. I don't know what Ramuh's influencing is called, and I'm not sure if Shiva's has a name yet. 

 

I think for 'Drowning' the folks are usually dunked in some sort of water. From what I've observed, Garuda just uses gust and it may just be super effective. Ifrit just breathes the blue flame.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

 

Right?

 

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

[Berrod Armstrong]

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

 

Right?

 

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

Yes! After having faced and defeated a primal, the soul crystal draws out the lingering Aether from you and manifests it into the egi's form. It's then up to the budding summoner to SUBJUGATE IT. Very easily played off.

[Kage]

But... so... um... there was some talk about titan and the company of heroes and which primals tempered people that led to this discussion?

 

Right?

 

Yeah. It was those pesky Summoners. Tricky methods. But really, I don't remember us fighting the primal in particular during the quests. More like....the essence of the primal?

I can't tell you cause I poopsocked the SMN questline when I finished SCH ><; But it wasn't like right before facing the egis that I had to go do the trials again

[Seriphyn]

On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

 

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

 

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

 

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

[Kage]

On my topic I am not asking why people choose to RP as jobs or not. If you want to talk about that, I ask that you make a different thread about it as I am only interested in the lore surrounding the jobs that would lend to interesting RP stories.

 

I am asking what the lore is behind jobs that make them open, limited or "restricted."

[OttoVann]

On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

 

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

 

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

 

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

 

I agree. If I ever took Otto down the path of real combat, I would /not/ be a monk. I would be a pugilist and I would never identify as monk. But that is my personal preference to be down to earth and avoid DragonBall powers on my character. Or a lancer, same thing.

[Berrod Armstrong]

On topic of OP, I've participated a lot in these discussions, but I don't know why there HAS to be a need to roleplay Jobs over Classes. Jobs come with all these sorts of gray areas and lore-breaking implications. Why not just be a lancer over a dragoon? Why not a gladiator over a paladin (unless you want to play Sultansworn)? Why not pugilist over monk? Other than a very small amount of differences, they're effectively the same. Some differences are just academic, such as gladiator and paladin.

 

Dragoons seem the most egregious example, and a good number of DRG RPers don't seem to really abide by being Ishgardian (they tend to be Miqo'te). In my character's hyper-traditionalist mind (where titles must be earned, upheld, and associated with rightful station), they're just lancers who got replica armour from "that moody woman in Mor Dhona".

 

Just play a lancer? There's no Kain in FFXIV, yo.

 

Then again we can pick and choose who we RP with, so ultimately \o\

It's honestly all good and fine not to play any of the jobs if that's what you want. But a roleplayer who wants to portray a character WITH a job may wish for guidelines on how they may go about doing so.

 

Personally, I chose Monk over Pugilist because the Monk works on a different level -- with regard to the seven chakras, specifically. If I wanted to play a Pugilist, the best I would get out of that is a fist fighter with the ability to enter the heightened state of Greased Lightning.

 

My character's concept always sounds so cheesy on paper (an amnesiac street thug pugilist who was a talented monk before geting keblox'd on the noggin), but anyone who has roleplayed with Berrod knows that it's not executed in a manner nearly as silly as it sounds. He's a man trying to get by (and get laid) in everyday Ul'Dah life. 

 

The 'job' part of the roleplay comes in at certain intervals and it is refreshing and fulfilling to allow myself to experience it. I could just play a pugilist street thug all day everyday, but that isn't engaging enough for me. To each his own, I think! 

 

Just make sure that if you DO play a job, you do so in moderation. I think people would get sick of me if I went about unleashing the third chakra for every little thing.

 

"Berrod can you help me move this bench?"

 

 

"OPEN TH'SOLAR PLEXUS!"

 

 

"BERROD PLS"