Hingan and Doman Language

[Nero]

Alright, ladies and gents, here's a fun topic.

 

I recently did a bit of research into this particular topic to establish conclusively (short of getting an official answer from Koji or Square Enix) whether or not "Hingan" or "Doman" exist as a separate language, and whether speaking Hingan or Doman could be considered lore-friendly. For some reason, this seems to be a contested topic, so hopefully these findings will shed a bit of much-needed light. My intention here isn't to spark debate as much as it is to present what available evidence (or lack thereof) exists and open it to interpretation.

 

TL;DR: The concept of “Hingan” and “Doman” languages most likely exists only as a localisation tool, primarily to explain Japanese terms to non-Japanese speakers and to thinly justify why there are Japanese words in the non-Japanese versions of FFXIV. There is no mention made of a different alphabet, grammar, system of writing, or sentence structure; only rudimentary vocabulary swaps. It’s highly unlikely that Square Enix intended or intends for “Hingan” or “Doman” to be a full-fledged language existing in the FFXIV universe.

 

TL;DR 2: Do whatever you want as long as you're not hurting anyone or forcing them to do something against their will. It's just internet pretend fun-times, who cares.

 

Firstly, there exist numerous references in-game to the existence of a “Hingan tongue” or “Doman tongue”, in the English version of the game only.

 

“An excellent proposal…or as I believe the Hingans say' date=' “keikaku.” I dabbled a bit in the language when I was younger but for the life of me that ebon-haired emissary would not afford me even a sidelong glan─” [/quote']

“Yes' date=' and I speak fluent Hingan. Come on, there’s no point putting this off!”[/quote']

(When I asked Kotokaze what “Namazu” meant' date=' she said it was Hingan for catfish. And there I was thinking she’d said “fisherman”!) [/quote']

Bunshin-no-jutsu─so we call it in the Hingan tongue. Mirrors' date=' and mirrors of mirrors─in a matter of moments, my few loyal men appeared from afar to be a legion.[/quote']

The key to the dish is the broth' date=' called dashi, which as far as I can decipher means “exit juice.” I’m, er, sure it sounds more appetizing in the Doman tongue. The peculiarities of language aside, dashi is made by boiling dried fish, and it’s supposed to be the base for many Far Eastern dishes.[/quote']

Your pronunciation of the Doman language seems to have satisfied Byakubu, who grants you passage into the ninja hideout.

 

Et cetera. There a few other inklings, but these are a few of the most prominent examples, and by themselves, hints pretty clearly at "Doman" and "Hingan" existing as distinct, separate languages with completely different alphabets.

 

That said, there are conclusively no direct references to a modern Hingan or Doman language in the Japanese, French, or German versions of the dialogue. There are, at most, one or two vague references.

 

In the instances where Japanese words are translated in other versions, translation is either glossed over or, in one particular case in the French version, is equated to a phrase in “en langue commune” (the common language”).

 

In other instances (specifically the French and German versions), reference is made to the “ancient language” i.e. Ancient Hingan, same as the English version.

 

In the Japanese and German versions, there are no references made to any differing languages. There are no translations or references to translations in the Japanese version at all, unless it’s in reference to a fictional, dead language (such as the Nymian language).

 

In the German version specifically, translations of Japanese words are explained with no reference to Hingan or Doman. At best, it's explained in the manner of "this is what people call this thing, and it means this".

 

There is exactly one instance in the French version where the following phrase is uttered by a Hingan:

 

Vous, là! Vous parlez la même langue que moi? (You, there! You speak the same language as me?)

 

Some might assert that Hingan/Doman exists because of names. For example, “Yatsurugi no Yuki”, “Ame no Murakamo” (Susano’s sword), whatever the name of Zenos’ sword is which I can’t remember off the top of my head, etc. “no” is a Japanese possessive particle (that can function as a preposition or modifier), therefore Japanese exists, right?

 

The problem with that is the implications.

 

Does French exist on Hydaelyn because Elezen names use “de” (such as “Haurchefant de Fortemps”), and “de” is a French preposition denoting “of”?

 

Does German exist on Hydaelyn because an NPC is named “Baron von Quiveron III Esquire” exists in-game, and “von” is a German preposition also denoting “of”?

 

If “Yatsurugi no Yuki” implies the existence of modern Japanese, then “Haurchefant de Fortemps” (and similar names) must, by the same logic, clearly implicate the existence of an in-universe French, and Baron von Quiveron implicates the existence of an in-universe German.

 

So with that, on to some questions.

 

• 1). If Square Enix genuinely intended for Hingan and Doman languages to formally exist in-universe, why is there little to no mention of them in other localisations of the game, and no mention in the base JP?
   
  
• 2).What language do Hingans and Domans speak in the Japanese version of the game?
   
  
• 3).Why don’t any of the Domans or Hingans speak Doman or Hingan to each other when they’re in private and not around any foreigners?
   
  
• 4). Why does everyone speak the same language even to characters who don't have the Echo?

--

 

Conclusion: “Hingan tongue” and “Doman tongue” are phrases that are used purely to explain Japanese terms to non-Japanese speakers, and are mentioned only in the English version; if this was not the case, then they would have been mentioned in the other versions of the game dialogue. It is highly unlikely that these terms were intended to formally establish the existence of a modern Hingan or Doman language that is used in every-day life, hence why Doman is described as a “dialect” of common Hyur language in the lore book.

 

These dialects exist only as vocabulary swaps; ijin instead of foreigner, koban instead of coin, aibou instead of partner, etc. There are no grammar rules, sentence structures, or any other significant differences that formally establish the presence of a full-fledged language. It's basically a way to justify those fun word swaps and teach the non-JP people some esoteric Japanese words.

 

In the English version, “Ancient Hingan” is formally established to exist and is implied to form the basis of the vocabulary swaps. Otherwise, no mention is made of it.

 

--

 

Like I said, don't take this as a condemnation of any sort; you do what you want. Anybody who wants to roleplay speaking Japanese as Hingan or Doman has, is, and will always be free to do so, and lore-policing is a no-no! (unless specifically asked for). More power to you!

[Nero]

And as a slightly less controversial follow-up, here are a bunch of Hingan words!

 

ijin - “Foreigner”. Can be used both politely or rudely.

 

koban - Money. This is the term Hingans use instead of “gil”.

 

I speak only the truth. A truth that all can see─all save this two-koban rag merchant, and the amateur aesthetes who waste their coin on a clumsy child who hides her shameful lack of skill with gaudy, uncultured garb.

What are you selling? I have a few koban stashed away, if you will accept them. ...What is wrong? Why do you hesitate? You are a merchant, are you not?

Thanks to you meeting with the chief, not only did I receive a generous sum of koban but I think I may have even moved up a few pegs in the Confederacy.

While the thing may have cost me a fortune, I do not regret a single koban I spent on it. This rock has proven to me that I have what it takes to protect my people and my village, and that I need nothing more than my two arms and legs to do it.

 

bakufu - The Hingan military government.

 

bugyo - Magistrate or Governor. Used in reference to the lord bugyo who rules Kugane.

 

sensei - “Master”. This term is extremely uncommon; it is only used once in the entire game. The generic term “Master” is used far more frequently (such as “Master Musosai”).

 

There you are! I was beginning to wonder if you hadn't been eaten by the hoverflies on your way here! But I jest. Jannequinard tells me that you are quite the authority on all things relating the Bole. So enlighten me, oh, honorable sensei. I am, as you westerners say, all eyes...or was it ears?

 

kami - used as a generic substitute for “gods”. (”Kami preserve us”, etc.). In a religious sense, used to refer to the spirits that reside in precious items and treasures, as well as nature.

 

aibou - Generally, can be translated to “partner” or “buddy”, and can be used to refer to a close working relationship as “partner” (such as a detective and deputy). Reno and Rude from Final Fantasy 7 are an example of partners or “aibou”. In the Japanese version, Estinien calls the Warrior of Light “aibou” as well.

 

Who knows─we may even come to call one another “aibou”, as the Hingans do. 'Tis a most deep and meaningful word, aibou─some translate it as “friend,” but I think it better not to even bother trying, so unique and quintessentially Hingan the concept is...

 

keikaku - More than likely this is nothing more than a meme reference (as localisation often is). Still. It means plan.

 

An excellent proposal...or as I believe the Hingans say, “keikaku.” I dabbled a bit in the language when I was younger but for the life of me that ebon-haired emissary would not afford me even a sidelong glan─

 

geiko - A skilled female entertainer. Modestly dressed, they engage in poetry, music, and dancing.

 

tamahagane - Can be translated as “jewel steel”. In-game terminology is “Doman steel”. Tamahagane is symbolically significant in Hingan culture, most likely as the traditional material used to make katanas.

 

onsen - A natural hot spring used for bathing.

 

onmyoji - A priest (or more accurately, a diviner or cosmologist, but it seems to be interchangeable). Implied to be Hingan of origin. Onmyoji may use forbidden blood rituals to summon shikigami: restless spirits.

[Aysun]

The idea of the actual languages existing, Doman and Hingan in particular, is fully supported by the English translation. Therefore, that's what I go with. Because I play the English version, Eorzean seems based in English (see your map, 'no entry' signs, etc - I don't believe those change when you change translation of the game!), and of course, I RP in English.

 

Plus there's things like this:

 

 

Random fancy squiggles and not evidence of an actual language that is still used? It is definitely different than Eorzean script.

[Nero]

I've been critical of Square Enix's world building before, yet while I don't particularly debate whether it does or doesn't exist, it's just weird to me how shy they seem to be of establishing it, like having a character speak a single sentence in the language. It'd do away with basically all of the divisiveness.

 

I mean, it definitely doesn't exist in the Japanese version (since everything in the Japanese version is...Japanese anyway), but the English localizers really couldn't have found a way to make it less ambiguous? Say a sentence! Have two characters speak the language! There's no need to skirt around it.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

The kanji-esque character do appear to be some form of written language, likely aesthetically based off kanji. I remember a NPC blurb about one that specifically meant "Doma."

 

However, I don't think the languages themselves are exactly full-fledged anymore, much like how we're given the Roegadyn language. We have a handful of words that have been mixed into the common, but not really much of a sense of grammar or syntax, which are requirements for a language to well...be a language. If it can't stand on its own without hinging on "common," then it probably is more of somethign that slowly died out over the ages. Otherwise, I'd expect that we'd see far more of it, especially in placed like Sui no Sato, which is pretty cut off from the rest of civilization.

 

For me, I'm fine with using terms and substituting common words when it's something I think the people RPing with me would appreciate. I'd personally hold off on translating full phrases or sentences, as we don't really see evidence of that happening in game. (And google translation tends to not make the greatest grammar or word agreement. It makes a decent dictionary and translator for phrases.)

[Kilieit]

It's worth noting that the lore book states that Eastern cultures developed completely independently until the Magitek revolution permitted travel across the previously impenetrable mountain range that separates Othard from Ilsabard. It's likely that "Eorzean" (officially "the common tongue of the Hyur") wasn't introduced in the East until that time.

 

Which is still a good few years ago, long enough that younger characters wouldn't remember a time before it - and longer ago than Doma's original annexation, certainly - but it's not exactly centuries ago.

[Wemrys]

It stands to note that the Japanese version of the game has the Doman/Hingan characters speak in a different, older dialect of the Japanese language. This was noted as far back as the first Ninja quests by a friend of mine who plays the game in Japanese. Essentially the Japanese version of the game assumes all "languages" are just different forms of Japanese. This is also likely the reason for the possible translation error in the lore book which refers to Domans speaking in a different "dialect" rather than a different language altogether, which has now been contradicted by the lines posted above.

 

For all intents and purposes I am inclined to think Hingan and Doman are both actual and presently used languages within the localization. The reasoning behind everyone speaking the common tongue is fairly simple...in Kugane it's a foreign port, the common tongue would be incredibly useful. In Garlean-occupied Othard the common tongue would be taught and spread as a means of gentrification of the region (we see the scene where young Yotsuyu's mother wants her other child to have the best in Garlean education for example). That and on an out of universe level the English language, though diverse, doesn't exactly have a similar version of 'dialects' like the Japanese language does so it made sense to change it from simply a dialect to a full-blown language.

[Valence]

The idea of the actual languages existing, Doman and Hingan in particular, is fully supported by the English translation. Therefore, that's what I go with. Because I play the English version, Eorzean seems based in English (see your map, 'no entry' signs, etc - I don't believe those change when you change translation of the game!), and of course, I RP in English.

 

Of course, they aren't going to redesign all the game textures so that every localization gets their signs translated as well.

 

I know some oddballs like Blizzard do because they have huge wallets and a strong policy of detail over localization, but that's far from being the rule, and neither in cinema.

 

Also, if we went by the rule "I play in english so everything said literally or ambiguously in english is therefore true to my lore", I don't know then. A few months ago I started a thread to investigate if the "Gem of Shattoto" as referred to in the english version is one and only or refer to a type of jewel where there is many/several. I had to go dig in the french translation (which is always, always more literal even if cheesy), to see that it's the second option. Had I gone with the rule "the english translation is my only compass, the rest is irrelevant", then I would have taken the opposite conclusion that there is only one damn BLM soulstone in the lore.

 

Which sounds a bit like saying there is a mistake or something ambiguous in the english loc, but it's true even if in contradiction with the rest. It would be like saying the various typos and contradictory mistakes in the english lorebook should be ignored.

 

 

EDIT: if anything, my current take on the matter is similar to the OP. Hingan, Doman, Sea Wolf and whatnot, are all ancient (or less ancient) languages that have faded off progressively to make way to the common tongue. It's a bit like the Galactic Basic in Star Wars to my eyes. And yes, I still believe that Hingan is probably spoken plenly as Hingan in the reclusive islands of Hingashi, out of ijin's ears range though.

[Gegenji]

And as a slightly less controversial follow-up, here are a bunch of Hingan words!

 

Funny thing is... just having a few other words in and of itself doesn't mean it's a whole new language. Different dialects of the same language could use different terms. See the British English's "rubber" for "eraser." These could also extend to slang terms for various occupations as well.

 

Next up, currency. Are we sure that koban and gil are the same thing and not just different currencies for the different locations? After all, we have the American dollar versus the English pound - to again make that comparison. Maybe the reason everything in Othard seems so pricey is because the gil is weak over there compared to the koban! :lol:

 

And, as a third musing point: kami and other religious terms. Those, again, could be specific to that religion and not be a local language thing. Allah is still Allah to Muslims no matter where they are, and the Jewish faith has rabbis instead of priests.

 

A few unique phrases and terms does not a new language make. The wall scrolls and the like with the completely different language, however, are stronger suggestions that there might be another language at play. Even if it's fallen into disuse and it's merely certain terms have just held on into the modern Hingan/Doman dialect of the "common" spoken language.

[Aysun]

The idea of the actual languages existing, Doman and Hingan in particular, is fully supported by the English translation. Therefore, that's what I go with. Because I play the English version, Eorzean seems based in English (see your map, 'no entry' signs, etc - I don't believe those change when you change translation of the game!), and of course, I RP in English.

 

Of course, they aren't going to redesign all the game textures so that every localization gets their signs translated as well.

 

I know some oddballs like Blizzard do because they have huge wallets and a strong policy of detail over localization, but that's far from being the rule, and neither in cinema.

 

Also, if we went by the rule "I play in english so everything said literally or ambiguously in english is therefore true to my lore", I don't know then. A few months ago I started a thread to investigate if the "Gem of Shattoto" as referred to in the english version is one and only or refer to a type of jewel where there is many/several. I had to go dig in the french translation (which is always, always more literal even if cheesy), to see that it's the second option. Had I gone with the rule "the english translation is my only compass, the rest is irrelevant", then I would have taken the opposite conclusion that there is only one damn BLM soulstone in the lore.

 

Which sounds a bit like saying there is a mistake or something ambiguous in the english loc, but it's true even if in contradiction with the rest. It would be like saying the various typos and contradictory mistakes in the english lorebook should be ignored.

 

 

EDIT: if anything, my current take on the matter is similar to the OP. Hingan, Doman, Sea Wolf and whatnot, are all ancient (or less ancient) languages that have faded off progressively to make way to the common tongue. It's a bit like the Galactic Basic in Star Wars to my eyes. And yes, I still believe that Hingan is probably spoken plenly as Hingan in the reclusive islands of Hingashi, out of ijin's ears range though.

 

The one thing about the lorebook is it's not perfect. Also, not everyone has access to it. Everyone playing the game has access to the lore in the game in the language they are able to play it in. Its the localization team's responsibility to at least get the basic idea across. I don't want to nitpick little lore intricacies anymore, I'm tired and I want to have fun.

 

There are several things that are more than just typos in the book. There are things that directly contradict lore established in game - one of those things being this. So I default to the game. A player shouldn't have to scour all the language settings to figure out lore well enough to RP.

 

I'm one little RPer in a sea of RPers all interpreting the lore. Not telling anyone else how to do it, just stating how I do it and why.

[Sounsyy]

Personally, I'm in the camp that multiple living languages exist throughout the world today and that these include Doman and Hingan (though Hingan might be more commonly spoken in Bukyo, which has almost no outside influence). But I'm also not going to argue the point as Nero has already collected the lore and it's now just a matter of personal interpretation. So I'm merely going to be adding some Doman and Hingan terms I've found that weren't listed already:

 

Kugane = "gold" | Kogane = lesser fortune

"Kugane' date='" as you are doubtless unaware, is an ancient Hingan word for gold. So, in this prosperous port where golden fortunes are made, lesser fortunes, or "kogane," are earned by the local merchants. It's all quite logical once you learn the language.[/quote']

 

Tenkonto = "spire of drifting souls"

You are now standing in Tenkonto. Loosely translated' date=' the name means "spire of drifting souls," which - as some of you may have deduced - makes reference to the aetheryte which stands over yonder.[/quote']

 

Onishishu = a collective of skilled craftsmen

Far Eastern aetheryte technology have a long and storied tradition' date=' I assure you. This particular example was constructed by the Onishishu, a collective of skilled craftsmen, who guard their ancestral techniques with the utmost secrecy.[/quote']

 

Sakazuki = "the goblet"

This is where the founding members of our organization first joined hands and toasted to the future. That is why we call this island "Sakazuki" or' date=' quite literally, "the goblet."[/quote']

 

Namai = "arrowhead weed"

"Namai" is actually a local term for the arrowhead - it does make you wonder just who thought naming a village after a weed was a good idea.

 

Hanami = "tradition of enjoying the aesthetic beauty of flowers"

One of the books talked of something called "hanami." It was described as a "tradition of enjoying the aesthetic beauty of flowers."

 

Zekki = "indiscriminant killer"

This shark's "gator" misnomer' date=' deriving from its Shishu origins, can be deceptive, but there is no mistaking the bloodthirsty "zekki" element, which essentially equates to "indiscriminant killer" in Hingan.[/quote']

 

Kotsu = "bone" | Zetsu = "tongue"

A compound of the Hingashi terms "kotsu"' date=' meaning "bone", and "zetsu" meaning "tongue", referring to the oral harpoon this fish uses to spear its prey. Its tail is known to grow scarlet with age and bloodguilt.[/quote']

 

Koromo = Hingan garment

When a ship draws near' date=' this tiny little sucker billows out like the Hingan garment for which it is named, transmogrifying to mammoth proportions before dragging sailors from their decks to the depths, or so an old sailor sings.[/quote']

 

Nure-onna = "wet woman"

Her name meaning literally "wet woman' date='" Nure-onna is a malevolent spirit who has taken the form of a beautiful young maiden to lure men into her lair. Here, she flays her victims and feeds them to her pets - loyal gyuki demons who do her every bidding.[/quote']

 

Nogoi

Yanxia has found itself overrun by this species with a formulaic overpopulating blend of longevity and hyperactive libido. The "no" of its name aptly deriving from the Hingan for "wild".

 

Uchiwa

The shell of this bivalve mollusk is ribbed like the "uchiwa" hand fans used by Hingan festival-goers in summer.

 

Dafu = "genius"

Its sheer dominance over other life in the Ruby Sea has earned this sizable wavekin the title "dafu' date='" or literally, the top dog... er, fish.[/quote']

From an ancient Far Eastern term for "genius" or "master of its trade' date='" it's name speaks to the inspiring artistry on display in this magnificent specimen.[/quote']

 

Lightscale = grit

Wrapped in a tough' date=' scaly cuirass and always craving the crunch of bones and shells, this hardest of links in the food chain has a name synonymous with grit in Doman vernacular.[/quote']

 

Tengu = legendary dog-like creature of Far Eastern legend

The elongated forehead of this saltwater species is compared to the nose of a tengu - a legendary dog-like creature of Far Eastern legend.

 

Zeni = ancient Yanxian currency

Named after an ancient Far Eastern currency' date=' this bivalve mollusk is most commonly found in the lakes and rivers of Yanxia.[/quote']

The shells of this wavekin once served as the coin of the realm in the lands of Yanxia' date=' to which the Hingan term "zeni" refers, though the mollusk is all but worthless nowadays.[/quote']

 

Ronin = "wandering warrior"

Its rugged facial features' date=' scar-like stripe, and solitary swimming habits earned this fish the Hingan title of "ronin," or "wandering warrior." The fish does not seem to actively seek a master.[/quote']

 

Yu-no-hana

Borrowing its name from the Hingan word for the "flowers" of sintered sediment found in hot springs' date=' this crab has the curious ability to warm the waters around itself, not unlike younglings in a pool.[/quote']

 

 

Hope this helps!

[V'aleera]

While I understand why some people might be inclined to fall in line behind the "multiple dialects, single language" bit, I feel like that is near completely undercut by the simple presence of the particle "no".

 

"No" as most people hashing out this subject are likely aware, is not a word; it is a function of grammar. By establishing the presence of "no" in canon, SE established that the Hingan/Doman "dialect" is possessed of not only a distinction from "the common tongue" in vocabulary, but also (in whole or in part) grammatical structure. And I for one am entirely comfortable in calling a "dialect" that is distinct in its use of vocabulary, grammatical structure, and written alphabet a proper and unique language.

[Nero]

While I understand why some people might be inclined to fall in line behind the "multiple dialects, single language" bit, I feel like that is near completely undercut by the simple presence of the particle "no".

 

"No" as most people hashing out this subject are likely aware, is not a word; it is a function of grammar. By establishing the presence of "no" in canon, SE established that the Hingan/Doman "dialect" is possessed of not only a distinction from "the common tongue" in vocabulary, but also (in whole or in part) grammatical structure. And I for one am entirely comfortable in calling a "dialect" that is distinct in its use of vocabulary, grammatical structure, and written alphabet a proper and unique language.

 

Interestingly enough, that assertion also establishes the existence of an Eorzean version of French and German, as well., since noble Elezen names use "de" as a preposition denoting "of", and "von" can be found in the form of "Baron Von Quiveron".

 

As I'm so fond of saying, it's very bad world building to not formally establish whether or not your setting has multiple languages, which is par for the course for Square, but the fringe information is useful.

[L'ohba Tia]

While I understand why some people might be inclined to fall in line behind the "multiple dialects, single language" bit, I feel like that is near completely undercut by the simple presence of the particle "no".

 

"No" as most people hashing out this subject are likely aware, is not a word; it is a function of grammar. By establishing the presence of "no" in canon, SE established that the Hingan/Doman "dialect" is possessed of not only a distinction from "the common tongue" in vocabulary, but also (in whole or in part) grammatical structure. And I for one am entirely comfortable in calling a "dialect" that is distinct in its use of vocabulary, grammatical structure, and written alphabet a proper and unique language.

 

Interestingly enough, that assertion also establishes the existence of an Eorzean version of French and German, as well., since noble Elezen names use "de" as a preposition denoting "of", and "von" can be found in the form of "Baron Von Quiveron".

 

As I'm so fond of saying, it's very bad world building to not formally establish whether or not your setting has multiple languages, which is par for the course for Square, but the fringe information is useful.

 

The Eorzean version of French has been noted to be the old Elezen tongue.

[V'aleera]

Interestingly enough, that assertion also establishes the existence of an Eorzean version of French and German

 

I am 100% okay with that.

[Caspar]

I wish they could get their story straight in a lot of ways, and the expansion STILL hasn't given me the infamous tyrant's name, but I am uncomfortable weighing the JP version of the dialogue over that of the others, given that there is a sense of concurrent script writing going on in FFXIV. Just as I'm not fine with English being the only translation I consider valid, I'm not okay with the JP one being weighed as the original if its role as primary source is tenuous. Of course they're not going to mention a foreign language if it's in their home tongue. So I really don't think that one out of many translations precludes the existence of multiple languages if it is clearly stated in other translations otherwise. At best it is just self-contradicting lore that doesn't make a whole lot of sense, and not a solid conclusion in favor of Doman being simply a dialect of the common language.

I'm in favor of things that give people more to RP with and against things that subtract from others RP. I think it's safer to allow for the existence of foreign languages, and racial tongues, as suggested in other translations, than to deny them, as the latter doesn't add anything to the setting, nor is it strictly more accurate given the other translations contradict the JP one.

[Kieron Lohengrin]

Gosetsu uses wagahai and de gozaru a whole bunch. Is that a Hingan/Doman thing or a Gosetsu thing?

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Gosetsu uses wagahai and de gozaru a whole bunch. Is that a Hingan/Doman thing or a Gosetsu thing?

 

I'm assuming that's in the Japanese client/audio? Those are both archaic forms not typically found in modern Japanese, which would fit the Doman/Hingan style of speech.

[Valence]

Personally this all comforts me into my middle line position where I believe there is a strong common tongue, possibly hyuran, as hinted in the lorebook, but that doesn't mean all those specific languages are extinct, or not spoken anymore besides. Especially Hingan.

[Gegenji]

Personally this all comforts me into my middle line position where I believe there is a strong common tongue, possibly hyuran, as hinted in the lorebook, but that doesn't mean all those specific languages are extinct, or not spoken anymore besides. Especially Hingan.

 

It mostly just debunks the idea of someone from Doma not being able to speak to Eorzeans. Maybe they use a slang term or word that the other might know, but basic conversation should still be able to take place.

[Yian Kutku]

Gosetsu uses wagahai and de gozaru a whole bunch. Is that a Hingan/Doman thing or a Gosetsu thing?

 

I'm assuming that's in the Japanese client/audio? Those are both archaic forms not typically found in modern Japanese, which would fit the Doman/Hingan style of speech.

 

I have the vague impression that "de gozaru" was used by other Hingans, but I can't be totally sure. It's archaic and slightly less formal than the super-polite "de gozaimasu", but more formal than the usual "desu". It's stereotypical of samurai and ronin, which certainly fits Gosetsu.

 

"Wagahai" is pretty much just Gosetsu that I know of. It's supposed to sound self-important, by someone who thinks highly of themselves, whether justified or not. Younger/modern people might use "ore-sama" as an equivalent.

 

On a completely different note, Soroban uses "oira", which is supposed to sound, well, country hick.

 

So basically I think these particular phrasings in Japanese are definitely intended to evoke certain imagery, based on pop cultural history. We hear Gosetsu use "de gozaru", and we know that he's a samurai/ronin. We hear him use "wagahai", and we can get an idea of the type of proud personality he has. These would not have been as effective without the well-known popular interpretations of samurai in all sorts of media.

 

It's much like how most Limsans talk like pirates to varying degrees, even though the "pirate accent" was basically popularized in the 20th century by Robert Newton. Or, for slightly more historical accuracy, Jacke talking almost entirely in thieves' cant.

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Some of the JP players have been working on figuring out what some of the written text in Kugane is.

 

 

[Yian Kutku]

Some of the JP players have been working on figuring out what some of the written text in Kugane is.

 

That's pretty impressive. I can't even tell how one could get from the Hingan script to the Japanese kana.

 

Incidentally, I'm scratching my head over this one:

 

 

 

My Japanese is not good enough to interpret this, apart from how it's a poem by one Hirose. Anyone have an idea?

[Unnamed Mercenary]

Some of the JP players have been working on figuring out what some of the written text in Kugane is.

 

That's pretty impressive. I can't even tell how one could get from the Hingan script to the Japanese kana.

 

My Japanese is not good enough to interpret this, apart from how it's a poem by one Hirose. Anyone have an idea?

 

The kana part is "easy" all things considered. It's like doing basic cryptography where the letters are switched around. It's more like a guessing game that you piece together by looking at what else it's around based on context. (Which is likely why we don't have a wo particle anywhere.)

 

My japanese is useless for poetry. I can barely order on a menu and ask for directions.

[Nero]

The regular Eorzean alphabet is a pretty simple replacement sort of deal too. I'd be quite interested if they fully expanded on whatever the equivalent for Hingan/Doman and kana is.