discussion Spying In Character: Communication is Key?

[Akeno Asukai]

[align=justify]Now, I know this is a topic which has popped up in a number of circles and games -- as espionage, spying and gossip are often pretty popular around role-play communities. With this topic, comes the "time-old question" of: how should one proceed to eavesdrop on a public conversation?

 

I've had several interactions with characters I've spied on in the past as well as characters spying on myself. In some other games -- such as WoW -- the issue is generally resolved with simple game mechanics such as Stealth; unfortunately, XIV does not offer much for a "true" stealth and I've encountered loads of people who will still see you. 

      My inquiry is in regards to what people consider proper etiquette for spying on someone in a public venue. I've had several instances where people have altered their conversation/behavior when alerted OOCly to my eavesdropping as well as ICly to an emote stating that I am eavesdropping. This has caused me to often disregard this when faced with public settings however, I will walk closer to targets or simply move to stand nearby -- so as to give a more reasonable hearing range. 

 

What I am curious about is how this community feels about eavesdropping without emoting or whispering directly that a character is doing such? How does one feel about eavesdropping with an emote only and no whisper? How about with a direct OOC whisper regarding the eavesdropping? 

      I'd also like to hear if others have had successful run-ins with people not altering their behavior once they are alerted to someone listening in? [/align]

[Sophia_Grave]

There's not really a clear answer.

 

I've RP'd a career spy since 2.0 and I've been met with the entire gamut of responses. Everyone's going to have their own opinion on how it should be handled. It worked best when both parties were aware in my experiences.

[InsaneChaosMarine]

Probably an unpopular opinion...

 

In my opinion. If your public, outside of a house and saying something in the public.. assume everything you have said CAN and WILL be used against you in the future.

 

No need to consent to it, you consented to it already by speaking publicly. However that is my personal opinion of it. If you need to ask consent for everything in role-play its no longer role-play.

 

I notice, that some people have issues with this. However, the problem with that is as soon as you ask they 'go quiet' and stop talking about such sensitive things that could affect their character.

 

I've even had it where "Hey, can I listen to you?" "Sure." IC: "I think we should go someplace a bit more quiet."

 

lol.. its like: "Why even roleplay?"

 

Although Open Roleplay seems rather .. quiet lately i'm afraid. =/

[Sophia_Grave]

Probably an unpopular opinion...

 

In my opinion.  If your public, outside of a house and saying something in the public.. assume everything you have said CAN and WILL be used against you in the future.

 

No need to consent to it, you consented to it already by speaking publicly.  However that is my personal opinion of it.  If you need to ask consent for everything in role-play its no longer role-play.

 

I notice, that some people have issues with this.  However, the problem with that is as soon as you ask they 'go quiet' and stop talking about such sensitive things that could affect their character.

 

I've even had it where "Hey, can I listen to you?" "Sure." IC: "I think we should go someplace a bit more quiet."

 

lol.. its like: "Why even roleplay?"

 

Although Open Roleplay seems rather .. quiet lately i'm afraid.  =/

 

Well the issue with that is (not that I agree with this response) that not every RP session that happens is considered 'open' and that some people are happy to use locations in the game as private spaces just as a type of 'setting placeholder'. For example, the Pearl Lane is really the only area in the game (among one or two others) that fit the 'shady alley' setting. I personally know people who have used it as such without it actually being the Pearl Lane. I mean, I think that's pretty fair? Some people really like to have a visual setting to stoke their RP creativity. If they didn't, we wouldn't need to RP in the game at all, really.

 

The point is, you never know the circumstances of an RP session unless you ask and talk to the RPers. That's the challenge with playing any sort of subterfugal character. You're always going to need OOC permission, but you also have to keep it interesting. Outside of that, you'll have to rely on OOC trust that the other person wants the same things out of the experience so you can do what you trying to do, and that's in very short supply when it comes to walkups or RPing with strangers.

[InsaneChaosMarine]

Probably an unpopular opinion...

 

In my opinion.  If your public, outside of a house and saying something in the public.. assume everything you have said CAN and WILL be used against you in the future.

 

No need to consent to it, you consented to it already by speaking publicly.  However that is my personal opinion of it.  If you need to ask consent for everything in role-play its no longer role-play.

 

I notice, that some people have issues with this.  However, the problem with that is as soon as you ask they 'go quiet' and stop talking about such sensitive things that could affect their character.

 

I've even had it where "Hey, can I listen to you?" "Sure." IC: "I think we should go someplace a bit more quiet."

 

lol.. its like: "Why even roleplay?"

 

Although Open Roleplay seems rather .. quiet lately i'm afraid.  =/

 

______

 

Well the issue with that is (not that I agree with this response) that not every RP session that happens is considered 'open' and that some people are happy to use locations in the game as private spaces just as a type of 'setting placeholder'. For example, the Pearl Lane is really the only area in the game (among one or two others) that fit the 'shady alley' setting. I personally know people who have used it as such without it actually being the Pearl Lane. I mean, I think that's pretty fair? Some people really like to have a visual setting to stoke their RP creativity. If they didn't, we wouldn't need to RP in the game at all, really.

 

The point is, you never know the circumstances of an RP session unless you ask and talk to the RPers. That's the challenge with playing any sort of subterfugal character. You're always going to need OOC permission, but you also have to keep it interesting. Outside of that, you'll have to rely on OOC trust that the other person wants the same things out of the experience so you can do what you trying to do, and that's in very short supply when it comes to walkups or RPing with strangers.

 

_______

 

 

I don't see the fun of being a shady or mysterious character if your neither shady nore mysterious. If its not open. Why are they open? They could always RP in group, but that doesn't really draw attention. So your saying a character should publicly role-play in a shady alley but not expect any shady individuals to listen to them or catch wind of what they are saying? That does not sound really like role-playing to me, that just sounds odd. You are playing in a shady alley for a reason right? There are also a few alleys in the Goblet and even all of the districts which seem out of place where a shady individual could hang out. Honestly though, I think one of the biggest disappointments to FFXIV is the cities not being connected to the districts. I would of loved to have inn rooms around the city and it actually feeling more like a player-city. However, these are all opinions.

 

It is also no different from being in a bar and overhearing people. Even if your not actively spying on them you can still overhear them IC. Should they not expect to be heard? What if you were just listening to them at a bar and came to sit by them? I mean, you might think its different.. but not really. In the end, the consent thing for open role-play is silly at best. I think its mostly due to inexperience that it bother's people. However, I notice a great many people doing less and less open role-play and hiding in districts and houses now or doing only linkshell things. Which is an alright alternative, but it does get rid of a lot of the chaos and randomness that really can make role-playing fun.

 

Although.. yeah again! OPINION =)

 

It just reminds me of people role-playing darker characters, and bragging about how dark they are and how much void powers they have. Then when they learn someone found out about it they scream: "WHERE DID YOU GET THAT INFORMATION!!!!!!111 You must have read it off my bio!" Well.. word passes i'm afraid. Maybe you should not have been so obvious? Also the fact that some times people can simply assume and make up things. For example I remember telling a lie about a character IC to get them ICly in-trouble in another game's RP. It caused a sh*tstorm, because my 'lie' ended up being a truthful thing.. weird enough.

[Sophia_Grave]

Well, yea.

 

We have the whole consent "rule" because the trust isn't there when it comes to walkups. The trust isn't there because RP has no real rules and people do it in very different ways that don't necessarily mix well. In a perfect world, sure, we'd all trust each other to make RP fun for everyone all the time and there's be an appropriate amount of give and take. But that doesn't happen as much as it should and as a result, characters like ours are simply always going to be more difficult to play in that scenario.

 

And yea, it sucks. Consent is just as abuseable as trust but at least you learn early whether someone is wasting your time rather than finding out halfway through. We all have RP horror stories and have had our time wasted or have been taken advantage of. This is why we can't have nice things.

[Erah'sae]

My take on spying in character.

 

a.) don't do it unless you have a good IC reason to (this usually means you've interacted with the group before, or are hired by another group they're interacting with, etc.)

b.) don't use game mechanics to hide yourself.  Don't use the gatherer stealth skill, physically hide behind the tree.

c.) poke folks to ask  "Hey are you all really there ICly." if it's not a common public spot. (read: if you catch them in the wild at a campsite or some such.)

d.) Emote.  You need to give some indication that you're physically there and not someone idling around as a non-RPer.   Jot things down, tilt your head or raise your eyebrows in time with something said.  

e.) Suck it up and deal with the repercussions if you're caught.

 

I tend to prefer open / world RP to closed.  I'm of the belief that closed "no one should overhear it" RP should be done in private locations, party or non-overhearable methods.  It's a minimum impact on the open world and the immersion of others thing to me.  Just really a polite thing to do when in public locations and you don't want your RP to be overheard/interactable with, or taken ICly.  

 

Open chatter in public places in public channels, to me, is a tacit invitation of interaction, otherwise why bother RPing in the open world?  

 

But I'm an old fart, so take it with a grain of salt.  I grew up on the dreams of virtual worlds.  Dreams which have largely been tossed to the wayside by the masses.

[rinlai]

A lot of people in the RP community have been incredibly pacified to the point of avoiding confrontation or conflict at allllll cost, but still wish to RP characters who are 'evil, or 'shady'. This is a big reason why a lot of people advise wanting 'consent' to eavesdrop into public RP or the like. My take on it is to RP in the world as it would be a world. 

If someone is spying on you, and you are in public--using text channels that are public, then you don't get to decide if people can spy on you or use what you say against you, if that's how you feel then RP in party chat. When you go Ic, you have to accept that you are entering a world where you aren't in control. If you wish to be 100% in control, then just write a book.

 

I've dealt a lot in people who RP around darker themes and such, and you can't quite trust people to not meta-game, so when you involve yourself in these things my advice is to always cover yourself as stealthy ooc as you would ic. Do your best to hide yourself from both the character and the player, as it is the only assured way there will be no meta occurring. 

 

The ninja skills like stealth are a thing in-game, and people use them often to try to be sneaky and hide in plain sight, but there are various ways to combat this. One being aether, a signature that every living being gives off--if people use tools such as goggles that reveal said aether, then it would penetrate the stealth and reveal a body there (And item that comes to mind is Sharlayan Goggles). In addition, there are things like Flash, or you could crate a bright light source. This bright light source would be cast upon an invisible unit, and display a distinct shadow behind them. If their body cant be seen but still exists, then it'll cast a shadow which can be seen. Also the classic, water; if it's raining or you go to a snowy area or muddy area, you would see their foot prints while in stealth or snow. 

 

So even if someone does go full rogue stealth, Ic, there are many tools that can be used to combat that. 

 

My ending advice is to simply do it, don't ask and don't worry; play your character as you would in the world and protect yourself from meta both ic and ooc'ly. It's the burden of those who RP in public to acknowledge that they rescind an amount of control over the scene and the characters involved when they do so.

 

(Also take screenshots and catalog any knowledge you gain while being sneaky, this way you can have proof of your having gained it IC'ly.)

[Teadrinker]

Always communicate OOCly with the person you're spying on. A lot of times just publicly emoting that you're there and present and hearing things won't be enough. Just cover the bases, save yourself a headache.

[Warren Castille]

If you're roleplaying in an open space but don't want to be heard, use /party. If you're roleplaying in an open space but are speaking low enough to not be heard unless someone is right up on you, emote something about talking and then use /whisper. I generally assume that something happening in /say in public is up for grabs and walk-ups.

 

Eavesdropping is all about intent, though. I'm long on record about a lot of my early roleplaying experience being about power plays and oneupsmanship: Don't sneak around someone just to try and give yourself an advantage without declaring your intention to do that OOC. If you're just using it for an RP hook or something, that's probably fine. I guess my line is this:

 

Is the information I'm hearing just chatter? Treat it like walk-up roleplay.

 

Is the information I'm hearing potentially a huge deal, i.e. blackmail material or otherwise dynamic-shifting stuff? Ask first.

 

I mean, if people are openly talking about how they were sacrificing children to power their demonic ascian powers in a public spot they deserve what they get, but that's just like, my opinion man.

[Nako Vesh]

You can make all the declarations you want about RPing in public being open to, well, public response, but it's not going to stop people from being weird about it. I mean, I agree that if you RP in public you should be ready for walk ups. But people are people, and they're going to be weird and picky about it, and there's nothing you can do about it.

[Warren Castille]

Writing in public and not wanting people to join you isn't roleplay. It's masturbating.

 

It's a teachable moment.

 

Edit: Rebuke not aimed at Nako, just the people Nako is describing.

[Akeno Asukai]

[align=justify]So, I've been keeping up in silence on this thread -- reading the responses, tilting my head and thinking of all the semi-useless information I've gathered in the last few days of hanging around in the Quicksand. Yes, the Quicksand. It's a pretty solid hot spot for people boasting about their accomplishments. 

[/align]

 

 

[align=justify]Now, what I'm getting from the community thus far is that it is still pretty divided however, it would appear (to me at least) that a good portion of the community shares my thoughts: if you're in a public hot spot, using /say and my character is clearly within a reasonable range -- your information is mine. It also seems that while people here aren't necessarily against someone listening in, they do feel that even in public, eavesdropping warrants a response -- whether it be an out of character whisper or an emote directed to the person(s) being watched.

 

Some points have been brushed over -- such as people being "picky" when it comes to walk-up role-play and it does lead me back to my concerns (which have already happened on Balmung) regarding people who intentionally change their behavior when they know someone is watching them.

      I'm willing to chalk this up to a bad experience, but when it's someone who is considered by others (who were close to my character at the time) to be a "major player" and a little unavoidable unless I cut ties in-character with the people specifically linked to this bad experience. How, exactly, does the majority of the community handle this kind of... situation? Do you just abandon the whole eavesdropping on this person? Do you respect their decision and continue to make attempts at eavesdropping on semi-public and public scenarios? I am genuinely curious as to how people prefer to  handle these situations -- especially since I have some very public, very unsettling outcomes to this kind of seclusion behavior on other platforms. [/align]

[C'kayah Polaali]

I've RPed villains in FF since 2.0, and I typically do it publicly. I think it adds to the fun, both for me as the villain having to pay attention to things like who's around, and for the other people around me. It adds flavor. I do expect anything I do or say publicly to be used against me, but this is where it gets into odd territory.

 

If I want my character to swing a sword at someone, I get to post that they're swinging the sword. I don't get to post what the result is, however. That's up to the other person. That's very well accepted.

 

But does that only apply to physical fights? Or should it apply to other things? Cops 'n' robbers, off the script, is basically the same as that RP sword fight. It needs to play out - in my opinion - similarly. The spy can use the information they gathered against my character, but it has to happen in that same manner. And this, in my opinion, is why the answer to the question "is communication key?" is yes. Absolutely yes.

 

At the end of the day, the ideal for RP is that everyone involved in a RP is doing it to make the collective story better. That's why I RP my characters' villainy in public. Likewise, if my character is spying, I'll make some sort of post that at least can indicate that my character is actively there (as opposed to standing still as if I were afk). It makes for a better story. At the same time, we've all probably run into someone who tries to RP to "win". It's one of the reasons why lots of people RP fights resolved with /random - it avoids that possibility in a combat RP. Silent omniscience in a character - whether it's a spy who literally can't be distinguished from an afk person or a villain who decides "no one can spy on me ever" - raises red flags in the same way as a character who always dodges a blow in a fight RP does. OOC communication can mitigate those red flags.

[Nako Vesh]

Writing in public and not wanting people to join you isn't roleplay. It's masturbating.

 

It's a teachable moment.

 

Edit: Rebuke not aimed at Nako, just the people Nako is describing.

 

I get what'chu sayin', but you must have run into far more receptive people than I have! Though I suppose one person in ten learning is better than nothing.

[rinlai]

To your concerns about people being picky Ic and not wanting others to join into their public scene, I'd say your best response is to leave them alone and not interact--as a person who holds those views will likely be a very rude RP'er. In my opinion, the adherence of IC stands above OOC communication, and not breaking that immersion is something I take somewhat seriously. You are right, there are /many/ people who will change their behavior based on what you communicate with them, because a majority of more criminal RP'ers want to get away with what they do wrong, so my best advice is as I stated above--keep as much as you can Ic and just play it out as it would progress should the world be reality. If they speak in public, they can be heard in public, if they do crimes in public, they can be held accountable by witnesses, and if they rely on OOC boundaries to protect their IC actions--they're a rude RP'er, and I'd find others to interact with at that point.

[Dawnstar]

I always announce my presence via a /e or other actions if I am spying on someone.

 

It only seems polite to let others know. After all, they may not want that kind of interaction. This does mean that players can, and sometimes will, metagame and tactfully not mention things they otherwise would when I'm around.

 

But I perhaps naively feel that if a player is the type to metagame, perhaps I've chosen the wrong person to spy on and it's not right to mistrust people as a starting point.

[Teadrinker]

Now, what I'm getting from the community thus far is that it is still pretty divided however, it would appear (to me at least) that a good portion of the community shares my thoughts: if you're in a public hot spot, using /say and my character is clearly within a reasonable range -- your information is mine. It also seems that while people here aren't necessarily against someone listening in, they do feel that even in public, eavesdropping warrants a response -- whether it be an out of character whisper or an emote directed to the person(s) being watched.

[align=justify]

Some points have been brushed over -- such as people being "picky" when it comes to walk-up role-play and it does lead me back to my concerns (which have already happened on Balmung) regarding people who intentionally change their behavior when they know someone is watching them.

      I'm willing to chalk this up to a bad experience, but when it's someone who is considered by others (who were close to my character at the time) to be a "major player" and a little unavoidable unless I cut ties in-character with the people specifically linked to this bad experience. How, exactly, does the majority of the community handle this kind of... situation? Do you just abandon the whole eavesdropping on this person? Do you respect their decision and continue to make attempts at eavesdropping on semi-public and public scenarios? I am genuinely curious as to how people prefer to  handle these situations -- especially since I have some very public, very unsettling outcomes to this kind of seclusion behavior on other platforms. [/align]

 

 

People can say that what people say in /s is theirs to do whatever with all they want. At the end of the day though, if Bob doesn't want X situation having a major impact on his character because playing it out is going to make him loathe playing it then that's that. End of discussion. How and if you interact with Bob from there on out is your call.

 

It's sounds like you're citing a particular situation without directly citing it. A lot of these situations have small details and nuances that you can really only factor in properly when knowing all the details so I'm not sure you're going to get the feedback you want here as it exactly pertains to this situation.

 

What happened here could span the gambit from Bob feeling like he wasn't communicated with to others saying Bob just doesn't like consequences for his actions. The folk involved just need to communicate and work that out among themselves and I think that's the best advice anyone can give.

[Mermaid]

People can say that what people say in /s is theirs to do whatever with all they want. At the end of the day though, if Bob doesn't want X situation having a major impact on his character because playing it out is going to make him loathe playing it then that's that. End of discussion. How and if you interact with Bob from there on out is your call.

 

It's sounds like you're citing a particular situation without directly citing it. A lot of these situations have small details and nuances that you can really only factor in properly when knowing all the details so I'm not sure you're going to get the feedback you want here as it exactly pertains to this situation.

 

What happened here could span the gambit from Bob feeling like he wasn't communicated with to others saying Bob just doesn't like consequences for his actions. The folk involved just need to communicate and work that out among themselves and I think that's the best advice anyone can give.

 

After reading this thread that's pretty much my opinion. This is my first time attempting to do MMO based RP and seeing this mentality of 'anything you write in /say is fair game for anyone' honestly makes me never want to use /say. I can only assume it's due to the prevalence of walk up RP where in most of my previous communities that wasn't exactly a thing.

 

If I post a thread in a public forum and clearly label it as closed does that mean you should be able to jump in? The forum is public and everyone can see it, after all.

 

If I decide to run my D&D campaign at a game store does that mean you can drop a sheet and a mini on the table, pull up a chair, and announce that you are joining the campaign? I should be running the game at my house if I want to be private, right?

 

I honestly do believe that if you want something to be private you should keep it to /party or /tell but who am I to tell someone how they should be RPing. If someone wants to discuss their black market dealings using /say in the Quicksand without the Brass Blades/Immortal Flames/whoever arresting them then they have every right to even if people disagree with it. You never know why someone doesn't want you involved.

[Arashin Kujqai]

*snip*

 

Well the issue with that is (not that I agree with this response) that not every RP session that happens is considered 'open' and that some people are happy to use locations in the game as private spaces just as a type of 'setting placeholder'. For example, the Pearl Lane is really the only area in the game (among one or two others) that fit the 'shady alley' setting. I personally know people who have used it as such without it actually being the Pearl Lane. I mean, I think that's pretty fair? Some people really like to have a visual setting to stoke their RP creativity. If they didn't, we wouldn't need to RP in the game at all, really.

 

The point is, you never know the circumstances of an RP session unless you ask and talk to the RPers. That's the challenge with playing any sort of subterfugal character. You're always going to need OOC permission, but you also have to keep it interesting. Outside of that, you'll have to rely on OOC trust that the other person wants the same things out of the experience so you can do what you trying to do, and that's in very short supply when it comes to walkups or RPing with strangers.

Just my perspective here, while I understand entirely what you're saying.. But if that's the case, they typically use their own party chat or linkshell or etc. They probably wouldn't be using /say chat openly when it's still just Pearl Lane there, even if they're using it as something else for their session.

 

Probably a bad metaphor but it's all I can think of. It'd be like going to Walmart and telling people openly around you that you're actually in K-mart. While those with you as a group understand it, everyone else that you're telling publicly or that hears will be confused to what's even going on.

 

The way I see it, anyone who uses /s chat openly and has a tag on (or clearly are IC).... their chat can be used/taken as it was said. They're IC the moment they decide they are, and their actions/chat reflect their char and interact with the world around them. If they weren't already aware of this, they wouldn't be using /s chat to begin with because it would defeat the point. The only ruling I'd go about with spying is just not to use anything your char doesn't actually hear ICly or it'll be one of those OOC interactions that won't be fun. Like if your character has left the building or area ICly and you just wanted to stay/watch OOCly, means you shouldn't be using any context as if your character heard it ICly, regardless if you read it OOCly.

 

In any case, I wouldn't sweat it too much. Most RP'ers like being immersed ICly, so they'll probably feel more complimented at the fact your char is using context from their own chars. Worst case scenario if things aren't panning out well, you can OOCly apologize and say your char is a spy.

[Kieron Lohengrin]

Writing in public and not wanting people to join you isn't roleplay. It's masturbating.

 

^ this

 

To your concerns about people being picky Ic and not wanting others to join into their public scene, I'd say your best response is to leave them alone and not interact--as a person who holds those views will likely be a very rude RP'er. In my opinion, the adherence of IC stands above OOC communication, and not breaking that immersion is something I take somewhat seriously. You are right, there are /many/ people who will change their behavior based on what you communicate with them, because a majority of more criminal RP'ers want to get away with what they do wrong, so my best advice is as I stated above--keep as much as you can Ic and just play it out as it would progress should the world be reality. If they speak in public, they can be heard in public, if they do crimes in public, they can be held accountable by witnesses, and if they rely on OOC boundaries to protect their IC actions--they're a rude RP'er, and I'd find others to interact with at that point.

 

^ also this

 

When you behave IC in /say you're not running a "private D&D campaign," you're participating in a world that others also inhabit. Other players aren't background NPCs for your benefit.

 

Ostensibly private RP belongs in private channels. It's weird that ERPers of all people get this yet many others still don't.

[Maril]

I am in camp if you spill your guts in the quicksand/(Public area of your choice) about your evil misdoings, please count on it being heard. The only cases where I'll disregard something happening in that nature is if people actively and continuously point out in emotes or in ye olde *low* fronters that the conversation that is taking place is below normal earshot hearing levels. 

 

It is nice of you to toss an emote, but in my opinion if you're in a public place like say Pearl Lane, and you walk up, you have your RP tag on and you stop within earshot of a conversation then you shouldn't strictly have to - Just following wysiwyg, you are there and they should (if they want to of course, people do whatever) count on that being a thing that happens. If you run up because you were OOC, see people being IC, then switch to walkmode and put on your RP tag - That's a situation where I'd throw an emote because there needs to be an establishment of how your character presumably didn't just appear out of thin air. If you're using any extra measures for being unseen, like magic or whichever, emote emote emote. And be prepared to get busted because of those extra measures, you will never be 100% invisible because other, especially spellcasting characters, might notice your aether hanging about. 

 

What I myself can be annoyed with when it comes to people eavesdropping, spying and so on, is that sometimes I find people take the range of hearing to an unreasonable point. If you sit in a crowded tavern with 20 other people, just as the chatspam gets intense, you shouldn't actually count on your character being able to follow a conversation across the room. I also firmly disagree with the notion that you can hear across floors in a house because the dev team at final never asked themselves if the say-range should have a height limit, and that is no matter which race's super-hearing you're using. And if that is something of an overpowered skill your character has; again, emote for it. 

 

And then if you want to use whatever information you spied up, ask for permissions before consequences come-a-knocking on their doors. Though that is, as I see it, really just common courtesy to do towards anyone you don't know and who might not expect Bad Things to happen out of the blue coming from yourself. I wouldn't waste too much time on people who get antsy about their plot-details being picked up on and acted on because they spoke of them in super public areas, better just to leave them be. You can still use what you heard but refer to it as coming from some sort of NPC instead, if you for example are into rumor-brokering. 

 

/puts two gil in a box

[Edric W.]

Imagine if someone did the same thing you're about to do to you. If it'd make you think "Wow, what a prick." or "Oh piss off would you?", or anything in that vein, don't do it. Or do, if you don't mind being seen as a bit of a knob-jockey.

[ExAtomos]

We've paddled this boat before!

 

I am firmly in the camp of "if you RP in a public area, the public can overhear". Same as if you were in Walmart and talking out loud about robbing the place. Someone will go alert the security guard.

 

I also sincerely wish we had another chat channel that was a smaller zone than /say, but not as private as /tell. A true whisper that could only be heard if you are right next to the speakers.

 

If someone eavesdrops on a convo of mine without my knowledge and uses it against me, I'll be more annoyed than anything... cause I've been caught. My bad for yakking in public. If someone sends a /tell that they are dropping some eaves, I reflexively change how I rp. I legit can't help it. Either I think that the watcher deserves to be entertained or I go into defensive mode and hide more than I would if I thought I wasn't being watched.

 

I do hedge things a lot when rping in public by using emotes like /em pitches his voice low enough to only be heard by . If someone is icly listening in, it is much harder for them to not godmode by saying they heard everything later on (magitek devices notwithstanding of course. lol.) Can they oocly see it and maybe use the info for an unrelated ic hook later on? Sure!

 

In the open world, far from the crowds, it's also a hell of a lot harder to actually hide your spying character. Good luck in the Azim Steppes, for example.

[Faye]

If I post a thread in a public forum and clearly label it as closed does that mean you should be able to jump in? The forum is public and everyone can see it, after all.

 

I don't really think that's an accurate metaphor, though? It's more along the lines of, what if you made a thread on a public forum and didn't clearly label it as closed in a community where such threads are typically understood/assumed to be open, and then proceeded to exclude or ignore anyone else who posted, or get angry with them, or message them OOC to tell them they can't be involved because it's private, etc.? /Say and /em and open world RP are generally fair game. It's assumed that if your avatar is standing there and you are posting in open chat there, your character is physically there in the world, and therefore approachable because they are, well, a part of the world all our characters are sharing and seeing. That's the draw of in-game MMO RP after all--that we have a complete little immersive IC universe here. If people want to have closed RP's in public channels, that's totally fine, but if others are gonna see them as standoffish, or rude, or weird because of it, I think the onus is on them to accept that for going against the norm and bringing out candy they're not going to share with the whole class.

 

More related to the topic, I think Maril said it all best and I don't want to be too repetitive, but imo, anything in public RP that a character could believably hear is fair game. This is a somewhat unpopular opinion, however, so if you want to avoid drama, it may be better to check OOC first. Yes, some people will metagame with that knowledge, sadly, but you have to ask yourself if those are the people you want to be role-playing with, anyway.