The Vent Tent - Poor PuGs and Other Terrible Tales

[Aaron]

Better to wait in queue than get either.

Now you're just being pessimistic.

 

Sort of. I'd rather wait for a run full of people trying than instantly get one full of people who aren't. I've been a grump more than usual lately, though. Anytime someone -could- be doing something to help a run go faster and isn't, and if I notice it, it gets on my nerves just a little bit. Lately I've had no nerves left.

 

I return to my original argument: If you don't want to do something, don't saddle yourself to three/seven other people who do.

Aha but what if the majority of the party is casual too!

 

A trick question this is. /interlocks fingers

[Warren Castille]

Better to wait in queue than get either.

Now you're just being pessimistic.

 

Sort of. I'd rather wait for a run full of people trying than instantly get one full of people who aren't. I've been a grump more than usual lately, though. Anytime someone -could- be doing something to help a run go faster and isn't, and if I notice it, it gets on my nerves just a little bit. Lately I've had no nerves left.

 

I return to my original argument: If you don't want to do something, don't saddle yourself to three/seven other people who do.

Aha but what if the majority of the party is casual too!

 

A trick question this is. /interlocks fingers

 

Take 30 minute time-out, play Dark Souls.

 

Edit: Worth noting, I generally don't drop dungeons regardless of how long these things takes. I just bitch about it on linkshells and in here. TIME IS MONEY, FRIEND.

[Aaron]

You were supposed to anime gasp and internal monologue about a answer that was so important it caused you to sweat. . .

 

Now I'm not sure how to reply. Fuck you Warren.

[Caspar]

Better a lazy one than a bad one.

In a game like this where execution of basic mechanics is easy and barely more than a matter of reading a few tooltips, they are effectively the same.

[S'imba]

If I'm being lazy and it's making another party member having to work harder to pick up the slack as a result then that's a problem. If I'm doing 50% of the entire party's dps because someone's being lazy that's unacceptable. I'm pretty certain as a drk that I could call myself mediocre at best. Which means I shouldn't queue for Thordan at i115 and be at the top of the dps charts. 

I tend to ask myself whether the reason we made it through the dungeon is did I mitigate damage acceptably or did the healer carry my ass? I want to prove that drk can match up to the other tanks when I queue. I shouldn't be hearing things like "wow a drk that actually uses cooldowns." 

 

Really I'd rather have someone who's trying to learn than someone too lazy to give a damn. Especially if I have to pick up the slack of that person. But that's just me, some people just don't want to care. Though I feel it kind of ruins credibility in threads like this whenew someone vents but then half asses their way through dungeons.

[Jana]

I can't help but notice the Monk who doesn't use Dragon Kick ever, even on bosses.

 

My heart is breaking...! Unless we were Double Dragon MNKing it up and I was handling it, ID call that dude out.

 

Then again, I've had runs where I/an FC mate has been kicked for stuff as innocent as asking the other DPS to use more AoEs, and it's infuriating. Pugs are simply not trustworthy enough to be worth the effort.

[lunoc]

As a Monk, I always just alternate between both combos from their proper positions. I know the buffs and debuffs are good, but I don't even think about them. 

 

The attacks do good enough damage on their own, and my timing of reapplying them might be somewhat inefficient, but I don't even need to think about what they do. I'm doing damage and applying buffs constantly.

 

My biggest failing is probably forgetting Touch of Death, but I think one of the last things I did before I stopped playing last was put Touch of Death on face buttons instead of a dpad so I'd incorporate it into my rotation better. 

 

Honestly, FFXIV has spoiled me, it has the best controller support of pretty much every MMO I've ever played. I can't go back to KB+M now. Having buttons in specific places rather than a big cloud of letters and numbers is so much more intuitive for my poor brain to handle.

[Kage]

I can't help but notice the Monk who doesn't use Dragon Kick ever, even on bosses.

 

My heart is breaking...! Unless we were Double Dragon MNKing it up and I was handling it, ID call that dude out.

 

Then again, I've had runs where I/an FC mate has been kicked for stuff as innocent as asking the other DPS to use more AoEs, and it's infuriating. Pugs are simply not trustworthy enough to be worth the effort.

When I MNK for things, especially duty roulettes, it makes me cry inside when other Melee absolutely refuse to AOE T_T

[Valence]

I have stopped using Touch of Death most of the time. You just barely have the time to execute 2 standard rotations between every Dragon Kick/Twin Snakes refresh in greased lightning III that Touch of Death screws that up most of the time...

 

Sometimes I take the time to apply it among the openers when I can't directly go in greased III, but well. I hate that dot.

[Warren Castille]

I'm not how much the meta has changed since then, but I believe it was around the time of either second or third coil that a raid-caliber Monk parsed on a dummy.

 

Including Touch of Death stuck him at 407 DPS.

Ignoring Touch of Death stuck him at 402 DPS.

 

It's safe to skip 99.9% of the time. It takes a full 30 seconds to get the damage across, so if an enemy dies before (I think?) 27s of those ticks land you lose DPS compared to just punching something with a normal attack.

 

Citation: Napkin math and selective memory for a job I don't play

[Caspar]

My typical rotation depends on the duration of the fight and its mechanics. 

For instance it may be prudent to add ToD to rotations in fights with down time, as was the case back in Garuda EX. I would actually apply Fracture too. Along with that, Meditating when forced to not hit the boss and changing your Perfect Balace and Tornado Kick help as well.

 

Usually I just alternate between rotations and my opener is the only weird thing I do. In a fight which is long with no downtime, using ToD will only make you run out of TP in the long run but it is useful when you can't be on the target 100% of the time.

[Melkire]

Top DPS parses for MNK (read: optimal output) involve slapping a target with Demolish, Touch of Death, and Fracture while Dragon Kick and Twin Snakes are both running. You perform even better if someone pads your DPS (the way they do on ffxivlogs) by applying DK for you as a slave so you can Critshine 100% of the time.

 

Critshines, True Strikes, Snap Punch, offensive GCDs like Blood for Blood and Internal Release, all of that is par for the course but really when you look at MNK what you're looking at is "(de)buffs are up, DoTs are up" which amounts to the aforementioned.

 

Of the DoTs, Demo takes priority, then ToD, then Fracture. And Fracture is such a minuscule addition to DPS in exchange for increased difficulty in TP management that it's not recommended unless you're progression raiding and you REALLY need to eke out every hit point of damage you can.

 

ToD is a total potency of 270 if the DoT ticks to completion. If you ignore criticals on Bootshine and True Strike, that's more potency than every single-target weaponskill a MNK has with the exceptions of Demolish (420 from rear; 380 otherwise), Tornado Kick (330), and Forbidden Chakra (320). So unless you can guarantee a crit (which only really happens with Bootshine-from-rear) or are otherwise anticipating crits from IR, ToD delivers more potency than everything in the standard rotation.

 

tl;dr: ToD is standard for optimal MNK DPS on a high-HP target. Fracture is the optional weaponskill, not ToD. If you're just burning trash, you're hitting Rockbreaker, Howling Fist, and Elixir Field while spreading DK and Demo with upkeep on Twin... there's barely enough room in there for ToD unless party DPS is really low.

 

 

Citation: the DPS class/job that I main and make it my business to know.

[Aedan Marceaux]

Melkire beat me to it, but a quick google search provided much the same info: ToD is still to be used.

 

For posterity and fun-ness:

http://i.imgur.com/6XMaU17.png

 

http://angered.guildwork.com/forum/threads/55d79980002aa82d01139a52-heavensward-monk-guide-by-akame

[Warren Castille]

I am now glad I mentioned I was maybe not remembering correctly from three to four raid tiers ago.

[Caspar]

Hm really? I used it typically, but our bard played so little and padded BLM numbers so aggressively that I would always bottom out early if I overused ToD. But it's true that in all content where I know that won't be a problem, I always keep it up.

 

That's certainly different than how I remember. In my absence from raids I must be growing sloppier.

[111]

I am horrible at rotations :c

 

I can barely keep up a PLD one. 

 

Thankfully PLD do pretty good DPS these days  though.

[Aaron]

If I'm being lazy and it's making another party member having to work harder to pick up the slack as a result then that's a problem. If I'm doing 50% of the entire party's dps because someone's being lazy that's unacceptable. I'm pretty certain as a drk that I could call myself mediocre at best. Which means I shouldn't queue for Thordan at i115 and be at the top of the dps charts. 

I tend to ask myself whether the reason we made it through the dungeon is did I mitigate damage acceptably or did the healer carry my ass? I want to prove that drk can match up to the other tanks when I queue. I shouldn't be hearing things like "wow a drk that actually uses cooldowns." 

 

Really I'd rather have someone who's trying to learn than someone too lazy to give a damn. Especially if I have to pick up the slack of that person. But that's just me, some people just don't want to care. Though I feel it kind of ruins credibility in threads like this whenew someone vents but then half asses their way through dungeons.

Just got off work so I'm replying to whatever lol.

 

Don't care what anyone really does myself, just want to clarify something. Not saying you are implying it but just addressing a quick point that caught my attention.

 

"Though I feel it kind of ruins credibility in threads like this whenew someone vents but then half asses their way through dungeons."

 

 

If I'm half assing my way through a dungeon, and I still wound up having to save an overpulling dps who thinks he can put every enemy all the way to the first boss of Saint Artowtfever and then shadewalker me or a cleric dancing healer that thinks they can dps a totally different mob because I'm not already just hanging around 10 hp (because I'm a swell motherfucker and 9/10 don't mind doing a little extra if I absolutely have to when I'm being lazy) then I reserve the right to vent about bad parties after anyway because the inherent fault wasn't because I didn't salt that one mob or pop a dark dance.

[Delilah Scythewood]

I hate tanking as a PLD so much. So, so, so much. I just...uuuuggghhhh. I can never keep aggro and I spam all the necessary abilities and my gear isn't bad either. I'm only level 37 or so BUT STILL.

 

Mrrgl mrrgl grump grump grump.

[Warren Castille]

It gets better with Shield Oath. Paladin's a fucking nightmare between 30 and 40.

[Delilah Scythewood]

It gets better with Shield Oath. Paladin's a fucking nightmare between 30 and 40.

The nightmare is real. The nightmare is oh so real. Qarn was a clusterfuck.

[Warren Castille]

The more time goes by, the more I feel secure in thinking anyone with a Mentor tag in a leveling dungeon is going to be an asshole or an idiot.

 

Looking at you, MCH who insisted on using LB ASAP in Cutter's Cry over your newbie-budded MNK counterpart. Also, please learn how to use reload and your DoT. Shame on you for being 60 and having no fucking clue how to play the class.

[Aaron]

Lmao the fate grinded players.

[Warren Castille]

It's sad how quickly the Mentor Flag became an icon people think means they're special instead of, you know, people who want to be mentors. There was a sprout in the dungeon for fuck's sake, and rather than asking/telling them to use LB, they'd just pop their raygun as soon as the gauge filled.

 

There should be a written exam or something. :evil:

[111]

I meannnnnnnnnnnn

 

Honestly I just don't give a shit 90% of the time in dungeons. Sometimes people just wanna watch anime and spam a few buttons.

 

Though that 10% of the time I try to speed run it and get under 20 minutes. I'm sorry pug healers. I get in moods ok. I'll buy you a cake sometime.

[Warren Castille]

If you're not a melee and you're in a group with a melee and you pop LB the second the chime sounds, you're an asshole. That's all, really. If you're a "mentor" while in a group with a new player and you do it, you're a larger, more gaping asshole.