Monogamous Miqo'te

[Duroga]

Hey everyone. This is my first post here, and I'm new to FF RP, so be gentle.

Me and my wife recently came back to the game (I played in the beta but quit for a while as I acclimatized to busy married life). 

We had already rolled Miquo'te and now we want to rp as a married couple as that would just be easier and more true to life. 

My question is if you guys think we could get by with RPing a monogamous couple. I already had started to develop my guy as a sort of rebel among the Miquo'te and thought it would be fun to play him as a person who just didn't like his own people's way of doing things, and kind of adopted the Hyur way of things during his time in Ul'dah (I'm saying he's from the Sagolii Desert) and convinced his lady crush to marry him, after the Hyur fashion, as she was also a Miquo'te disilusioned with her people's way of doing things.

What do you guys think?

 

 

 

 

 

 

((Mod note: edited to fix spelling in title. - Alothia))

[Aya]

Do not let stereotypes stand in your way, though they can enrich you RP!  Your idea is absolutely fine, and I don't think you will encounter any resistance to it

[Faye]

Just like in real life, there will always be plenty of people who deviate from their people's customs and social norms.

 

All you really need to consider is:

 

A. Have it make sense for your character(s)--since you've already established your character as a rebel, that seems to be covered

 

B. Realize other characters may find it strange IC (though given the amount of people already playing monogamous Miqo'te in game, perhaps they won't)

 

C. Be aware their tribe(s) will likely exile them. I don't think most tribal Miqo'te would take kindly to one of their own marrying into a monogamous life.

[Chris Ganale]

My main is a monogamous tribal outcast who's married to another (ie, different tribe) tribal outcast. Haven't ruffled any feathers so far.

[Masaki Moui]

Welcome and hello!

 

I second what Aya says. I play a Miqo'te in a small clan that deviates from the cultural norms as expressed in the lore. We don't really take any guff for it although expectations when people approach us can vary both IC and OOC. The Miqo'te lore has a lot to offer as a fictional culture and my partner and I choose to focus on those aspects of their culture that work for us and created a clan idea from that.

 

So I would encourage you to pursue your idea. Anything thoughtful and creative that respects the source material (even while deviating from it) can't be a bad thing.

[C'kayah Polaali]

While I'm firmly in the camp of "RP what you want, and it should be fine - especially if your RP is interesting", there's another possibility you might want to consider:

 

What if your Miqo'te weren't monogamous? What if they were bog-standard Miqo'te. I'm assuming they're Seekers, but it would also work well for Keepers with some re-jiggering of roles. The male might have opened up a hunting area (or rationalized the adventurer's life into saying he's basically a mobile hunting territory), and the female joined him there. The male would be the nunh, and the female would be the first in his breeding group.

 

That's fine and dandy right there.

 

There's no reason why your nunh would have to immediately go looking for more females. After all, many people go years as single adults. Why then should anyone look askance at a nunh who has one female in their breeding group and isn't in a particular hurry to find another?

 

You can draw a very rough parallel with mormon polygamists. Watch Big Love (which is fiction, of course, but it's not unrealistic fiction). Four of the main characters are a husband and wives in a polygamist family. They didn't all come along at the same time. For years it was simply the husband and one wife.

 

I think we're used to thinking of Miqo'te as being hypersexed and ever-eager to leap into big polygamous relationships, but that's probably more because of the behavior of players (especially a subset of the ones who play nunhs) than anything else.

[Oli!]

What if your Miqo'te weren't monogamous? What if they were bog-standard Miqo'te.

 

I'm assuming because this guy wants to have some nice, clean, no-creepers romantic RP with the wife.

 

That said, do what you want OP. It's not standard, so other tribal players might find it strange IC, but it's not a big issue.

[Chris Ganale]

I'm assuming because this guy wants to have some nice, clean, no-creepers romantic RP with the wife.

 

It sure is my reason.

[No Longer Exists]

Welcome back!

 

As to your post: There's nothing in the lore that specifically states that a Seeker must collect women once they become a nunh. In theory, like in a lion pride, if a cataclysmic event kills all but one male and one female, then they are in essence a singular coupling. I know it's not the best of examples, but it's fair to determine that a nunh could choose his mate and eschew the desire to grow his family further for the time being or even intentionally. Going further into that, as he has fulfilled his tribal duty in mating as a nunh; the tribe can only grumble about it if for some odd reason, they don't like it.

 

However, according to Lore, (if you're a lore-strict sort of person) your male child could challenge for nunh and take over as the "breeding male" and choose to collect moar women (or men)

 

There's some confusion in the Seeker lore about mating and families. There is nothing that states that a nunh must have more than one wife, but it has alluded to the other nunh's determining their own social heirarchy by the size of their families and sometimes by the volume and strength of their womenfolk.

[Sin]

My tribal Seeker would give your character -so- much shit for turning back on the traditions of your people.

 

All IC, of course.

 

Rock on man, do what you want.

[Mia Moui]

I'm sure my Keeper Miqo'te would roll her eyes and disagree over anything Seekers do.  

 

I don't think she'd understand how other Miqo'te could be monogamous, especially other Keepers but it's not a completely foreign concept.  Almost all of Eorzea seems to be into it.  In her own way, Mia Moui would come off as strange to other Keepers as she isn't with her family.

 

There's always the "city Miqo'te" route, not every Miqo'te is from a family clan or a tribe.

[Ilwe'ran]

Actually, knowing that the Miqo'te are in Eorzea since long now and thus have been bathed in the other races' cultures, monogamy might not even look weird to them. The polygamous aspect of the Miqo'te's life is only a matter of survival, not of feeling.

Now there are many situations which seems completely legit to me for a miqo'te to be monogamous and only one which is completely impossible popping in my mind : If he's a Nunh as breeding for the Tribe's survival is part of the Nunh's duty. Thus, I believe that for a Tia or a Keeper (Keepers lifestyle allowing a male to settle with one female easily) it would actually not be that surprising at all.

The only question might be regarding the wedding tradition. I don't think there is such a thing between miqo'te, maybe some ceremonies around breeding and fertility to increase the chances of birthing a male, but nothing looking like a bonding. While having your miqo'te being monogamous seems to be completely normal and legit to me, maybe people would be surprised more by the actual bonding than anything else.

[kamikrazy]

For some reason it feels like polygamy is something miqo'te do in their tribes/families, without that, it doesn't seem like it would be something they felt like they HAD to do. Not sure why I believe that.

[Teadrinker]

This is totally plausible.

 

They're "city cats" as people here are wont to call them. Perhaps they fell in love and ran away to get away from being unable to be together. Write their backstories! Maybe he trained her to shoot or hunt. Maybe she saved him from the Sandworms and he was never cut out to be Nunh. Get creative. Have fun with it!

 

Enjoy the time with the misses.

[Mia Moui]

I've been thinking about this a little more and there's a biological situation with Miqo'te that's hard to ignore.  Unless a female Miqo'te is willing to become monogamous and have mixed-race children (something the lore suggests is very frowned upon), Miqo'te would rapidly become extinct if the precious few males that existed chose to become monogamous. 

 

I feel like for both Seekers and Keepers, regardless of how they feel about culture or how integrated they've become, the issue of reproduction and the very limited stock of males would need to be addressed.  Obviously, one only needs a single male to propagate an entire species.  Even so, I think that Miqo'te females could be monogamous if they want, but Miqo'te males wouldn't be encouraged to be so.  

 

If the birthrate is something like 20 or 30 to 1, monogamy would quickly exhaust the supply of Miqo'te males.  If something like that were happening in our society, monogamy would seem like an extremely selfish choice, perhaps a choice that's simply not allowed.

 

But if relationship/romantic monogamy was what was being prized, then it may not matter.  Reproduction would be more akin to duty, not something that invites romance or long-term relationships.  This way a Hyur and a Miqo'te could be eternally bonded but if they wanted children, the female would make it known (however Seekers or Keepers let males know they're ready for that).  This avoids the problem of mixed race offspring (which again, the lore suggests his highly frowned upon).

 

I know that lots of people play Miqo'te as though they are Hyur with cat ears but the cold fact of their reproductive biology suggests that reproductive monogamy simply isn't feasible.  I imagine that such a problem would invite all kinds of exciting drama in an otherwise emotionally/romantic monogamous relationship.

 

The simplest solution is polyamory but that word suggests love and I think that's a little strong.  Reproductive surrogate might be closer to the role a male Miqo'te would have to play, regardless of their emotional/romantic status.

[Teadrinker]

I've been thinking about this a little more and there's a biological situation with Miqo'te that's hard to ignore.  Unless a female Miqo'te is willing to become monogamous and have mixed-race children (something the lore suggests is very frowned upon), Miqo'te would rapidly become extinct if the precious few males that existed chose to become monogamous. 

 

I feel like for both Seekers and Keepers, regardless of how they feel about culture or how integrated they've become, the issue of reproduction and the very limited stock of males would need to be addressed.  Obviously, one only needs a single male to propagate an entire species.  Even so, I think that Miqo'te females could be monogamous if they want, but Miqo'te males wouldn't be encouraged to be so.  

 

If the birthrate is something like 20 or 30 to 1, monogamy would quickly exhaust the supply of Miqo'te males.  If something like that were happening in our society, monogamy would seem like an extremely selfish choice, perhaps a choice that's simply not allowed.

 

But if relationship/romantic monogamy was what was being prized, then it may not matter.  Reproduction would be more akin to duty, not something that invites romance or long-term relationships.  This way a Hyur and a Miqo'te could be eternally bonded but if they wanted children, the female would make it known (however Seekers or Keepers let males know they're ready for that).  This avoids the problem of mixed race offspring (which again, the lore suggests his highly frowned upon).

 

I know that lots of people play Miqo'te as though they are Hyur with cat ears but the cold fact of their reproductive biology suggests that reproductive monogamy simply isn't feasible.  I imagine that such a problem would invite all kinds of exciting drama in an otherwise emotionally/romantic monogamous relationship.

 

The simplest solution is polyamory but that word suggests love and I think that's a little strong.  Reproductive surrogate might be closer to the role a male Miqo'te would have to play, regardless of their emotional/romantic status.

 

Mathematically, you are correct.

 

People aren't going to play that way though and trying to force them to is not a battle you want to undertake.

 

Since it's been suggested mixed breeds are now possible, even really weird ones that we have UTTERLY no visual base for like Miqo/Aura or Roe/Lala ... It's pretty much taken these kinds of arguments out behind the shed.

 

Personally, I roll my eyes a little when I see really exotic pregnant couples wandering around but it's not lorebreaking. It makes a whole lot more sense for the females of both tribes to be city cats and not males but that's not gonna stop you from seeing Ul'dah populated with Nunhs.

 

It's just the way it is. Can't change it and you're not gonna have much fun if you focus on it too much.

[SessionZero]

IIRC, male Miqo'te weren't playable in 1.0 because they were supposed to be exceedingly rare (in lore anyway, mechanically it was probably because lolzMithra) so it was only ever the females that went out to do adventuring and the like. So, adhering strictly to lore, yeah, monogamous relationships don't work.

 

In reality Miqo'te are the most populous race with catboys probably making up, at the very least, half of that overall percentage, so. At this point trying to justify or argue against anything Miqo'te do with "but it's the lore" is akin to bashing your head against a brick wall to get to the pie on the other side. Could it eventually work? In theory. But you're gonna have massive brain damage and head trauma before you ever get to that point.

[Alothia]

I play a Keeper Miqo'te who is monogamous, and I went the city cat route, mostly because when I started playing in 1.0, we didn't have the depth of lore that we have now.

 

I've actually worked it into her backstory that it isn't her who shirked the tribe's traditions, but her parents. They wanted to be monogamous, so they left their tribe and integrated into a small village out in the Shroud. It's also why my character doesn't fit the naming conventions.

 

There's a lot you can do with the lore that will make your characters be the type of characters you want them to be. Be prepared to hear some IC backlash from people who do play traditional characters. But as long as you have a good reasoning, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

Most players are very understanding. It's their characters that may not be. But that leads to good RP times!

 

Anywho, if you ever want to talk over ideas, feel free to post here or let me know in a PM or whatever.

[Mia Moui]

I've been thinking about this a little more and there's a biological situation with Miqo'te that's hard to ignore.  Unless a female Miqo'te is willing to become monogamous and have mixed-race children (something the lore suggests is very frowned upon), Miqo'te would rapidly become extinct if the precious few males that existed chose to become monogamous. 

 

I feel like for both Seekers and Keepers, regardless of how they feel about culture or how integrated they've become, the issue of reproduction and the very limited stock of males would need to be addressed.  Obviously, one only needs a single male to propagate an entire species.  Even so, I think that Miqo'te females could be monogamous if they want, but Miqo'te males wouldn't be encouraged to be so.  

 

If the birthrate is something like 20 or 30 to 1, monogamy would quickly exhaust the supply of Miqo'te males.  If something like that were happening in our society, monogamy would seem like an extremely selfish choice, perhaps a choice that's simply not allowed.

 

But if relationship/romantic monogamy was what was being prized, then it may not matter.  Reproduction would be more akin to duty, not something that invites romance or long-term relationships.  This way a Hyur and a Miqo'te could be eternally bonded but if they wanted children, the female would make it known (however Seekers or Keepers let males know they're ready for that).  This avoids the problem of mixed race offspring (which again, the lore suggests his highly frowned upon).

 

I know that lots of people play Miqo'te as though they are Hyur with cat ears but the cold fact of their reproductive biology suggests that reproductive monogamy simply isn't feasible.  I imagine that such a problem would invite all kinds of exciting drama in an otherwise emotionally/romantic monogamous relationship.

 

The simplest solution is polyamory but that word suggests love and I think that's a little strong.  Reproductive surrogate might be closer to the role a male Miqo'te would have to play, regardless of their emotional/romantic status.

 

Mathematically, you are correct.

 

People aren't going to play that way though and trying to force them to is not a battle you want to undertake.

 

Since it's been suggested mixed breeds are now possible, even really weird ones that we have UTTERLY no visual base for like Miqo/Aura or Roe/Lala ... It's pretty much taken these kinds of arguments out behind the shed.

 

Personally, I roll my eyes a little when I see really exotic pregnant couples wandering around but it's not lorebreaking. It makes a whole lot more sense for the females of both tribes to be city cats and not males but that's not gonna stop you from seeing Ul'dah populated with Nunhs.

 

It's just the way it is. Can't change it and you're not gonna have much fun if you focus on it too much.

 

 

Unless the fun comes from trying to stick within the lore as much as possible and choosing to play with others who feel similarly. 

 

This isn't about trying to control the RP of others.  I can't stop people from playing as though they are vampire zombie aliens from another dimension.  I just wouldn't be likely to play with them, at least not on a IC basis.  I'll dungeon and raid with anyone, anytime.

 

But having lurked here for weeks before starting to play the game, it seems like every time something like this comes up, others get on to defend their right or anyone else's right to play how they want.  The problem is, no one is telling them not to play a certain way.  It's usually someone asking about how or if one thing can or cannot be done within the lore of the world.  It's up to the player to decide if they'll go along with it or not.  No one is taking away someone's freedom or suggesting or demanding that other players should change.

 

I like the lore.  I like to play within the confines because it makes me become more creative to do what I want within the limitations. My entire commentary was about what would almost certainly have to be the case if someone WAS going to stick to the lore.  If a player doesn't want to, go ahead and be the Eorzean version of Batman, I don't care.

 

I play this game because I like the world, the lore, the characters, the story.  I like to weave my own story along with it.  I don't start with my character first.  I start with the world and try to think about what influence it would have on my character. Then I tell my character's story with those influences in mind.  Just like real life, my characters are bound to their world, it's history and their own past.

 

I'm not and would never ask anyone else to do the same.

[No Longer Exists]

Everyone has very good points either on the lore or on the feelings behind the lore. Kudos to you all for that.

 

That's all I wanted to say, good on ya.

 

-Hatter

[Eses Fafa]

Monogamy just feels less wrong in general. Miqo'te stories are pretty messed up as it is, but I never played Seeker since Tia's and Nunhs were something I could never RP out by being either, and being part of one of 24 harems is out of the question..especially considering the copious amounts of inbreeding that must make for regardless of swapping females in tribes.

 

As for my Keeper, I find it better to be in a family rather than a tribe. It'd take a special kind of twisted for me to play a character whose beliefs would make me genuinely sick. So rather than play a member of a reclusive clan, I make a member of the clan that has values that don't make me cringe whenever I play them.

[Faye]

It's fine to role-play concepts that you do not endorse OOC. It doesn't, and shouldn't, reflect on who you are as a person. I'm not saying anyone should force themselves to role-play something that they are legitimately uncomfortable with; just tossing in a reminder that this is all fiction and it's a general rule of RP etiquette to keep a certain distance from your RP characters.

[Arrelaine]

Arry is monogamous solely because she's a complete selfish princess and likes all the attention for herself. Polyamory doesn't fit with her personality, though if she were a Seeker I think her personality and love relationship might play out a bit differently. Her parents weren't monogamous, though her mother became infatuated with her father and only had Arry, since her father rarely came around as he traveled with a merchant caravan. She has at least one half-sister and who knows how many others by her father.

 

Arry and her mother's side are city kitties, essentially, but her father is more wild kitty.

[Val]

Val is monogamous only because of Faye. Originally, he didn't want to do it at all and fussed and argued with her. But then he realized "Hey I can tell her I'll be monogamous and sleep with her and then bail." Only he then realized he really enjoyed having a hot, rich woman to buy him everything he wanted.

 

That lifestyle doesn't necessarily fit with Seeker culture and I've played Val's manwhore attitude into his past: his tribe punished him often, especially his father, and he was constantly ridiculed for it to the point of being kicked out of his tribe. I've played it that they are to respect their women and not treat them like objects, whereas Val does precisely the opposite.

 

Anyway, there are ways to make it work. Val still struggles with it from time to time to the point that he gets uncomfortable with being alone with an attractive lady because he doesn't much trust himself. And even if he isn't particularly fond of monogamy, he has to admit the perks that come with his situation are pretty nice.

[Branson Thorne]

Let all the Nunhs knock you up, get called a whore.

Become monogamous, criticized for breaking the lore.

 

*sigh*

 

You never can win on the internet.