Character Creation: Assessment and Critique

[Wymsical]

The word used was definitely closer to succubus.

 

Also, WoW changed their worgen after feedback!

 

They made them much, much worse!

[ProvaDiServo]

Not for nothing But 1.0 Models seemed more organic.

 

Like women had curves

 

>.>

It kinda bother's me why they went out of their way to completely remove that. Not everyone is built like a cutting board.

 

The problem in FF14 customization for me, is not anatomy, but it is their fashion and accessories.

 

I really just want freedom to wear what I want. I'm kinda getting sick of whomever is designing the monk gear, because they have a huge pirate fetish.

[Zyrusticae]

>.>

It kinda bother's me why they went out of their way to completely remove that. Not everyone is built like a cutting board.

And this, in a nutshell, is why we need body sliders. Or at least more sliders than just boobs.

 

And just for the record, they didn't actually change the body models, just the poses, which naturally affects how the body is presented (Miqo'te's idle stance in particular is very straight).

[ProvaDiServo]

>.>

It kinda bother's me why they went out of their way to completely remove that. Not everyone is built like a cutting board.

And this, in a nutshell, is why we need body sliders. Or at least more sliders than just boobs.

 

And just for the record, they didn't actually change the body models, just the poses, which naturally affects how the body is presented (Miqo'te's idle stance in particular is very straight).

 

Absolutely I think sliders are a must. but for me I'm happier this game is succeeding currently. I'll start hacking at their terrible model decisions once 4.0 hits I guess

 

One thing I can say is that their lack of color freedom is something that should go.

 

Also on the model issue:

 

Really? It always looked like they removed a slab of rear end from the ladies.

Edit :Thanks for the follow up Castille

[Warren Castille]

They straight up cut off everyone's asses.

 

Hello,

Lead designer Takeo Suzuki here.

 

We understand that you all care deeply for the detail and shape of your characters, and while the development team is really happy about this, we would like to keep the specifications for character’s butts as they are.

 

I’d like to explain a bit about why we changed the shape of character model’s butts. It all began when Yoshi-P and the character team sat down and reconsidered what should be prioritized for players when we moved from 1.0 to A Realm Reborn.

 

Based on this discussion it was decided to place emphasis on the below:

• New races (male Miqo’te, female Highlanders, and female Roegadyn.)

• Increase the amount of content and the amount of reward items (equipment and weapons)

(We want to make a team that can create more than four times the amount of rewards compared to what there was originally.)

 

As a result of thinking about what could be done to fulfill the above objectives all while converting everything over and optimizing all the data by completely remaking the graphics engine, we decided to reduce the cost by simplifying items that were too complex when making them. One aspect of this was the graphical display of waist equipment.

 

I deeply apologize for those of you who were really partial to what Miqo’tes looked like in 1.0, but this decision was made so we could relaunch with new races and a lot of new equipment. We will be implementing a wide variety of really cool looking equipment moving forward, and we appreciate your understanding on this.

[Zyrusticae]

Well, I stand corrected.

 

I would be curious to know just how much the change reduces their actual workload. If it's really that substantial a difference, then... well, I guess it's sort of justified? They have been cranking out a lot of gear models, after all.

[Warren Castille]

Well, I stand corrected.

 

I would be curious to know just how much the change reduces their actual workload. If it's really that substantial a difference, then... well, I guess it's sort of justified? They have been cranking out a lot of gear models, after all.

 

I think it's more specifically that people needed asses in 1.0 because belt equipment actually displayed on you. By removing that, they reduced the need for a butt while also reducing the amount of rendering each person required. That allowed for more detailed armor, I'm assuming.

 

Edit: Imagine a world where every belt needs to not-clip through Dreadwyrm or WoD bodies. I shiver to think of it.

[Naunet]

Right, so yea, there are a few games that have done or are doing customization a LOT deeper...but this isn't news here.  It wasn't during XI.  It wasn't during 1.0, 2.0 and it damn sure shouldn't have been come 3.0.  This is so old hat you could schedule prisoner feeding time around it.  

 

Genuinely stunned this is a thing/topic of conversation or consternation...but I guess some will bitch about anything...

 

It's stunning to you that something that has been a problem since day one, has gotten people complaining about it since day one, and has yet to see any improvement... stirs consternation??

 

I know what stuns me in this thread, and it's certainly not SE's lacking customization options. >_>

 

The fact of the matter is, players love to customize their characters. More tools to do so are always going to be a win in a lot of players' books. There's a reason MMO character creation has taken off so much since the WoW days (not a good MMO to point to as an excuse for FFXIV... that game is over a decade old): devs realized that players want to make their character their own.

 

Now in FFXIV, maybe sliders are too much given the limitations on certain consoles. But I don't think it's anywhere remotely out of touch to expect more than four face options, or more than four almost indiscernible adjustments to nose/jaw/mouth shapes, or for extra customization features that aren't restricted to certain face types, or for a muscle slider for all the dang races. Body type presets instead of body sliders. It is completely possible to work within the design laid out by FFXIV's current character creation tools and simply expand on them to have a set-up that's pretty respectable even though it doesn't have much in the way of sliders. 

 

That said, there's no "adjusting armor models" argument that is valid when it comes to face sliders. I presume they would cry "memory limitations" as they tend to.

[Zhavi]

 

 

That said, there's no "adjusting armor models" argument that is valid when it comes to face sliders. I presume they would cry "memory limitations" as they tend to.

 

Even if it wasn't sliders, having some greater variations in the nose/eyes/jawline options would be nice and would definitely help to create more distinct characters.

[Warren Castille]

I think a lot of the "apologizing" (my selection of word, not anyone else's) comes from the fact that, even in the face of all of the other challenges FFXIV met and exceeded at, people gripe about the one thing that didn't really "need" fixing. Creation works. It's got limited options, but compared to the colossal list of broken shit that needed to be remade or redone or reimagined, it feels like complaining about the color of the floormats in your brand new sports car.

 

It's also worth mentioning that XIV, like XI before it, had a lot larger problems to smooth out before vanity entered the picture.

[Melkire]

It's a question of limited resources, ultimately, and whether those resources would be better allotted in certain proportions to favor flexibility of customization or generation of new content.

 

Re: vanity, my God, I hope everyone else remembers the 2.0/2.1 days prior to glamour prisms. Tanks stuck in darklight tin cans, anyone? Armor of Light? You had to grind out capped myth or grind Coil for drops if you wanted to look good AND be effective?

[Warren Castille]

...I suppose assessment was foreshadowing.

[Naunet]

 

 

That said, there's no "adjusting armor models" argument that is valid when it comes to face sliders. I presume they would cry "memory limitations" as they tend to.

 

Even if it wasn't sliders, having some greater variations in the nose/eyes/jawline options would be nice and would definitely help to create more distinct characters.

 

Precisely the point I made in my post. :3

[Zyrusticae]

I think a lot of the "apologizing" (my selection of word, not anyone else's) comes from the fact that, even in the face of all of the other challenges FFXIV met and exceeded at, people gripe about the one thing that didn't really "need" fixing. Creation works. It's got limited options, but compared to the colossal list of broken shit that needed to be remade or redone or reimagined, it feels like complaining about the color of the floormats in your brand new sports car.

 

It's also worth mentioning that XIV, like XI before it, had a lot larger problems to smooth out before vanity entered the picture.

That makes sense.

 

If someone has a list of things they want FFXIV to have fixed that are very pressing and gameplay-related, of course someone complaining about character creation seems petty in comparison.

 

But on the flipside, the people complaining about character creation are likely content with the state of and direction of the game already, so the character creation jumps up to the top of their queue (people like myself, naturally). Or maybe the character creation has always been at the top of that person's queue but never gets addressed.

 

It's a question of limited resources, ultimately, and whether those resources would be better allotted in certain proportions to favor flexibility of customization or generation of new content.

 

Re: vanity, my God, I hope everyone else remembers the 2.0/2.1 days prior to glamour prisms. Tanks stuck in darklight tin cans, anyone? Armor of Light? You had to grind out capped myth or grind Coil for drops if you wanted to look good AND be effective?

And thank the gods at Squeenix for fixing that.

 

I actually quit the game over it. Temporarily, as it turns out. Phew! Dodged a bullet there.

[Naunet]

I think a lot of the "apologizing" (my selection of word, not anyone else's) comes from the fact that, even in the face of all of the other challenges FFXIV met and exceeded at, people gripe about the one thing that didn't really "need" fixing. Creation works. It's got limited options, but compared to the colossal list of broken shit that needed to be remade or redone or reimagined, it feels like complaining about the color of the floormats in your brand new sports car.

 

Ignoring the sports car analogy because arguing on the internet in analogies is quite possibly my least favorite thing ever.

 

A product doesn't just fix a bunch of bad stuff and then deem itself, "Eh, good enough! No more needs doing." There's not a whole lot in FFXIV that needs actual fixing except for its customization (both in character creation and in-game in the form of wardrobes, dyes, and costumes - these are actually some of the biggest reasons I no longer maintain a subscription to this game).

 

Consumers have an obligation to continue to press for improvements. A product is never perfect.

[Warren Castille]

And further improvements have come in the form of hair styles and the like. It's not a complete overhaul, but we can probably blame the PS3 for that. I'm not sure what else there is to concede; Yes, others do it better. No, XIV can't right now. They're giving us what they can, and I've got enough trust vested to wait to see what else comes down the pipe.

[Desu Nee]

Man, all this PS3 punching bag talk just reminds me when it came to my country, back in 2007, and it was absolutely the best thing ever, cutting edge graphics, to a point it took a while to get games. Nowadays, we talk about how much it's slowing FF14 down. I know, technology marches on and everything, all this just reminds me of when I was a kid and I thought GTA San Andreas looked perfect.

[Kage]

Re: vanity, my God, I hope everyone else remembers the 2.0/2.1 days prior to glamour prisms. Tanks stuck in darklight tin cans, anyone?

I happen to have actually enjoyed my days as a Lala-tin can.

 

 

I guess my issue is that i'm fairly satisfied in terms of my characters looks. I can certainly agree that there are something I'd like more (being able to choose which parts are dyed etc or that shared armor glamors suck so much).

 

However, while it is also great to discuss the topic with other people, what is the purpose of making the voice heard, here, specifically. Would it not actually be more useful to try and get the voice heard on Reddit or the official forums where the voices have better chances of not just being heard but also commented on?

[Naunet]

And further improvements have come in the form of hair styles and the like.

 

And the like?

 

Just hairstyles. A couple facepaints.

 

It wouldn't kill them to add to face options, to remove face restrictions on special features, or to increase eye/jaw/nose/mouth options. Harder would be body types, but I know that is also doable, too (have seen an MMO add them after the fact).

 

Yes, FFXIV CAN do better.

[Aaron]

Hello,

Lead designer Takeo Suzuki here.

 

We understand that you all care deeply for the detail and shape of your characters, and while the development team is really happy about this, we would like to keep the specifications for character’s butts as they are.

 

I’d like to explain a bit about why we changed the shape of character model’s butts. It all began when Yoshi-P and the character team sat down and reconsidered what should be prioritized for players when we moved from 1.0 to A Realm Reborn.

 

Based on this discussion it was decided to place emphasis on the below:

• New races (male Miqo’te, female Highlanders, and female Roegadyn.)

• Increase the amount of content and the amount of reward items (equipment and weapons)

(We want to make a team that can create more than four times the amount of rewards compared to what there was originally.)

 

As a result of thinking about what could be done to fulfill the above objectives all while converting everything over and optimizing all the data by completely remaking the graphics engine, we decided to reduce the cost by simplifying items that were too complex when making them. One aspect of this was the graphical display of waist equipment.

 

I deeply apologize for those of you who were really partial to what Miqo’tes looked like in 1.0, but this decision was made so we could relaunch with new races and a lot of new equipment. We will be implementing a wide variety of really cool looking equipment moving forward, and we appreciate your understanding on this.

This is f*cking beautiful. Lmaooooo! 

 

"we would like to keep the specifications for character’s butts as they are."

I bet he didn't say that with a straight face. I bet he didn't lololol.

 

I'm immature ATM but oh well I found this hilarious.

[Harmonixer]

If I'm guessing right this will be a very different title in a few years. Which, is a blanket statement of sorts but...

 

It seems like they have a lot in mind for this, it's just a matter of manpower and hardware. They are clearly ambitious and want this to grow and I have every reason to believe they will do it given the time needed.

 

It's fairing a lot better than other titles are, that's for sure.

 

I'm guessing the next installment after Heavensward is going to be system improvements, existing world expansion and mostly what will be called a 'filler' expansion, but actually work out better in the long run. Lots of lore, lots of quality of life changes but lacking in 'new' content.

[Kage]

... It is true...

 

Like, there's only a certain specific lalafell face that I can get Kage's goatee on. That's super annoying because sometimes I can't even tell or remember what it is. So it's like, where's the goatee? Hey this isn't long where'd it go?

 

Goatees on all faces please.

[Aaron]

 

 

I can't stop laughing lololol.

 

Omg OK I'm done here. . . I needed this laugh,

[Michikyou]

And further improvements have come in the form of hair styles and the like.

 

And the like?

 

Just hairstyles. A couple facepaints.

 

It wouldn't kill them to add to face options, to remove face restrictions on special features, or to increase eye/jaw/nose/mouth options. Harder would be body types, but I know that is also doable, too (have seen an MMO add them after the fact).

 

Yes, FFXIV CAN do better.

Well, yes they can. However you have to remember they have people dedicated to making hairstyles and outfits for the game part of the same team.

 

They dont just stop all the dungeon work to make aesthetics. Its why things come out slow. I personally think they are releasing enough for customization - sure, i'd love to see more cross-race hair options but to be honest? I'm more interested in the actual content of the game, not playing dress up.

 

Its a MMO, we as the roleplayers are the minority. They will cater to the players who pay to do all the content before us. Erry day.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

And further improvements have come in the form of hair styles and the like.

 

And the like?

 

Just hairstyles. A couple facepaints.

 

It wouldn't kill them to add to face options, to remove face restrictions on special features, or to increase eye/jaw/nose/mouth options. Harder would be body types, but I know that is also doable, too (have seen an MMO add them after the fact).

 

Yes, FFXIV CAN do better.

 

There was a dev post following up on those exact things. I think in either the body hair thread or one for highlander male eyebrows. The gist of the message was that the way they store all those other face options limits being able to expand them. They probably never intended to make more options, and designed the characters with a limited set of static options.

 

Could it be expanded? Yes. It would only require a complete re-importing and upgrade of whatever current method of storing character data is used. And increased network load, because they might have grouped some features together into a single option server-side, which would then need to have them split back up. I'm not one of their staff and can only speculate.

 

Or in the PS3's case, perhaps it loads all the basic face models into RAM and then copies them to render? It could actually be running out of memory to continue doing this. Or it might severly impact the game when some super-unique character runs by and the PS3 has to have an "oh shit" moment, load the files from a slow hard disk, render them, and get them on the screen in time. Accessing an HD is about as slow as stored memory can get for these things.Maybe SE decided they wanted a steadier framerate, so they reduced the number of possible combinations to accomodate that? Anyone playing on PS3 or a low-spec PC can probably attest to horrible lag and crashes when too many people show up. Now let's make that too many -different- people and make it worse.