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Stupid Question: Vana'diel


Melphina

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So it has come to my attention several times that in FFXIV there is the concept of dimension hopping...I know it's a dumb idea, but would that be possible for say someone like our character from FFXI being caught in the swirling vortex that took them from Valkurm to Misareaux Coast (Or was it Lu'fais Meadows? I forget) to get sucked to Eorzea during the act of teleportation...

 

I know it's a dumb question and I plan to catch flak, but my character from FFXI was actually rather established in terms of RP'ing with my group of friends, and I'm having a severely tough time trying to read all of FFXIV's lore so that I don't mess up (Believe me, it's tough with school.) but if it doesn't make sense that's totally ok, I was just wondering if it's possible

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If there are any of the RPers left from early 1.0, we all remember the swarm of RPers that were trying to RP their FFXI characters in FFXIV. Back then, there was no lore that supported this and it was very frowned upon to even attempt it. Then 2 years later the Shantotto event goes and makes this happen.

 

So like most anything, there could be ways to make it work, and if the people you RP with don't mind it, then go right ahead. If you really want to do this, you can of course whip of some of the loose lore thanks to the events we've had with Gilgamesh, Lightning, and of course Shantotto. Also I don't know anything about this new FFXI crossover event that just started as I haven't done it yet. Just be prepared for most characters to assume your character is insane.

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The optimal would be just to make an FFXIV equivelant of your FFXI character. Like "How would my character be if he/she was born in THIS universe instead!", rather than going into dimensional transportation and such.

Yes, as seen, it -is- possible, however it is a rare occurance, and as mentioned above, it is frowned upon when people RP their FFXI character in FFXIV.

 

That said, you can do whatever you like, really. If those you RP with accept this idea of yours, then have fun with it. But there will be people who won't accept it - or will just ICly treat you as an insane person if you start talking about you coming from another world and such. :P

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While I can't say I know anyone IC or OOC who RPs as coming from FFXI, there are two threads on opinions on the matter.

 

(super old, then necroed) http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=888

 

(very strong opinions. Locked thread.) http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=12533

 

 

Personally, I would suggest against it because while the worlds may be connected, they have a staggering amount of differences. While a lot of things do match up (I've heard units of time and measurement are similar/the same), calling a Roegadyn a tail-less Galka or the like is a fast way to get some crazy looks IC and more likely, a lot of ignoring OOC.

 

As said above though, if you've got a group of friends who accept that, go for it! The concerns are only coming from a "I want to RP with ALL open-world RPers" perspective, which means it's pretty clamped down. (Similar issues would arise if say, a group of people were RPing as real-life people trapped in the game a la .Hack, SAO, Log Horizon, etc. It'd be a completely different, but not bad or wrong, setting to RP in.) Most, if not all of the people encountered ICly have been born on Hydaelyn. (Because who knows if Primals are born and some other exceptions)

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Per Enix lore, all the worlds in which everything happens in any Square Enix title (and apparently Disney animated title) exist connected by the same universe or parallel universes. There is a whole 999/Schroedinger's Cat appeal. The things that tie them together are the existence of crystals, warriors of light, and the very real struggle between light and darkness. Each world is very different but also very similar.

 

If you look at Dissidia, heroes and villains from all the different Final Fantasy worlds (including Shantotto) are pulled from their respective worlds to do battle.

In Kingdom hearts, the Disney worlds are accessible by space-ship.

 

In Bravely Default, we see the Warriors of Light traverse the boundaries of parallel worlds that are nearly identical to their own.

 

And then there is Lightning. At the behest of a goddess, Lightning existed within a plane that is both separate from all worlds and connected to all worlds.

 

 

In short, traveling from XI to XIV is not impossible, but it is something only a Warrior of Light, a being bordering godhood (O-hohohohoho!), or a being by the grace of a god can accomplish. Claiming your character has reached these levels or had that kind of interaction is incredibly reaching.

 

Afaik, only the Warriors of Light have ever "accidentally" fallen into the void and landed somewhere new. Because it's never purely coincidence- there is always a higher entity pulling the strings.

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Regardless of whether or not it's possible, I'd consider it to be one of those Occam's Razor things.

 

If the point of it is to just have an old character you once played available to play again, there's a simpler way to achieve that: making the character again within the setting.

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Afaik, only the Warriors of Light have ever "accidentally" fallen into the void and landed somewhere new. Because it's never purely coincidence- there is always a higher entity pulling the strings.

Unless your name is Gilgamesh, that is.

 

Gilgy qualifies as a superlative like Shantottohohohoho.

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Hey as long as you got homies that don't mind it, run it. You aint gonna have much fun trying placate a whole bunch of faceless people, that you may not RP with anyway. And if you do rp with those that would normally shun those ideas, then they don't need to know your all your characters info, keep it vague if you got to.

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Hey as long as you got homies that don't mind it, run it. You aint gonna have much fun trying placate a whole bunch of faceless people, that you may not RP with anyway. And if you do rp with those that would normally shun those ideas, then they don't need to know your all your characters info, keep it vague if you got to.

 

^Basically this. FFXIV is still a game to have fun in first. And even among "lore-abiding" RPers, there are always going to be disagreements then.

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Hey as long as you got homies that don't mind it, run it. You aint gonna have much fun trying placate a whole bunch of faceless people, that you may not RP with anyway. And if you do rp with those that would normally shun those ideas, then they don't need to know your all your characters info, keep it vague if you got to.

With tongue-and-cheek humor, the same could be said of Cannibalism. As long as your friends are okay with it, go for it. You don't have to do what everyone else likes and wants, but if you do have friends that don't like it, just don't tell them. It couldn't possibly come up and be a problem.

 

 

 

Will the idea still make you happy in spite of how others may treat you?

 

If the answer is yes, DO IT. DO IT NOW.

 

If the answer is no, it's time to jump into a brainstorm.

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Hey as long as you got homies that don't mind it, run it. You aint gonna have much fun trying placate a whole bunch of faceless people, that you may not RP with anyway. And if you do rp with those that would normally shun those ideas, then they don't need to know your all your characters info, keep it vague if you got to.

 

I wholeheartedly agree.

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Maybe it wouldn't be a very good idea, I was intending to get a character going, I'll just strike this one off my list, thanks for answering ^^

 

Atomos is another way one could connect the two worlds as Atomos is the same entity in both - a Voidsent being able to slip in and out of worlds, times, and dimensions in the pursuit of aether. In XI's Wings of the Goddess you only go through time, but hopping worlds is a possibility. Granted, there will still probably be some opposition to that plot, but I wanted to bring it up for reference if you're set on the idea.

 

All that said, there are a ton of parallels between Hydaelyn and Vana'diel. Perhaps if you wanted to share some background on your XI character we could help you with the lore for their XIV counterparts? ^^

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Although plausible, the more important question is... why?

 

What does being from Vana'diel add to your roleplay other that a difference that can't really be used by anyone else? Perhaps it's an interesting story to tell, but after the telling what can you do with it?

 

In fact being from Vana'diel only really limits you.

 

I don't see a reason for it other than wanting a special origin.

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Although plausible, the more important question is... why?

 

What does being from Vana'diel add to your roleplay other that a difference that can't really be used by anyone else? Perhaps it's an interesting story to tell, but after the telling what can you do with it?

 

In fact being from Vana'diel only really limits you.

 

I don't see a reason for it other than wanting a special origin.

This, very much.

 

I can understand wanting that sort of "flavour" to your character but other than that, I honestly don't think it'll affect your roleplay much.

 

Besides, I think it's fun taking a pre-existing character you had in one universe, and re-purposing them to fit in the universe you want to roleplay in. (Think Marvel mainstream 616 vs. Marvel ultimates 1610.)

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I mean, I wouldn't personally do something like bringing a character over from another world/universe or what have you. Sure, I like it in other forms of media like anime, for example. I dunno why, but that's always fascinated me. But when it comes to RP? I tend to find it's just better to keep things in-universe, even if they don't always make sense. It's part of the adventure, right?

 

It just sort of sticks in my craw when a character is blatantly just a copy from another game. Like I think I saw earlier in this thread, or in one of the other threads that was linked, it feels like poor storytelling to make a character seem interesting. In my early days of RP, I remember seeing someone who was RPing a hyur that was actually an asura from GW2, that had somehow found their way to Eorzea, and my first thought was, "Why not just go RP on GW2 instead?". Feels kinda disrespectful to the people that've taken the time and effort to build the world to the point it's gotten to, I guess?

 

And at the end of the day, does anyone ever take the crossover events as serious, canonical happens in the world? Especially with the fact that some events have found themselves repeated, it feels like it's more accurate to say it was just a fever dream of the WoL during the breaks from solving mysteries or saving the world - you know, casual WoL stuff.

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Honestly, saying something exists from some other FF game in FFXIV so it must exist is kind of really....I donno. All FF games do this.

There is an entire wiki that lists all of the FF game references in FFXIV.

 

Some of the obvious ones:

FF3 allusions in the Allagan backstory. Is FF3 the prequel to this game? No >>

Matoya and Matoya's cave is from FF1. Did she and her cave travel to Eorzea? Probably not.

Elidibus is a summoner in Tactics and he has the summon Zodiark. Did he suddenly decide to become an Ascian and appear in Eorzea and use his summon to destroy Hydaelyn? Prolly not.

Golden Saucer in VII

Magiteck from VI

Cloud of Darkness from 3 (first note)

....

The tactics gear from the 60 dungeons...

Everything in this link: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_XIV/Allusions

 

All FF games do this too. Not just FFXIV 

You can take it for what it is...but in my personal opinion, it'd be best to just remake the character FOR Eorzea...

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Honestly, saying something exists from some other FF game in FFXIV so it must exist is kind of really....I donno. All FF games do this.

There is an entire wiki that lists all of the FF game references in FFXIV.

 

Some of the obvious ones:

FF3 allusions in the Allagan backstory. Is FF3 the prequel to this game? No >>

Matoya and Matoya's cave is from FF1. Did she and her cave travel to Eorzea? Probably not.

Elidibus is a summoner in Tactics and he has the summon Zodiark. Did he suddenly decide to become an Ascian and appear in Eorzea and use his summon to destroy Hydaelyn? Prolly not.

Golden Saucer in VII

Magiteck from VI

Cloud of Darkness from 3 (first note)

....

The tactics gear from the 60 dungeons...

Everything in this link: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_XIV/Allusions

 

All FF games do this too. Not just FFXIV 

You can take it for what it is...but in my personal opinion, it'd be best to just remake the character FOR Eorzea...

Actually, Cloud of Darkness might be the same as FF3, just like Gilgamesh which is always the same in all games. But for the rest, they're probably different things.

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Honestly, saying something exists from some other FF game in FFXIV so it must exist is kind of really....I donno. All FF games do this.

There is an entire wiki that lists all of the FF game references in FFXIV.

 

Some of the obvious ones:

FF3 allusions in the Allagan backstory. Is FF3 the prequel to this game? No >>

Matoya and Matoya's cave is from FF1. Did she and her cave travel to Eorzea? Probably not.

Elidibus is a summoner in Tactics and he has the summon Zodiark. Did he suddenly decide to become an Ascian and appear in Eorzea and use his summon to destroy Hydaelyn? Prolly not.

Golden Saucer in VII

Magiteck from VI

Cloud of Darkness from 3 (first note)

....

The tactics gear from the 60 dungeons...

Everything in this link: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_XIV/Allusions

 

All FF games do this too. Not just FFXIV 

You can take it for what it is...but in my personal opinion, it'd be best to just remake the character FOR Eorzea...

Actually, Cloud of Darkness might be the same as FF3, just like Gilgamesh which is always the same in all games. But for the rest, they're probably different things.

My point is that there are plenty of things in FFXIV that are from other FF games but it doesn't mean that people from those games are just gonna randomly be coming in to Eorzea like Hey sup!

 

I did not play FFXI 'cause no PC and I didn't really grow up with internet anyways...but regardless of the story I think it's highly unlikely that they would end up in Eorzea.

 

Aaaah quick edit:

FF3 and 4 and tactics seem to have more in common with Eorzea stuff than FFXI outside of the face. A lot of the MMO core lore (time/spacial keeping, general race look--which was standard for more than just FFXI...a lot of game shave human-like, elf-like, animal-like, little people-like races--and what not)may have been from FFXI, but lore wise, it's not really connected. A lot of character models seem to be the same and some names (like xys is an upscaled version of abc)...but there's not much story impact from what I'm reading.

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Although plausible, the more important question is... why?

 

What does being from Vana'diel add to your roleplay other that a difference that can't really be used by anyone else? Perhaps it's an interesting story to tell, but after the telling what can you do with it?

 

In fact being from Vana'diel only really limits you.

 

I don't see a reason for it other than wanting a special origin.

It actually has little to do with a 'special origin' in the case of most people and the fact that some become very attached to their creations. As a writer who has roleplayed and written solo stories for some twenty three years, there are certain characters who have long histories that I move from world to world whenever possible because those characters have lives I've designed, and shared with others throughout many lifetimes. While it is possible to just make someone new to the setting with the same name based on them, it unfortunately loses a lot of the love and work that went into one's creation. The unfortunate thing is, a lot of people have your way of thinking that it's just 'something that can't be used by anyone else' or just a 'special origin story'.

 

The idea that everything different from what the lore bible thumpers is a 'special snowflake' is something I've seen that's very prevalent among the FFXIV mainstream roleplay crowd, and I see a lot of creativity and potential sacrificed because of it, with people forgetting roleplay is about fun and not living up to people's expectations of what they should be playing. But that's off topic, and I apologize.

 

The thing is, if I'd hypothetically played FFXI for x amount of years and become very close to my roleplay character, but say..a lot of my friends had left, or the server RP community had faded, but I didn't feel I was done with my character's story, and that they had more to do, and found out 'hey, these worlds can interconnect', I'd love to do such a thing, because it means my character could grow in a whole new way. Perhaps as a stranger in a strange land, trying to adapt. Perhaps they would think they'd died and were dreaming, only to find out later that they were wrong. There's so much potential there, and unfortunately too many people only see 'well you just want to be special, why not just roll here and settle like everyone else'?

 

Not everyone is everyone else, and their character's story may not be done yet in their view, regardless of whether the environment of their original game allows them to finish it. Roleplay is about fun, diversity, and creativity, not 'everyone the same origin story as everyone else'. I'm with the other gentleman (or lady?) a few posts above. If you want to do it, do it, because there is potential for it to happen, and it's not up to us to judge that they 'just want to be special'. It may just be that they love their character, and I'm just fine with that. But it isn't always just because someone want to be 'special' or 'different'. That's a broad brush to paint with, and it's not a good idea to put one's own standards or perceptions on the actions of others. Asking is more polite, and may even make you new friends.

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Honestly, saying something exists from some other FF game in FFXIV so it must exist is kind of really....I donno. All FF games do this.

There is an entire wiki that lists all of the FF game references in FFXIV.

 

Some of the obvious ones:

FF3 allusions in the Allagan backstory. Is FF3 the prequel to this game? No >>

Matoya and Matoya's cave is from FF1. Did she and her cave travel to Eorzea? Probably not.

Elidibus is a summoner in Tactics and he has the summon Zodiark. Did he suddenly decide to become an Ascian and appear in Eorzea and use his summon to destroy Hydaelyn? Prolly not.

Golden Saucer in VII

Magiteck from VI

Cloud of Darkness from 3 (first note)

....

The tactics gear from the 60 dungeons...

Everything in this link: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy_XIV/Allusions

 

All FF games do this too. Not just FFXIV 

You can take it for what it is...but in my personal opinion, it'd be best to just remake the character FOR Eorzea...

Actually, Cloud of Darkness might be the same as FF3, just like Gilgamesh which is always the same in all games. But for the rest, they're probably different things.

My point is that there are plenty of things in FFXIV that are from other FF games but it doesn't mean that people from those games are just gonna randomly be coming in to Eorzea like Hey sup!

 

I did not play FFXI 'cause no PC and I didn't really grow up with internet anyways...but regardless of the story I think it's highly unlikely that they would end up in Eorzea.

 

Aaaah quick edit:

FF3 and 4 and tactics seem to have more in common with Eorzea stuff than FFXI outside of the face. A lot of the MMO core lore (time/spacial keeping, general race look--which was standard for more than just FFXI...a lot of game shave human-like, elf-like, animal-like, little people-like races--and what not)may have been from FFXI, but lore wise, it's not really connected. A lot of character models seem to be the same and some names (like xys is an upscaled version of abc)...but there's not much story impact from what I'm reading.

 

The past, present, and future of the world of Hydaelyn may not be connected to the world of FFXI, but canonically they exist in the same network of universes that Shantotto is canonically able to traverse at will, as well as move others with her. Shantotto is a Black Mage but also pretty much the equivalent of a dimensional witch.

XI and XIV do not exist in the same universe, but Square Enix subscribes to the idea that all worlds ever created exist in a blob of universes. The IRL world, the Disney worlds, Narnia, the Final Fantasy worlds, the World of Warcraft worlds...basically these universes come into existence and become a part of the grand network of universes.

But some universes are harder to move between than others. The Warcraft universe and the FF14 universe are so entirely different that moving between them is near impossible. FF14 and FF11, and all the other FF worlds have so many fundamental similarities that someone like Shantotto can freely move between them.

Yes, technically Enix recycles ideas and iconizes them, but the very fact that the same deities and eidolons exist throughout the universes is a very sturdy bridge that allows dimensional travel.

 

If you want to get down to it, every videogame ever made (with the exception of direct sequels and expansions i.e Infamous/Infamous: Second Son) added a new universe to the web of universes, because someone wrote that world and its past, present, and future into existence.

 

Even more meta:

(insert stoner meme)

What if we are all ambient NPCs in a video game that a company in a world similar to ours made, and all the Hollywood stars are the RPers wish-fulfillment Mary-Sues?

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The past, present, and future of the world of Hydaelyn may not be connected to the world of FFXI, but canonically they exist in the same network of universes that Shantotto is canonically able to traverse at will, as well as move others with her. Shantotto is a Black Mage but also pretty much the equivalent of a dimensional witch.

XI and XIV do not exist in the same universe, but Square Enix subscribes to the idea that all worlds ever created exist in a blob of universes. The IRL world, the Disney worlds, Narnia, the Final Fantasy worlds, the World of Warcraft worlds...basically these universes come into existence and become a part of the grand network of universes.

But some universes are harder to move between than others. The Warcraft universe and the FF14 universe are so entirely different that moving between them is near impossible. FF14 and FF11, and all the other FF worlds have so many fundamental similarities that someone like Shantotto can freely move between them.

Yes, technically Enix recycles ideas and iconizes them, but the very fact that the same deities and eidolons exist throughout the universes is a very sturdy bridge that allows dimensional travel.

 

If you want to get down to it, every videogame ever made (with the exception of direct sequels and expansions i.e Infamous/Infamous: Second Son) added a new universe to the web of universes, because someone wrote that world and its past, present, and future into existence.

 

Even more meta:

(insert stoner meme)

What if we are all ambient NPCs in a video game that a company in a world similar to ours made, and all the Hollywood stars are the RPers wish-fulfillment Mary-Sues?

 

..That last point makes entirely too much sense. I think you've just caused an existential crisis for me.

 

But yes, from the way Enix describes their universe, the ease of travelling between Worlds in related to similarity. I've actually RP'd with someone who did this very, very well.  So well in fact they actually just thought they'd traveled to a new, undiscovered part of their -own- world (FFXII, for the curious.) The discovery of the traveling itself was a big RP plot, in fact. One thing to remember is -you- don't have to be the one to transport your character. It can be some higher power, for purposes either benign or malevolent. Perhaps you are in some powerful creature or mages way, but they're limited in how to dispose of you. Perhaps your deity favors you and saved your life by tossing you through a dimensional tear. Perhaps a trickster-esque entity was just bored and experimented with dimensional portals and you tripped through one. Or perhaps a war or some such tore open a whole in reality that just happened to open up in Eorzea. The traveling itself can be a side-effect of other events.

 

There are a lot of ways to do it. The Void supposedly exists in all FF worlds, in some form or another.

 

Be creative, and don't let 'expectations of how RP needs to be' ruin your fun. But on the same token, doing RP with an 'Outsider' character also has a higher difficulty setting to be done well.

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