Marriage: How do you handle it?

[Velaena]

Something I've been considering for a while now if the future of my character Seraphine. One day I would like her to get married to a lovely Elezen and such (gentlemen... ). But I would be unsure of how to go about it, since I have very little information about marriage in Eorzea. 

 

So I'm turning this over to the community, what is your take on marriage in the setting of Eorzea?

 

-Do only certain races get "married"? 

-Do you count the Eternal Bond as a marriage ceremony?

-What about last names? Would the woman take the man's? Is there any change at all? Does it have to do with position?

-Same-sex marriage in Eorzea?

-Any other thoughts?

[Michikyou]

Its my understanding that miqo'te may the the only playable race that don't normally marry due to the racial gender differences in supply and demand. Males of the keeper societies wander from tribe to tribe to help sustain the population for them and in Seeker society a worthy male (a Nunh) is selected to breed with the females to ensure strong offspring.

 

However with the new 'city miqo'te thing, this may not be the case. While they hold their old tribal names we can't be certain if they do or do not marry.

[Ciel]

Pretty sure EB can count as marriage, but it can also stand in place of other ceremonies where vows are needed between more than one person. Most often, though, it is the former.

 

As the devs have stated, same-sex isn't really a concern since most people in Eorzea have bigger things to worry about than who gets married to whom, or what gender the pair happens to be.  If people are happy together, great, that's all that really matters.  People of all races and tribes marry, both within their respective race/tribe, and with others from different groups.  It may not be as common as we perceive it to be, canonically, due to cultural differences.

 

As far as names, I've seen the woman taken the man's last name, but I've also seen the other way where the man takes the woman's last name.  And there have been plenty where no name change is involved at all. It's entirely a matter of preference.

 

If you're looking to do it for RP purposes, just go a step at a time.  Build rapport with someone and let things happen on their own.  If you want to do it just for grins OOCly, just to see what happens, it's also worth it for some of the items you get from it.

[Warren Castille]

There's lore establishing that husbands and wives exist as titles, but there's nothing in game to show us where they come from. I know the Eternal Bond ceremony specifically points out that (the moogle, at least) they have no actual authority, but most people I know have just handwaved that.

[Virella]

Ishgardians seem to have politcal marriages, or so I assume such. Why else send assassins to a wedding ey?

 

http://xivdb.com/?leve/125/Supply-Side-Logic

[Chris Ganale]

My tribal outcast Seeker got an Eternal Bond with another tribal outcast Seeker, and for all intents and purposes they consider it marriage, though neither has changed names (but that's mostly because we're poor and don't want to waste money on frivolous name changes).

[Imo]

Eternal Bond is an euphemism. For all purposes, it's marriage.

 

And I believe that there are some places where homophobia is a thing (there are two gay guys who had to flee their village because other people there didn't approve of their relationship), but in the bigger and more open-minded cities, gay marriage exists. Same with marriage between different races.

[Chris Ganale]

Eternal Bond is an euphemism. For all purposes, it's marriage.

 

And I believe that there are some places where homophobia is a thing (there are two gay guys who had to flee their village because other people there didn't approve of their relationship), but in the bigger and more open-minded cities, gay marriage exists. Same with marriage between different races.

 

Those two were outcast for being an interracial couple. They didn't even mention being discriminated against for being gay.

[Imo]

Eternal Bond is an euphemism. For all purposes, it's marriage.

 

And I believe that there are some places where homophobia is a thing (there are two gay guys who had to flee their village because other people there didn't approve of their relationship), but in the bigger and more open-minded cities, gay marriage exists. Same with marriage between different races.

 

Those two were outcast for being an interracial couple. They didn't even mention being discriminated against for being gay.

 

Do they mention it's interracial? As far as I remember they only say they were discriminated against, and the game lets you draw your own conclusions whether it was because they're gay or different races. Possibly both.

[Chris Ganale]

It's a highlander dude and a...keeper? I have trouble telling them apart without getting right in their faces (this from a guy who plays two seekers), but he was dark-skinned so I assume he was a keeper. They stated in their dialogue they were run off for being two different races, not for being gay.

[Mercurias]

It's been stated before that a midlander married, or as good as married, a Seeker in the Alchemy quest line. 

 

In lore, interracial relationships are seen as odd or frowned upon more than same sex relationships in the eyes of society, so that may be an issue concerning some priests and/or priestesses. I could even consider it a plot point of the marriage: Finding someone to conduct the wedding.

[Chris Ganale]

It's been so long since I've done the quests for crafters and I snoozed through so many because I was sick of the grind...

 

That said, on the topic of finding someone willing to perform a marriage, I'd say that when an Ishgardian knight captain shows up at a chapel with a squad of knights and says that there will be a wedding, usually there's a wedding to follow.

 

On the other hand, the one wedding of my characters so far has been two Seekers, so...

[Steel Wolf]

Steel is having difficulty finding someone to stay around longer than a night in the sheets, so nevermind marriage.

 

She cry evrytiem.

 

Honestly, being married is the furthest thing from her mind. There's been plenty of other things to distract her from the whole matter of marriage, much as she'd like to be courted.

[Mae]

The Botany levequest "Caught in the Long Grass" mentions Sharlayan marriages...

 

A tinker called this dig a Sharlayan marriage: much suffering that culminates in charming offsprings and at least one death. It seemed baseless cheek at the time, but... Three naturalists have suffered broken bones this day. They must have tripped on the thick undergrowth; what else could it be?

 

... Which don't really sound like a fun thing...

 

That said, on the topic of finding someone willing to perform a marriage, I'd say that when an Ishgardian knight captain shows up at a chapel with a squad of knights and says that there will be a wedding, usually there's a wedding to follow.

Eh... not necessarily. At least possibly not in an Ishgardian chapel.

 

Ishgard seems to be very much a church-run state, where the priesthood has significantly more power than the knighthood. From what I got from the various quests in Coerthas, questioning/denying/defying the church is an unthinkable act, or at least one that's best done behind closed doors and in trusted company else you run the risk of being branded as an unbeliever, heathen, or (worse) a possible heretic. Even Haurchefant had to step carefully during the 30-something MSQ or risk being accused as a heretic (Guillaime's actual legitimacy to make such accusations at that point doesn't factor in).

 

If the attending priest said no (medieval Europe has many stories based around a priest denying a marriage because of lack of "recognized" permission/consent for the bride, to the dowry wasn't enough, to someone marrying below their station, to the priest not liking the family of one of the parties, to someone's position in the church was questionable, and to "God said 'No'"), it's likely that that could be the end of it. The couple could try to bounce around to various chapels until they found someone they could convince to carry out the ceremony, but the previous ones that said 'no' could come out of the woodwork and annul he wedding, call for the knight to put his/her spouse aside (especially if the spouse is "of lower class" or unbeliever/outsider), or even face excommunication or loss of station. Going outside Ishgard for a wedding, the wedding might not even be recognized back inside Ishgard.

 

*shrugs*

 

It's just speculation on my part.

[Ignacius]

Ignacius isn't interested in finding a lover.  He's pretty hyper-aware of what happens to loved ones when they end up on the wrong side of his profession.

[shotgunbadger]

I agree there, it seems like in Ishgard if a knight barges into a church and demands a wedding, the priest will probably go 'ha ha get out of my church you dirtbag' and that's the end of that. It may not be a full on theocracy but the church is clearly in charge of things politically and socially, if a priest says no you better have a really good reason to appeal that. And yea, saying 'ok fine screw this I'll go to another nation' in response would probably lead to 'cool, we don't recognize filthy outsider marriages so have fun playing pretend I guess'. Ishgard is not a fan of the whole personal freedom thing.

[Velaena]

Ishgardians seem to have politcal marriages, or so I assume such. Why else send assassins to a wedding ey?

 

http://xivdb.com/?leve/125/Supply-Side-Logic

 

I sure as heck hope that there aren't any assassins at poor Seraphine's wedding. Not that shes stepped on anyone's toes...no... <.< 

It's been stated before that a midlander married, or as good as married, a Seeker in the Alchemy quest line. 

 

In lore, interracial relationships are seen as odd or frowned upon more than same sex relationships in the eyes of society, so that may be an issue concerning some priests and/or priestesses. I could even consider it a plot point of the marriage: Finding someone to conduct the wedding.

 

Strange, a continent where homophobia is practically non-existent, but don't you dare marry that Miqo'te. It's intriguing that it would be such an issue, given that all the races are humanoid. I can see Elezen, Miqo'te, and Hyur all mixing without too many issues. Less so for Lala and Roe, however. 

 

I agree there, it seems like in Ishgard if a knight barges into a church and demands a wedding, the priest will probably go 'ha ha get out of my church you dirtbag' and that's the end of that. It may not be a full on theocracy but the church is clearly in charge of things politically and socially, if a priest says no you better have a really good reason to appeal that. And yea, saying 'ok fine screw this I'll go to another nation' in response would probably lead to 'cool, we don't recognize filthy outsider marriages so have fun playing pretend I guess'. Ishgard is not a fan of the whole personal freedom thing.

 

I agree with this 100%. I think that women have a lot more social status than they had back in medieval Europe because although Ishgard is vehemently religious, they aren't sexist as far as I can tell. Women are guards/soldiers, healers etc. so it wouldn't be impossible to assume they can have a pretty high social status too, and the relative freedom to marry whom they choose along with it. 

 

I can also see political marriages being a huge thing in Ishgard. 

 

 

As for my character, this isn't something happening in the next couple of weeks of course, if it were to happen at all.  Just curious as to how people viewed it.

[Martiallais]

For Zarek at least, EBs are a marriage though (given his luck) not really something he's ever anticipating happening.

 

On the other hand Martiallais, being an Elezen Ishgardian, I've actually poked about at the idea that a political marriage could happen for him someday. While it wouldn't be something he'd want to do (given how these things are usually set up), he would put the needs of the family above his own desires and go through with it. Hopefully without any assassins though. >_>

 

I think how common marriage is depends on the race and where they're from? Like for some reason I'd think more marriages happen in say Gridania than Limsa. I blame the scenery honestly LOL. While I could maybe see the Las Vegas type weddings happening in Ul'dah, cause as long as you've got the gil you can make most anything happen there.

[Mae]

I think how common marriage is depends on the race and where they're from? Like for some reason I'd think more marriages happen in say Gridania than Limsa. I blame the scenery honestly LOL. While I could maybe see the Las Vegas type weddings happening in Ul'dah, cause as long as you've got the gil you can make most anything happen there.

Gridanians probably marry more 'freely' between whatever there are for social classes, and probably at a younger age (all that forest for a young couple to go 'walking' in, so best to get the girls married before any potential baby bumps start to show), and is probably the more proverbial country-folk type weddings.

 

Limsa... probably has a very loose definition of what marriage is. Lonely wives, horny sailors, with quite a few cases of 'a woman (or man) in every port', so a lot of give-and-take with the concept to keep people happy. Or either has a very low marriage rate or a very high divorce rate. The weddings are probably a case of a captain shows up, the couple says their versions of "I do's", and then the drunken party starts.

 

Ul'dah... marrying outside your class (AKA 'who you can afford') probably isn't that common. The poor marry the poor, the working class marries the working class, merchants and artisans marry merchants and artisans, and the upper class marry the upper class. And among the merchants/artisans and the upper class, I'd imagine there's some manner of arraignment in the process. The son of a, say, cooper (barrel maker) who's being set up to inherit the family business might be shown more favor and given more encouragement by a vicar/wine distributor who has a daughter of marrying age because (in theory) the vicar might be able to get a discount/form a partnership to get the barrels he needs cheaper from his new son-in-law.

[Volk]

Ameline isn't married so all I really know is. . .

 

[C'kayah Polaali]

Gridanians probably marry more 'freely' between whatever there are for social classes, and probably at a younger age (all that forest for a young couple to go 'walking' in, so best to get the girls married before any potential baby bumps start to show), and is probably the more proverbial country-folk type weddings.

 

See, I wouldn't actually think this.

 

Keep in mind that before the Calamity, the Black Shroud was a far more dangerous place. The Gridanians kept the elementals wrath at bay through rituals, but you still wouldn't want to wander it alone.

 

If you play through the archer quests you're introduced to a fairly racist/classist Elezen. From the way the guild master talks about him, he's not a particularly unusual individual in that regard. This leads me to believe that classism is alive and well in Gridania, and that you'd see a lot of resistance to mixed race marriages there - especially between Elezen and non-Elezen.

[D'aito Kuji]

D'aito Kuji can hardly wrap her mind around eternal bonding or faithfulness to one partner.  It's just not the tradition of her culture.  While she tries to respect the choices of others, she does harbor some discriminatory attitudes towards Seekers who marry.

 

I've had her RP this discontent a few times and it's started some great conversations and discussions, usually with D'aito ending them by walking away shaking her head. To me, this is the fun of playing a character still deeply immersed in her traditions despite the fact that she ran away from her tribe to avoid the new Nuhn.

[Khadan]

I agree there, it seems like in Ishgard if a knight barges into a church and demands a wedding, the priest will probably go 'ha ha get out of my church you dirtbag' and that's the end of that. It may not be a full on theocracy but the church is clearly in charge of things politically and socially, if a priest says no you better have a really good reason to appeal that. And yea, saying 'ok fine screw this I'll go to another nation' in response would probably lead to 'cool, we don't recognize filthy outsider marriages so have fun playing pretend I guess'. Ishgard is not a fan of the whole personal freedom thing.

 

I don't think that's entirely accurate. I'll try not to go on a tangent here though the topic has been discussed at length, before, but Ishgard is actually a Theocratic nation with a Feudal system firmly in place. 

 

If a 'Knight' barged into a church demanding a wedding he'd probably be told to gtfo, sure, but if he went through the proper channels his status as a knight would probably grant him precedence over lower class requests for the same thing.

 

The main reason there's so many assassination attempts at Ishgardian weddings is, as stated before, that they are largely political. Nobility marries other nobility not really for love but for power, influence, money, and so on. The issue with this is when two houses get involved in that kind of union other houses lose out on that and sometimes they get a bit butthurt about such things; butthurt enough to hire a contract killer to stop the wedding because why the heck not? Beyond that, though, "personal freedom" seems to be still a thing in regards to one's ability to advance in society if Aymeric is any example. 

 

When it comes to marriages elsewhere well Ishgard's patron deity is Halone but they still recognize the Twelve (of which Halone is a part of; 1/12th or 8.33% a part of to be exact), so it stands to reason that an Eternal Bond held at the Sanctum of the Twelve, for example, would be just as legally recognized in Ishgard as anywhere else. They may not LIKE it especially if the couple fled Ishgard to do it and they happened to be nobility and married against the wishes of their houses etc, but then that's why we have assassins. =P

 

Anyway that's my mini rant about personal freedoms and Ishgard etc.

[Mae]

Gridanians probably marry more 'freely' between whatever there are for social classes, and probably at a younger age (all that forest for a young couple to go 'walking' in, so best to get the girls married before any potential baby bumps start to show), and is probably the more proverbial country-folk type weddings.

 

See, I wouldn't actually think this.

 

Keep in mind that before the Calamity, the Black Shroud was a far more dangerous place. The Gridanians kept the elementals wrath at bay through rituals, but you still wouldn't want to wander it alone.

 

If you play through the archer quests you're introduced to a fairly racist/classist Elezen. From the way the guild master talks about him, he's not a particularly unusual individual in that regard. This leads me to believe that classism is alive and well in Gridania, and that you'd see a lot of resistance to mixed race marriages there - especially between Elezen and non-Elezen.

Social classes (the 'poor', the 'workers', the 'merchants/artisans', and the 'elite'), not races, or whether or not someone is a local or not (Silvarre's arguments were racial and "outsiders can't understand our ways"). Gridania as it is now, there seems to not be much of a difference between the poor and the merchants, and there's not many in the elite class.

 

As for not wandering the Shroud... that's just about anywhere that's next to or in an untamed wilderness. Dangerous, but a couple of hormonal teenagers who want to go and discuss the differences between boys and girls will go and risk it if there isn't a handy haystack, barn, storage shed, or root cellar to use instead.

[111]

Ameline isn't married so all I really know is. . .

 

 

Hay gurl.

 

Let's make lesbian babies.