The Vent Tent - Poor PuGs and Other Terrible Tales

[Desu Nee]

Fucken ridiculous but it fucken happened anyway. Still though, what the fuck were they smoking when they decided to put up SoF as a mandatory thing?

To be devil's advocate, Steps of Faith is really really complicated, and constantly, people drop at the smallest excuse. I had to go throught 4 different lobbies until I found one where no one left, and even then it took us like, 3 tries? The one we did it, the dragon was literally at the gate, and I was the only survivor, with 500 HP, and I swiftcasted a flare before biting the dust, which critted and killed it.

It's like Odin's Trial, people take it way too seriously.

 

 

As we're here, I'm really tired of Tanks pulling...on low level dungeons. And then dying and trying again and leaving when pointed out you can't.

[Chris Ganale]

I thought I read something about them adjusting it? Still, it is pretty ridiculous to gate story behind something that requires so much coordination. Ran one earlier tonight before work with two of my FCmates and one outside friend of one of them cos a new alt needed a clear. We knew what the hell we were doing, but one of the healers was brand new and the other two DPS had never managed to actually kill it.

 

Looking between the other dps I figured it was pretty clear that I was best geared and therefore needed to be on the dragon, so we explained our 1 tank/1 healer method to everyone and had the lower-geared healer do one of the cannons.

 

Except....he didn't. After the first ward was destroyed I had to pick up the slack on the cannons and try to hit snares AND do the Dragonslayers. It was....a futility. But after the first wipe the guy paid attention and did cannons when we said to.

[Kurt S.]

Well whatever the fuck they're smoking I want one. Might be that'll help me pull off SoF.

[Enla]

I think the other issue is that there is no ONE method for doing it. Everyone is still figured out what works best, and no two strategies work for the same group. My FC tried to do it the way they were hearing it should be done, but we eventually found the best way for us to clear was to have both healers constantly running ahead and PULLING the mobs with the tank so the canons could get to them evenly - and anyone who needed heals had to come get them as we stopped to do AOEs - myself spamming Holy on the occasions there was no adds and Vishnap had come to a halt. It worked like a bloody charm, but it isn't something everyone would agree with and it helped that we all know each other's strengths and could play to them.

 

Give it a few months and there will be one unified strategy... And hopefully a nerf. x_x I would love for the current SoF to be made a little harder and packaged as the hard or EX version of the fight, while the normal is nerfed for those poor sods who just want to get into HS. At present, it's far too cruel to expect newbie pugs to manage a fight like that - especially if they've never bothered with raiding or the optional primals.

[Steel Wolf]

SoF forever displays the problem with PUGs and the problem with a raid/party finder in this game--people can clear if there's mechanics, but force seven egos into creating a cohesive unit is like trying to play Mozart with your forehead. Personally I found the fight thrilling as hell, but can absolutely appreciate folks finding more frustration and derp than nail-biting excitement.

 

Kurt, you know where I am brutha. I'm familiar with the fight. I know when to fire off the Dragonslayers. Form a team, and give me a poke if you have need of me. I'm just i116 but I can help.

[Kellach Woods]

Biggest problem I have with SoF is the other tank being a fucking derp.

 

Strat used : Get healer's residual aggro to lead the mobs to the front, we peel them off him.

Me : Waits at front for sacrificial healer

Them : HERP DERP GOTTA GET THE DUDES OH WAIT VISHAP JUST MOVED I NEED TO MOVE THEM BACK WAIT WHY AREN'T THEY MOVING WITH ME

 

Strat used : Both tanks cover each side of the bridge

Me : Heads to left

Them : HEADS TO LEFT AFTER SEEING ME HEAD TO LEFT BECAUSE YOU KNOW

 

Strat used : OMG OMG OMG WE FUCKED UP

Me : Carefully climbs up the tower to get the adds that climbed up, peels them off the killsat controls, brings them down

Tank : Is dead, complaining that I'm actually doing my job of getting these fuckers in front

 

Also, Vishap's damage is pretty damn high, and there are groups that'll complain about the tank getting hit too much after complaining that the tank's dodging AoEs thus ensuring that adds are following him instead.

 

I don't care so much about the difficulty at this point, but let's see - What do you get after one of the most frustrating mandatory experiences in the game?

 

Loot : NOPE

Lights : Gentle / Bright (in window)

 

YEAH, FUCK THAT SHIT. There is a reason I absolutely refuse to do SoF. I'm sorry, pre-made groups that are asking for help in actual LSes and will likely know what they're doing, but I'm not subjecting myself to this trial ever again. It's just not worth it.

 

(oh and even better, it completely destroys Duty Roulette : Trials because you're GUARANTEED to get that one since people need clears for it)

[Kellach Woods]

Since this hasn't been posted in in quite some time.

 

DR : Low Level

 

Either you're getting Sastacha or Haukke Manor. Nothing else.

 

PLD gon take a while I fear

[Kellach Woods]

GUESS WHO BOTCHED A 3-STAR ARTISAN'S OFFHAND TONIGHT.

 

IT IS ME.

[Dravus]

The use of damage meters in non-progression content. From what I hear they're not even fully supported or accurate yet from time to time I end up encountering that one player who uses them and insists on belittling everybody else in the group for 'not pulling their weight'. 

 

Ironic given that we were in Lost City of Amdapor and a mass pull failed because the guy using the meter 'accidentally' triggered a mimic which killed the healer. He then blamed me (since everybody has to blame the Dragoon, right?) but I just shrugged it off.

 

Thankfully we managed to complete the dungeon fairly quickly. I only had to kill two bosses since it was a group in progress...which makes me wonder what happened to make the original DPS before me leave after the first boss.

 

Oh well. I'm now one step closer to completing another atma book.

[Kage]

If he used a dps meter to actually harass you and state it then he is an absolute idiot for admitting to something that will get him a 3 day ish suspension of you report.

 

Also, I'm really sorry for the non t9 clear. I am not a good raid Bard and that was the first time I took my Bard into raid content that is not WoD.

[Gegenji]

The only places I've seen damage meters used in FFXIV was in a WoD raid and it was mentioned as an afterthought, letting us compare numbers and see how we did. The point for damage meters - from what I recall from raiding in WoW - was to make sure you were at the top of your game for progression content. Trying to make "numbers" in a random High-Level (not even Expert!) dungeon is dumb.

 

Even in Expert dungeons, I'm usually just in there to cap my Poetics, so I'm usually just on autopilot. It's just a thing I feel I need to do, but not give my full attention to. So if someone started calling out numbers and how much X or Y should be doing, I'd make a call of my own and put up for a votekick.

 

... Though, someone DID mention I was out-DPSing the DPS on my SCH once in a Qarn HM run, which amused me a little.

[Sounsyy]

I will sometimes parse non-Coil content (experts, ST) to track my performance. If I'm on WAR I'm always tracking my damage as a STR WAR, trying to practice maximizing my damage while tanking. I do a lot of roulettes on my SCH as well and I like trying to push my dps while healing, especially in a situation where dps is low or the party setup is not optimal for big pulls but tank big pulls anyways. I don't get to play BRD as much as I did during SCOB, so when I get the chance to play it, I like to see I can still pull good numbers.

 

All that said, I'm using it for my own benefit. If I beat a dps in dps as WAR or SCH, mission complete! Honestly, if someone's dps is so low that it's actually affecting the party's progression, youdon't need a parser to see that.

 

What is fun, is when someone gives me shit in dungeon or ST for being a STR WAR, I can have my own proof that I'm pulling down the damage I know I can.

[Melkire]

The only time damage meters matter is when the DPS is too low. The only time the DPS being too low matters is when failing to meet or surpass soft/hard enrage timers. Meeting or surpassing soft/hard enrage timers requires pushing phases faster.

 

The only times pushing phases faster is even remotely a necessity are the primals, later Coil turns, and a few outlying cases such as Madison from Sastasha HM, and even then, as Sounsyy pointed out, it's ridiculously easy to tell when DPS is too low and/or slacking. No need for a parser for that.

 

Q.E.D., if you're not in endgame content (EX or Coil) and someone's trying to justify chewing you out based on what a parser is telling them, they're probably an asshole.

 

 

 

Mini-rant: if you kill the add during the Midgardsormr boss fight and then not activate the generator in time (as in, not one person bothered to try to hit the button), wiping us to the arena-wide AoE, and the tank (myself, in this case) then asks whether we're going to hit the button this time around or if he should bail, eat a 30min penalty, and come back with a group who will hit the button... that tank is not a "diva," nor are they a "whiny bitch ass," and I'm oh so sorry that I decided to need on the Varlet's Haubergeon that dropped for seals. Maybe, if you want that piece of gear so bad, you should suck it up and play the "whiny bitch ass diva" role and experience what it's like for others to blatantly waste your time.

[Kage]

It is indeed painfully obvious when the dps is low in dungeon content. But the meter use was mentioned so I assume that someone actually said "lol i'm pulling X numbers / why the fuck are you doing x numbers?"

 

 

 

I had to run with a tank in WoD who insisted on making the entire raid move with him when Cerberus moved a bit. No, please, keep the position consistent (he does move back and this way no one else gets hurt if the tank suddenly fucking moved right next to you while he guy is turned away and either charges/cleaves everyone and debuffs you. It's annoying.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Some others heard about this. I was Scholaring for a friend's tower run, in WoD. And a grumpypants blew their load on me because I asked them (and then got upset): why did you use return?

 

History:

The bard was new? Maybe? He said he was after he died or caused others to die in the first boss so we started to explain the fights. I don't know, I must have raised parts of the alliance a bit so my raise macro goes off

"Like a leaf in the wind . Time to get up !"  (Sorry Wash)

The bard dies in Cerberus on the second stomach set. He had gone into the pool and/or was sucked in before mini and died. He uses return; I know this because my swiftcast is up and the guy is alive with no weakness and not in the area. I shrug it off cause the boss is almost dead. Don't say a word. No one does.

 

Then comes Cloud of Darkness.

He dies in the first 30 seconds of the fight and once again in the middle of my raise he uses return. The following dialogue:

Me: why did you use return?

him: do not hear your complaints

him: or your "jokes"

a little time dealing with the mini clouds "dps race"

Me: wow grumpypants

Me: wtf crawled up your asshole

him: just leave me alone

(I should have dropped it here but now i'm upset because during this WoD run most of the other two tanks drop so then my tank becomes MT -and- we have to really push the mini cloud races)

Me: you don't have to be here if you don't want to be. you can leave

Him: F U C K  Y O U

 

Note: We never even said anything about his deaths before hand, we never said anything such as 'why the fuck did you die to that bard?'. The only ever time someone directly addressed him other than to explain the fights was "hey -brd- you need to leave the aoe so the rooted person doesn't die".

 

In fact, we'd all been having a pretty good laugh when someone mistook the launch pads for the pad you have to step on during the Atomos boss.

Person: oh gdi

Me: what? oh, mistook the pad?

Person: yeah

other person: LOL

me: it's ok i've done it before

other person: me too lol

 

All I can think of that set the bard off was that he was SUPER SALTY ABOUT MY MACRO T_T Seriously annoying to just have a person go return for no fucking reason. (He died in Cloud because of the particle beam wrecking him at <5k hp)

[Melkire]

"Like a leaf in the wind . Time to get up !"  (Sorry Wash)

 

Too soon. :cry:

 

(two decades would still be too soon)

[Kage]

"Like a leaf in the wind . Time to get up !"  (Sorry Wash)

 

Too soon. :cry:

 

(two decades would still be too soon)

One of the things I can think of is just that the guy is -suuuper mad- I referenced Wash's death in my raise macro.

 

But it's really just... me wishing i could raise him. :cry:

 

If it's the macro, man he would totally hate my friend. Their macro is "ARISE CHICKEN"

[Chris Ganale]

Mini-rant: if you kill the add during the Midgardsormr boss fight and then not activate the generator in time (as in, not one person bothered to try to hit the button), wiping us to the arena-wide AoE, and the tank (myself, in this case) then asks whether we're going to hit the button this time around or if he should bail, eat a 30min penalty, and come back with a group who will hit the button... that tank is not a "diva," nor are they a "whiny bitch ass," and I'm oh so sorry that I decided to need on the Varlet's Haubergeon that dropped for seals. Maybe, if you want that piece of gear so bad, you should suck it up and play the "whiny bitch ass diva" role and experience what it's like for others to blatantly waste your time.

 

Not to disagree or anything on this point because "if you want the gear so bad, play the role" is the only reason why I queue t2 as BLM anymore, but similar to this is the cases where I've been in a raid (WoD in this case) and been on the class I wanted upgrades for (BLM) only to have another BLM who was in full Ironworks augmented roll need on a drop (I forget what it actually was now, may have been the hat?) that would have been a boost in gear for me. Seeing that utterly infuriates me. It's not that fucking hard to check gear of other people sharing your role and be a decent fucking human being.

[Enla]

Mini-rant: if you kill the add during the Midgardsormr boss fight and then not activate the generator in time (as in, not one person bothered to try to hit the button), wiping us to the arena-wide AoE, and the tank (myself, in this case) then asks whether we're going to hit the button this time around or if he should bail, eat a 30min penalty, and come back with a group who will hit the button... that tank is not a "diva," nor are they a "whiny bitch ass," and I'm oh so sorry that I decided to need on the Varlet's Haubergeon that dropped for seals. Maybe, if you want that piece of gear so bad, you should suck it up and play the "whiny bitch ass diva" role and experience what it's like for others to blatantly waste your time.

 

Not to disagree or anything on this point because "if you want the gear so bad, play the role" is the only reason why I queue t2 as BLM anymore, but similar to this is the cases where I've been in a raid (WoD in this case) and been on the class I wanted upgrades for (BLM) only to have another BLM who was in full Ironworks augmented roll need on a drop (I forget what it actually was now, may have been the hat?) that would have been a boost in gear for me. Seeing that utterly infuriates me. It's not that fucking hard to check gear of other people sharing your role and be a decent fucking human being.

It's why I always check gear when running T4 or T2 or lower level things, if the other person is really new, at level, or just barely better gear, I assume they haven't gotten it before and will roll greed. i130? I will more than likely greed just to be nice since glamours are a thing, but otherwise I will need it since i assume they're doing the same since more often than not I'm only there for glamours in the first place.

 

Edit: WOW. THOSE SPELLING ERRORS. I'm so sorry for that...

[Chris Ganale]

Yeah that's what I run the first four (-stares daggers at t2-) for. Every time another caster queues in, I just sigh and resign myself to not getting the coat again. Assuming it ever drops. Which it doesn't. Ever.

 

Back on point, since both Tahz and Chao are typically well above the gear levels dropped in dungeons and stuff, very rarely do I need. I greed if I want to throw something away for seals to be polite to other people in the group who AREN'T the job I'm running in case they want it for any reason. And if someone specifically requests an item, I don't f'in roll on it.

[Ha'uruh Nunh]

Dear White Mage in Halatali,

 

You're wearing a bathing suit glamour and wielding a Nirvana.  I understand Halatali Normal Mode is therefore beneath you, but you should really pay enough attention to cure the GLD tank when he's being beaten to death by every single pack.  You CAN sling a cure before he hits 100 HP.  He's only level 20 and he's trying very hard.

 

Love,

 

Your THM (who is tanking most of the time anyway)

[Altitis Acquired]

Yesterday, I ran a dungeon where the Tank was apparently high, because he would pause 5 times, saying "Wait... Bong hits." ...

 

... REALLY?! I have to WAIT FOR YOU because you decided to get HIGH while playing FFXIV?!

 

I already have little to no respect for those who smoke weed, get drunk or take drugs, and now those people are affecting MY playtime with a game! Screw that shit!

[Enla]

Had a healer during T2 today who literally could not deal with the fact that most DF groups these days automatically go for the enrage method. This person was kitted out to the MAX, had a zeta and everything, and still rather than wait they decided to bum rush the boss and hope that others would follow at 5-7 Clicks... Whelp, everyone just stood there with their mouths open as the gateway sealed and this scrawny healer was laid waste to by the ADS. What do they do immediately after dying and the gates unlock? DQ entirely. I only noticed after the fact that they had done almost nothing the whole dungeon, because it was harder to heal than it should have been for dual healers leading up to the ADS phase.

I get accidentally queueing, believe me I do, but please if you're in the instance either see it through to the end or tell people it was an accident and leave... By waiting till the last boss we didn't have enough time for another healer to queue in for the fight, and I had to heal it myself. Which I'm capable of apparently, if I remember not to accidentally spam Cure 3 instead of Medica next time, but it was unnecessary stress.

[Kellach Woods]

The only places I've seen damage meters used in FFXIV was in a WoD raid and it was mentioned as an afterthought, letting us compare numbers and see how we did. The point for damage meters - from what I recall from raiding in WoW - was to make sure you were at the top of your game for progression content. Trying to make "numbers" in a random High-Level (not even Expert!) dungeon is dumb.

 

Nah in WoW the point was just a way to make people feel like shit and showcase epeen.

 

In FFXIV it's just a way to say "I am a giant tool who isn't aware/does not care that Square isn't supporting add-ons and am just risking a 3-day ban for being a giant tool."

 

The ORIGINAL point of these add-ons was just to add functionality to the game by gathering all the combat data into one easily digestible metric so you can break down the fights easier (e.g. : moving phase during a fight = dips in DPS for non-melee). They were just heavily misused because the general MMO playing population needs some serious lessons in interacting with other human beings on the internet.

[Wild Card]

In FFXIV it's just a way to say I am a giant tool who isn't aware/does not care that Square isn't supporting add-ons and am just risking a 3-day ban for being a giant tool."

Or, you know, because maybe ppl don't like carrying someone who doesn't know even the most basic shit about the job he's playing.

[cherrybomb]

I'm still reeling a little bit because of the tank I had in a Stone Vigil run not long ago; an un-jobbed GLD with no shield who was pretty much magnetically attracted to any and all AoEs. I was so bewildered by the experience, I couldn't even bring myself to get mad. He was new to the dungeon so I don't thiiink he was trolling? but it definitely seemed like our questions/advice were falling on deaf ears. It took about six wipes and a "nice heals, lol" comment from him to get anyone to actually initiate a votekick, and even then I still felt weirdly guilty about it.

 

If he manages to get past this point without learning what's up, I'm sure story Garuda will be A Fun Experience for anyone who lands themselves in his group.